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Old 11-03-2013, 04:09 AM   #36
Batmannerism
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Default Re: Thor (from TDW) vs Superman (from MOS) who wins in a fight, and why ?

I posted this in the other thread, to rebut your comparative strength hypothesis. But I thought I'd repost it, as it addresses your points here.

Don't take this personally, you're doing a great job of arguing on the Thunder God's behalf. But I seriously think that the strength angle
is not the best way to go.

You said earlier....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigThor View Post
I liken everyone being enamored by MOS Supes strength feats to people going with flashy knock out guys like Tyson/Pacquiao over the Ali/Weather type fighters.

Yes MOS Supes was strong, but did he really do much in the film that Thor couldn't do? Let's not forget that Thor caught and overpowered a punch from Hulk, now it doesn't sound like much but take into account this was the same arm that stopped that space whale in it's tracks. Now I know it wasn't as gratuitously flashy as punching someone through a building or any of the other stuff MOS Supes did but it's just as big when you think about it. A blow from Hulk has more tonnage behind it than that oil tanker Supes caught, the diesel he threw in the power lines, or most of the other things MOS Supes lifted.

The only feat I don't see Thor being able to do is resisting and powering through that gravity ray from that terraforming machine. So in essence while MOS Supes may "seem" lot stronger than MCU Thor their strength level are lot closer than you guys think. MOS was directed by Zack Snyder OF COURSE he's going to have more testosterone fueled strength feats than most other CBM, but that shouldn't cloud anyone's judgement on this matter. To be honest MOS Supes is nowhere near as strong as Donner's Superman, as a matter of fact he's far and away the weakest on film Superman yer.

Dude ! That's the Spirit! While I utterly disagree, I respect your opinion totally.

personally, I reckon that arguing based on physical strength is probably not going to win Thor the fight, because obviously Superman is stronger than Thor. I reckon arguing along the fighting skills, strategy and experience is a better path for you Asgard-i-fans.

- Yes, Thor blocked a punch from the Hulk, but (and I'm speaking from experience) if you do it right, you can block a punch from someone
much stronger than yourself, it's mostly about angles.
And if it really had that much force behind it, it would have driven Thor through the floor (at least MOS got the physics right on that one, that even though Supes could hold up the oil rig tower, the beams he was standing on couldn't).

(space whales...hmmm, iron man took one out from the inside, and he's just a guy in a suit, Thor nearly kicked his ass -Supes certainly would, so maybe the old space whales weren't so tough. )

- What's Thor's greatest feat of strength ? Nam Ek throws a locomotive at Supes from about half-a mile away (which means Supes could probably do the same), not sure we've seen Thor do anything like that. Sure, he's a heavy hitter, but we don't see him lifting anything remotely as big as Supes can.

(and on the invulnerability front, Zod dishes out way more punishment than Kurse, who nearly killed Thor by chucking him into a hill and hitting him with a boulder, Zod hit Supes with a Sattelite and knocked him through four skyscrapers. Thor may have fallen 30,000 feet, but I seem to recall him bursting out of the cage before impact, it took him a little while to get up and find his hammer CF Supes and Zod fell from Earth's orbit -although they would have had to slow their descent significantly otherwise Metropolis would have been vaporized on impact, but anyway re-entry beats 30,000 feet )

So, it's not that Supes seems stronger than Thor, he is stronger, end of story.
True, he's nowhere near Donner's Superman (which is great, I love the way he has to grunt and strain to do stuff like fly up the gravity beam or lift the oil rig, or whenever he exerts himself - I like it because it means it isn't easy for him, and that fits more with a 21st century Superman. Reeve made it look easy back in 1978, but that was 25 years ago, times have changed.

Okay, I digress. So, I feel I have refuted your arguments in respect of the comparative strengths of Thor and Superman.

However, there are many, many real life instances of people beating much stronger opponents - particularly when there's a big skill difference, such as there would be between Supes and Thor. Thor is a warrior, born and trained from a young age, Clark is a .......farmer. Now MOS showed he has a wicked overhand right, but he's not particularly skilful, it's just balls to the wall.

(if you're a true Marvel fan, you might mention that Spider-Man once defeated the Juggernaut -back at the height of his powers- who is literally 10x stronger, and completely indestructible - he can go toe to toe with an enraged Hulk and not be particularly harmed, and slapped Colossus around like a child. )

so, as I've said bro, there certainly are circumstances under which Thor could defeat Supes, but come on buddy, admit it, an arm wrestle or a mere contest of strength isn't it.

As for the Asgardian dagger, that's an interesting one. Supes certainly
did get hurt by the zap from the scout-ship (although those same blasts
practically disintegrated the army jets). Remember in Thor where he says in his world magic and technology are the same thing, and Jane figures out how the Asgardian scanning machine works (in TDW), and of course the Dark Elves use high-tech guns and spaceships. As such, I reckon Asgardian weapons would probably hurt Supes, although I'd still argue he'd be able to resist them far more than Thor - especially after the beating Thor got from Kurse.


Having said that, and given your creative arguments in support of the Thunder God, I have no doubt you'll be back in no time with something
clever. You've definitely raised the bar.

Hope you enjoyed TDW, I thought it was awesome, the best
Marvel movie this year, by far.

Thanks again for making these threads so much fun !

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