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Old 07-02-2011, 08:35 AM   #1
terry78
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Default Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

And here we are again as we were back in 2009 with some discussing how Prime was a little out of character this time around. In ROTF some said he was a little too brutal and out for blood(Energon, whatever). I was having a discussion with some people on another board that was talking about it, and some had an issue with Optimus and the Autobots ploy in letting everyone think they had been destroyed, because it more or less caused the devastation in Chicago. They also took issue with him killing Megatron and Sentinel when neither was a threat. Basically this version of Optimus is a much more pragmatic leader, but compared to other iterations, is it that varied?

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Old 07-02-2011, 09:40 AM   #2
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

Someone put it to me that he'd reached his limit... He'd seen his planet ripped apart through war... his friends all dying around him.

And then his long lost mentor turns around and brutally kills one of his few remaining friends and reveals himself to be in league with the Cons....

Prime had just had enough....

The plot to show Earth what would happen if they were gone was a bit...left field... but i wonder if they expected the hell to happen that did happen when they came up with the plot

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Old 07-03-2011, 11:25 AM   #3
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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Someone put it to me that he'd reached his limit... He'd seen his planet ripped apart through war... his friends all dying around him.

And then his long lost mentor turns around and brutally kills one of his few remaining friends and reveals himself to be in league with the Cons....

Prime had just had enough....
This. It's like what John Rambo said..."When you're pushed, killing's as easy as breathing." Optimus wanted to end this war once and for all, and why shouldn't he? Optimus killing Megatron was justified because it really was Megatron's plan all along. Thousands of innocent lives were lost because of Megatron throughout the three films. There was no reason for him to live. Sentinel just joined his cause to preserve Cybertron, even though he had no plans of becoming Megatron's inferior. Still, Optimus needed to destroy him as well, if only to avenge Ironhide.

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Old 07-02-2011, 11:36 AM   #4
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

it would take them 2 minutes and lets say 5.000 dollars extra to explain why OP killed Sentinel and Megatron at the END. IRONHIDE
he died and OP had enough so he destroyed everything in hes way to end it. but they didnt do that.

some are saying that he shouldtn kill Megatron since he saved him. he didnt save him. he would kill OP.

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Old 07-02-2011, 12:46 PM   #5
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

^ Pretty much well said. After seeing all the chaos that had gone down, I think any good man or autobot for that matter would totally lose it after seeing his fellow friends get hurt and even lose their life.

I actually enjoy seeing Optimus get all heroic into the killing machine he was in ROTF and the Chicago seen in DOTM. Yeah unlike his usual character we're familiar with but makes you want to cheer him when he does that in the live action movies.

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Old 07-02-2011, 02:16 PM   #6
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

When he came back and just said "we will kill them all" I about peed myself. He was just a badass in this.

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Old 07-02-2011, 04:44 PM   #7
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

Haven't seen DOTM yet, but Prime(and the other Autobots) were too brutal in the first two movies. I don't remember them having killed even one con in G1(except for Unicron, and when Optimus Prime tries to kill Megatron, but since he failed, it doesn't count). I always saw the Autobots as robotic versions of the Justice League, and Optimus Prime as Superman. Since Superman never kills, I expected Prime not to either.

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Old 07-02-2011, 05:01 PM   #8
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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Haven't seen DOTM yet, but Prime(and the other Autobots) were too brutal in the first two movies. I don't remember them having killed even one con in G1(except for Unicron, and when Optimus Prime tries to kill Megatron, but since he failed, it doesn't count). I always saw the Autobots as robotic versions of the Justice League, and Optimus Prime as Superman. Since Superman never kills, I expected Prime not to either.
You don't? My God, between the comics, the TFTM86 and the UK stuff they killed a whole lot of those f***ers. The only reason you never saw them do it in the Cartoon was because it was G-rated. The Decepticons never killed anyone in the 'toon save for the movie. Optimus killed a ton of red shirt Decepticons in War Dawn in season 2 though.

