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Old 11-11-2013, 08:07 AM   #33
Mjölnir
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden
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Default Re: Comparing the movies Thor and Man of Steel

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthSkywalker View Post
Did you really read what I wrote? They clearly don't go against what Krypton stood for. They did what their society breed them to do. They did exactly what Zod and the council were doing.
Yes, I read it and I didn't think it changed anything.

Jor-El training to fight in his spare time and still kicking the living crap out of Zod, who is genetically designed to be part of the military, indicates that the genetic manipulation wasn't very effective.

And how is Jor-El part of the problem on an intellectual level? He's identified the problems and he obviously has free will because he decides to act against the laws and culture of his planet. With all the right things Jor-El does it seems like his flaws must be really minor, which means that he should be able to live somewhere else without dooming the place. My point is that it's not enough to tell us how something is if they only ever show the other side.

As for having flaws on a genetic level, their genes are passed on to Kal-El so the natural birth wouldn't make him any different from them. They can't pass on genes they don't have, unless they also manipulate the genes of their son.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthSkywalker View Post
You are applying prime Silver Age Superman to MoS Superman, which makes little sense in context imo. This is a rookie Superman who is forced into a situation where he must face arguably his most fearsome opponent other then Darkseid or Doomsday. Forced into a situation where he must choice to end his race or save Earth.
That comment is also taken out of context. I said that the movie continuously chooses to go with something that makes Clark/Superman more negative than he needs to in my opinion. For him to choose not to save his father isn't sympathetic to me, regardless of the reason. Especially with the timing of the scene as he seemingly had time to act earlier. The Smallville part is just one of several points where they have him have a less than heroic aspect to his actions. I get why it happens but my point is the intent of the writers. Even when making him do that they could have had him reflect on that he put others in danger and he could have put that thought to use in the Metropolis fight. It doesn't matter if he succeeds, the intent is the important part there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Batmannerism View Post
Jor-El's fighting skills......I agree as Mjolnir said, it takes more than brains to fight. Jor-El was pretty athletic, but also he was desperate, not only was his son's future at stake, but the future of his people. Plus, he'd been planning for it, (which why his robot buddy knew when to flash Zod's goons).
I just figured with the extremely advanced genetic manipulation (which they've been using for much longer than any industry has been used on our world) that the soldiers would be extremely suited to their tasks. Like a bunch of Captain Americas. Zod doesn't just lose, he gets dominated. I don't mind the fight itself, my entire point is about show vs tell in the Krypton scene.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Batmannerism View Post
Regardless, for whatever reason Jor-El and Lara didn't leave Krypton, it's a key part of the Superman mythos, and it just has to play out that way. I'm not sure you can pick that one apart, it's a bit like saying why didn't the Waynes just go out the main exit of the theatre ?
Of course they need to stay there, but I think you can write better reasons as for why they do. There are several ways to write that so there are no question marks about it, instead of having them choose not to go for a reason that's being undermined by the rest of the script. For example, making it impossible for them to go with their son for practical reasons.

The Waynes going out the back exit isn't exactly them knowingly making a huge, life-altering decision.

As for your comment about a flaw being minor, how does that change whether you can discuss it or not? For example, your comment about Asgard sending Volstagg and Sif isn't a big point at all, but I still found it interesting to think about. I thought this was just a friendly discussion, not all serious business.

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