View Single Post
Old 09-14-2013, 03:01 PM   #109
Shikamaru
Side-Kick
 
Shikamaru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,817
Default Re: Batman Begins v.s The Dark Knight Rises

Quote:
Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises View Post
Option A isn't really an option. It's more like Option C...Bane took this extreme seed of an idea, and figured out the logistics of how to actually pull it off.

Being the commander of a small army (which Bane was on a day to day basis) is far more than "just muscle" no matter which way you slice it.

Bane was the director. Talia was more of an executive producer, so to speak.
Option C still hurts me on the inside a bit because it would mean Bane sat down with Talia, listened to what she wants to do and why she wants to do it (which, as I said, made no sense whatsoever in the film), and then said "Yeah, great idea! I'll come up with the best way to execute that."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Wooden Alligator View Post
Talia's plan was pretty straightforward:accomplishing her father's goal for Gotham at any cost. Even facing death at the hands of the US Army (Likely detonating the bomb in the process) or escaping before the bomb went off. Bane's the reason Talia was able to put her plan into motion. First, he saved her life in the Pit. Then, later, he got her out of Crane's clutches. Granted, you could call that part of her plan reckless. Being caught and taken to a courtroom with the honorable judge Crane presiding. If Bane thought she was a liability, he could've kept silent and let her attempt the ice.
Talia's plan was retarded and made no sense. Both her motivations and reasons for doing what she did made no sense whatsoever.

Her motivation was "I hated my father until you killed him." That makes no sense whatsoever and based on her entire backstory, she has way more reasons to want revenge/be pissed on her father than on Batman himself (abandoning her and her mother, treating her closest friend (Bane) like a monster, excommunicating her closest friend from the LOS because he loved her, etc.).

Her reasons made even less sense. "I will fulfill my father's destiny". My theory is that she left with Bane when he was excommunicated instead of staying with the LOS, since she clearly didn't know her father or what the LOS stood for. She's clearly not aware of the fact that the LOS' job is to destroy corrupt cities. At this point, Gotham was no longer a corrupt city so there was no valid reason as to why the LOS would target it. You can't argue that it only appeared as clean due to the Dent coverup because Bane/Talia only found out about the coverup once they got to Gotham....after they started to put their plan in effect. The fact that she refers to destroying Gotham as her "father's destiny" and the fact that she was going to destroy herself with it only further shows how clueless she is about the LOS. Destroying Gotham was not Ras' "destiny". He was not going to destroy himself with it. Gotham was just the next city on his list. Once he destroyed it, he would have moved on to the next corrupt city.

Also, how were Bane and Talia going to prove to Bruce that Gotham is still "beyond saving" and that "underneath" it's still just as corrupt as it was before? By forcing out the worst in people? No. By revealing that Gotham is only clean now due to a dirty lie? No (they weren't aware of Harvey's actions until they came to Gotham plus they were already aware Bruce knew that). So how? By taking the city hostage, trapping all of the cops, breaking all of Blackgate's prisoners and unleashing all of them on the streets. That's how they "proved" that Gotham can be just as corrupt as before and to then use that as an excuse to blow it up.

So to recap, her motivation makes no sense, her logical way of thinking makes no sense, and she is completely clueless about her father's philosophy as well as for what the LOS stood for. On top of that, she is very cocky and a "female dog" especially after the reveal, which makes you have a strong passionate hatred for her (not a flaw with the film since there's nothing wrong with including those types of characters in your story, but just pointing that out).

Also note that the LOS never appears in the film, only Talia and Bane claiming that they are the LOS. One can make the case that Talia is a complete disgrace to the LOS and that the real LOS was out there during the events of TDKR and was facepalming at what Talia was doing (seriously).

As for Bane saving Talia from Crane, I got the impression Bane/his mercenaries appointed Crane to be the judge thus they would stop Crane from killing Talia.


Last edited by Shikamaru; 09-14-2013 at 03:16 PM.
Shikamaru is offline