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Old 02-18-2013, 10:17 PM   #230
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Denver
Posts: 45,670
Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man 2 General Discussion - Part 1

Originally Posted by Fox View Post
I'm sorry you feel that way. Truly.
I am going to reply to some of your blog points...

You start off the comparisons of ASM and SM1-3 with a picture of JarJar. That already tells me that the coming is going to be borderline trollolo, an obvious attempt to build up a movie that critics and the general audience agree was a mediocre movie. You can have your own opinion, that's fine, but you have nothing to reinforce that opinion to make credible.

You start off with
In order to accurately judge the show I would have to watch AT LEAST several more episodes to see how the story and characters progress. The first episode doesn't resolve the larger story because it ISN'T SUPPOSED TO. It's a series. That's the point.
Yet you continue to analyze ASM to SM1-3. You are comparing the first movie of a series to another trilogy. It's completely pointless other than to force weight upon your argument to your side. ASM is one movie. The next one can be the worst movie ever made yet you are so confident in the entire story that you yet don't know. So, the entire foundation you used to write this blog post is inherently faulty.

But, lets speak on how you think movies that have completed arcs with strands of a trilogy built in are worse than an entire movie that is basically Act I of a trilogy. First off, it's film making 101 to have acts in each movie with a climax and resolution for the main character. Look at all the great superhero movies ever made. How many of them are doing what you say you don't like for them to do? None of them. No first movie in a superhero series is such a whorish attempt by using sequel bait as ASM. Secondly, it's common sense that you make the best first film you can for hopes of potential sequels. You can't invest in a trilogy without having a solid foundation to build upon. There's a reason for that. People on here have said 'oh well this is a first'. Peter didn't learn anything in ASM. Nothing got resolved. It was a mediocre written script with dropped plot arcs and overly obvious attempts to make people come back for more. You don't go to a steakhouse and get a salad to have the owner tell you to come back tomorrow for the next course. How asinine. The Parents storyline is completely dropped once Peter goes to OSCORP and gets bitten. Uncle Ben's killer is completely forgotten once Lizard comes into the picture and isn't hinted at until the end of the friggin movie. In this movie, Peter hasn't learned a damn thing. He hasn't confronted his Uncle's killer, he hasn't confronted his parent's killer, he hasn't learned that with great power comes great responsibility. He learns absolutely nothing. That shows that the writing is mediocre to me. Dropped characters like Ratha shows that the movie was terribly edited. If this movie is such a masterfully crafted trilogy, why did they cut out Ratha's death? Why was Connor's family cut out?

Raimi rooters
continued trollolo...

J. Jonah Jameson was expertly cast (J.K. Simmons for the win) but he was two-dimensional at best,
Does he need a secret cocaine habit?

Take 'Ultimate Spider-man'
No. If you want to knock Raimi on his portrayal of JJJ, lets knock Webb for making one of the lamest villains ever, Lizard. All he wants to do is turn other people into Lizards. That was the saddest plotline they could choose from that character and yet they did. If you want to reference Ultimate comics, why not talk about Ultimate Lizard? Fwomp.

The same can be said for Robbie and Betty.
You can't have every character in a movie deeply developed. OMG why didn't they develop Stacy's wife and other kids beside Gwen. Way to go Webb.

Aunt May never really got a chance to develop into something other than a strong-yet-naive shoulder for Peter to cry on.
What did Aunt May in this one do? She was a shoulder for Peter to turn away from. TOMG excellent writing!

For instance, when Uncle Ben gives peter 'the responsibility talk' it stems (seemingly) from ONE skirmish that Pete had with Flash Thompson.
It's the exact same damn thing in this movie.

Sure Ben makes some veiled references to "those weird experiments" in Peter's room, but really there doesn't seem to be a major reason to get overly concerned about Pete's behavior (at least not that Uncle Ben would be aware of).
Peter fought Flash at school. After never doing so ever before, Ben starts to put together that Peter is changing. He has been acting weird lately. He goes straight to his room and he skips chores. Peter getting in a fight is a pretty damn big reason for Ben to be concerned of...which is the culmination of all the other weird behavior.

Your entire first paragraph about The Plot is the exact same thing in both Raimi's and Webb's first movie...combining the origin of Spider-Man with the origin of a major villain. Raimi had Goblin and Webb had Lizard. While I will agree that I wish Raimi had saved Goblin for 2 or 3, it was the first movie and you have to use an iconic villain to bring in the crowds. It's why Batman 89 used the Joker. It's why Superman 78 had Lex Luthor. It's why X1 had Magneto. All of these first movies have to go big or go home. Had this been 2001 and Webb been at the helm, it would have been the same.

The first half hour+ of the film (being bitten by the Spider, Uncle Ben's death etc.) was completely disconnected from the rest.
The first half hour of ASM (Peter investigating his parent's death and Ben's death) was completely disconnected from the rest.

The Spider? A complete accident entirely unrelated to anything to do with Norman becoming the Green Goblin.
Just like in the original comic?

But after discovering who Ben's killer is, it's a lesson that he never returns to.
It sure does in SM2.

It was a point many of my friends and a number of reviewers made about why they preferred 'Spider-man 2'.
And I guarantee you that your friends will feel the same about ASM2 compared to ASM.

As I indicated a few paragraphs ago, and in my last post (about the villains), Raimi's first film didn't really leave itself anywhere to go. By the end Peter had...

- Graduated high school? Check.
- Come into his own as a superhero with a competent handle on his powers? Check.
- Established a clear sense of purpose with all his priorities about responsibility in order? Check.
- Successfully faced off and defeated his first major villain in life or death battle? Check.
- Peter graduating High School isn't the most important thing in Spider-Man's life. I have no idea why this is a neg for SM1. More happens in Spider-Man post High School days unless you lean on USM.
- You mention Iron Man and Batman Begins being masterful stories. Both of those had the character established with a clear sense of purpose with all responsibilities in order.
- Same thing happened in ASM. Fwomp.

Stay tuned for tomorrow when I bring the other half.

"You can leave a penny, you can't take a penny. You can leave a penny anytime. You have to spend $10 to take a penny. Store policy."
"Since when has this been store policy?"
"Uh, since my boss made up the policy. You gonna pay? You're holding up my line of one other person. You can't afford your milk, step aside. What, daddy didn't give you enough milk money? Little baby gonna cry about it? Just step aside."
And that is how Uncle Ben dies.
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