View Single Post
Old 03-09-2014, 07:59 PM   #473
The Joker
The Clown Prince of Crime
The Joker's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Arkham Asylum
Posts: 49,359
Default Re: The TDKR General Discussion Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Originally Posted by shauner111 View Post
So if im in my 20s and i come up with a way of doing something but i grow older, and next thing you know im 40 and have gone through all kinds of experiences. Growth happens. Mindsets change. So im 40 and i decide to live my life in a completely new way, maybe even a new set of beliefs for example. But of course im wrong for doing so?

That would be a ridiculous thing to tell me. That im contradicting myself, whether it's true or not, is irrelevant. People grow and learn, and things have to change if you're going to grow.
Yes, in Bruce's case it's a contradiction because nothing in TDKR shows him have a change of mind about passing the mantle of Batman on, and retiring. Nothing. Unlike in TDK where you see Bruce view Harvey as a potential better symbol of hope than Batman can be, putting him to the test by getting him Lau and seeing if he can get the convictions, throwing him a fundraiser etc.

Where in TDKR do we see him have an attitude change about leaving Batman's mantle to someone else?

But Bruce DOES inspire people. Just like he wanted originally. The threat in the Nolanverse starts with organized crime, the corrupt cops. That's what he tries to change. He finally gets every cop in town on his side. They're citizens too. But there's a limit. Criminals will still roam, and not every citizen will stand up. It never will. So Batman has to keep going in some form. Even if it's not physical but as some spirit that watches over the city, reminding everyone of the Batman. But it probably WILL be physical because Blake is there incase.
Gotham City was under siege and threat of nuclear destruction in TDKR, Shauner. The Cops are the only ones you see fight along side him, and that's because they're Cops. It's their job.

The citizens of Gotham are hiding in their houses like frightened sheep. There is no inspiration from Batman to them, other than Foley getting his ass out of his house to join in helping after he turned down Gordon earlier. And he doesn't count because he's a Cop, too.

Bruce realizes that his health, and his future is more important than going out himself until he's in his 50s. He can barely do it now as it is. So he sets up a successor. His future is the most important part though. Alfred reminds him of his humanity, so does Selina.
Wrong. Bruce gets himself back into physical shape again in the pit, finds his fear again, and comes back in top fighting form.

Not once do you see him make the realization that he's passed it now as Batman.

Bruce Wayne was naive in his 20s. He thought he could fix all of Gotham, and they would all stand up. But life doesn't work that way. It's not just black and white. He grows up and learns through life experiences that there will always be criminality. They will always need some kind of inspiration even when Batman isn't around. So saving Gotham and "dying" in the process is the best way to send that message. Blake is just the insurance policy, and we dont even know if he'll actually go out there. That's actually irrelevant in the grand scheme of everything.
The only naivety Bruce had in his mission was he didn't see the repercussions to his actions as Batman coming. Namely the escalation, the Joker etc.

Leaving his Batman mantle in the hands of a rookie Cop he barely knows from Adam is the most foolish naive thing he's ever done.

So there is no problem. It comes down to people seeing a certain batman in their mind, agreeing or not agreeing with the end. Nothing more, nothing less.
It is a problem since it contradicts the mind set and philosophy of the character in the previous two movies.

"Sometimes I remember it one way. Sometimes another. If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"

- The Joker
The Joker is offline