Thread: Tdk vs Avengers
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Old 08-18-2013, 09:00 PM   #96
Shikamaru
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Default Re: Tdk vs Avengers

Quote:
Originally Posted by DACrowe View Post
And you're calling TDK pretentious?

It more than elevates it; it captures why Batman has been so popular for so many decades while simultaneously making it current to the time it was made in (post-9/11 Bush Years paranoia). And is far more than the Joker. I will take its portrayal of Bruce Wayne, Harvey Dent and Jim Gordon's triumvirate any day over the Avengers cracking wise. And I loved Whedon dialogue when it is cracking wise.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DACrowe View Post
I would rather have a film that embraces the true essence of the character and its real genre (i.e. Batman is crime, Spidey is teen/young adult melodrama, X-Men is social allegory, etc.) than one that assumes because it is based on a comic book it is all about bright colors and extravagant costumes.

Don't get me wrong. Avengers worked very well for what it was. But I guarantee you that Whedon will not make that same movie again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmc View Post
Pretentious means something that thinks itself to be of greater importance than it actually is. It was never the film makers intention to make a movie that was trying to see itself as important, it was simply to make the best possible Batman movie they could. Just because a film asks it audience to pay attention and takes the subject matter seriously doesn't mean it thinks itself to be pretentious, how is it any different to what comic book writers do? Not every superhero comic is a continual run of splash page action scenes mixed in with some witty dialog. Some of them go pages and pages without action and are entirely dialog focused and require you to pay attention. What's the difference? One's an illustration? Because it's not as 'fun'? I don't recall every comic book story I've read to be 'fun'. If you don't like engaging storytelling and just want an easy fun ride, that's fine, but don't make out TDK is trying to be something it isn't, all it did was take a concept and do something different with it. Those who say it elevated the genre came from the people watching it, not the film makers, don't mistake the two. Not your cup of tea? Fine, but don't make out there's only one way to do superheroes, you're ignoring the very medium these characters are based on if you think that way. You say Avengers is proud to be a superhero movie - I agree, but if you think it shows off the best quality of what's in comic books you're sadly mistaken because the one thing good comic books have that Avengers doesn't is a story.
Brilliant posts are brilliant . I was going to respond saying essentially the same thing but you guys have beaten me to it.

There is no such thing as a "comic book genre" nor is there such a thing as "embracing" the comic book genre or "elevating it". Comics are a medium just like everything else. The Dark Knight is just as valid of a comic book movie as The Avengers is. To say that TDK is an invalid comic book movie just because it's not "fun" and doesn't have colorful costumes is ludicrous. People are simplifying comic books and comic book movies with statements such as those - simplifying them to just colorful men in tights fighting "the bad guys". Not only does this false generalization make any superhero films that lack the Avengers style/tone appear as invalid, but it also makes many Vertigo books and films appear as invalid comic books/comic book movies. By the same logic of TDK not being a true/proud CBM, stuff like Y: The Last Man, The Walking Dead, Hellblazer and Preacher are all invalid comics that are not "proud" of being a comic.

So many comic book fans often point fingers to the general audience and accuse them of bias towards other CBM's yet they often do the same thing. There is a pretentiousness and close-mindedness to this that makes me wonder, if the fans aren't going to accept comics for all that they are and close them all off to a genre and to a specific tone, then why should anyone from outside the medium take comics seriously at all? The apparent fans do not.

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