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Old 01-04-2014, 11:11 AM   #689
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Default Re: The TDKR General Discussion Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Originally Posted by milost View Post
Vince Gilligan and Co. are much better story tellers than Nolan and Co. That Breaking Bad documentary is proof of that and Gilligan is way more humble and open about the process than anything for TDKR or even the other two films.

It's apples and oranges. Gilligan said during the finale that a lot of the ideas they came up with were last minute decisions that happened to work out perfectly. The shooting scripts (especially during season 3) were changed up DURING shooting and actors even got a say in what they wanted to do. That's much more unique than Nolan's strict "we're adhering to the final script, that's all" (which I think is BS personally).

Knowing Walt's final moment in your head for 4 additional seasons is a lot different than supposedly knowing Bruce Wayne's journey. Especially when your character has cancer, is described as having a "Scarface downfall" since it's conception, and is on a crash course for death. Besides, Breaking Bad doesn't have one "main character" during it's run, but several. Jesse, Skylar and even Walt Jr. had different original fates all through the story process. So using Breaking Bad as an example is a stretch and TDKR is no where near the quality of Breaking Bad's writing (or the "trilogy" even though I love Begins and Dark Knight). Gilligan and his team are much more fluid and organic storytellers whereas Nolan comes off as this extreme tight ass. Their documentaries should be proof of how different the two styles are.
First of all, I completely disagree about Gilligan being a better storyteller than Nolan as they excel in two very different types of medium, as you said. Let's not forget that Gilligan himself wrote a superhero movie- Hancock, which didn't turn out too great, so Nolan easily holds his own if you weigh out their entire filmographies. Of course a TV drama and a film trilogy are apples and oranges. I mean, we're talking 50 hours difference in the amount of story. But there is a similarity there. It's the aspect of a base character arc.

Walter White was a guy on a "Scarface downfall" like you said. But he also tried to make the best of his situation with his dying actions and ended up with some semblance of "victory", which to some people came as a surprise. Ironically a lot of people have griped with BB's ending because they felt it wasn't as dark and tragic as what the series had promised. Sound familiar? To me he didn't truly fulfill the "Scarface" part of his arc until the last episode. It's Mr. Chips/slow descent into hell/avenging Scarface. There's your arc of a character. Just because Vince and co. had no idea who Todd and the Nazis were in the earlier days doesn't mean (uncle) jack about having a basic shape for Walt's arc.

For Nolan and co.- they viewed Bruce's arc as a guy thinking he can save the city via a one man war on crime, learning that it wouldn't be that simple along the way, and then finally having to close that chapter of his life.

I also still don't even know what your point is. If your point is that "Nolan seems all stiff and stuff so he obviously must be lying about having an arc in mind for Bruce from the beginning", then I really don't get that. I don't even agree, you see examples of Nolan being open to last minute tweaks and collaboration on set (like that little bit with Tom Wilkinson in the doc). Sure, you weren't pleased with the end result, but we're not arguing about quality here. We're just talking about whether this approach to storytelling is a logical fallacy or not- which you claimed it was.

And just as a little PS- Rian Johnson, who directed the very best episode of Breaking Bad (The TDK episode, the one where a lot of fans think it could've ended) is a huge professed Nolan fanatic and a TDKR defender. Boom.

Originally Posted by milost View Post
Yeah. If he had an interest in it, I bet it'd be really interesting. Hell, I wonder what he could do with a television series for Batman. Almost every episode of Breaking Bad felt cinematic, maybe a change of format could put a fresh spin on Batman in a new light.

Pipe dream though.
Ever since The Sopranos, I've been wanting something like this. A cable drama Batman series. I'm convinced it'll never happen though. WB likes Batman as their big screen commodity. I'm hoping Fox's Gotham show will be good at least though. There's some potential there.

Last edited by BatLobsterRises; 01-04-2014 at 11:50 AM.
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