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Old 07-03-2011, 07:25 PM   #9
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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Optimus killed a ton of red shirt Decepticons in War Dawn in season 2 though.
Thats actually debatable, thou I tend to look at it the way you do, fact is its possible those guys survived, its also possible they were drones.

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For those questioning Optimus being too brutal in these movies, just watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBUAG6Gy-to
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Funny thing is none of those guys were killed

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Old 07-03-2011, 09:47 PM   #10
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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That was Megatron's giant shotgun.
I'm talking about the original toy.
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Thats actually debatable, thou I tend to look at it the way you do, fact is its possible those guys survived, its also possible they were drones.
I don't think it's ever implied they survived, although Transformers frequently have the "I'm a robot get out of jail free card" they can pull when they are "killed". They probably were drones to be sure, but it's about as far as the cartoon could go on killing in a children's show.
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Funny thing is none of those guys were killed
After watching the movie a billion times I've always taken these as "implied non-committal deaths". The Autobots outnumber the Decepticons toy line wise, so when Optimus needed to "kill" some Decepticons they simply showed "deaths" and then didn't commit to them for the sake of the toyline...if that makes sense. Considering Hasbro wasn't discontinuing those Decepticons they couldn't be killed in great number, so they showed a few Decepticons getting shot just to balance the battle a bit.

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Old 07-03-2011, 09:59 PM   #11
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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I don't think it's ever implied they survived, although Transformers frequently have the "I'm a robot get out of jail free card" they can pull when they are "killed".
thats kind of what I'm pointing to.

We have seen a few TF's taken apart, blown apart, decapetated and so much more and still live.
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After watching the movie a billion times I've always taken these as "implied non-committal deaths". The Autobots outnumber the Decepticons toy line wise, so when Optimus needed to "kill" some Decepticons they simply showed "deaths" and then didn't commit to them for the sake of the toyline...if that makes sense. Considering Hasbro wasn't discontinuing those Decepticons they couldn't be killed in great number, so they showed a few Decepticons getting shot just to balance the battle a bit.
I cant completely agree with you there.

Just about all the Decepticons Prime shot when looking for Megatron were seen running into Astrotrain under their own power.I'm sure Hasbro intended to kill most of those characters.....but the way I see it, its obvious they didnt want their "hero" being the one that killed them.

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Old 07-02-2011, 05:11 PM   #12
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

For those questioning Optimus being too brutal in these movies, just watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBUAG6Gy-to
VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:

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Old 07-02-2011, 10:01 PM   #13
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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For those questioning Optimus being too brutal in these movies, just watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBUAG6Gy-to
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Old 07-02-2011, 05:16 PM   #14
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Old 07-02-2011, 07:47 PM   #15
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

The only time I felt OP was being brutal(not too brutal, I think OP's actions have been appropriate in all 3 movies. It's his dialogue that sounded like the Terminator lol) was when he fought Megatron, Blackout, and Starscream in RotF right before he died.

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Old 07-02-2011, 09:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

Optimus does what needs to be done, but I agree that his dialogue made him seem more brutal than he was. He isn't the kind of guy that says "Kill them all." Or rips someone's face off unnecessarily.

When he says "Megatron has to be stopped, no matter the cost.", to me it implies that Prime is ready to sacrifice himself, in order to protect everyone. But "Kill them all.", that's just too bloodthirsty.

I would have loved if they portrayed him as someone who doesn't like conflict, but can open a can of whoopass on you if he has to.

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Old 07-02-2011, 10:15 PM   #17
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

Even though Megatron saved his butt against Sentinel, he did kill him in the previous movie, he had it coming for awhile now. I do wish he wasn't killed off and they had some kind of momentary truce, though.

As for Sentinel, eff that guy, I would've done the same, too.

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Old 07-03-2011, 07:09 AM   #18
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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They also took issue with him killing Megatron and Sentinel when neither was a threat.
Megatron had it coming; he destroyed their world, nearly enslaved another, killed Optimus, and murdered many of his friends. His last words were just another bid for power. Sentinel...? If this was the cartoon, then yes, it'd be out of character. Cartoon Prime wouldn't stoop to his enemy's level. But it's not.

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Basically this version of Optimus is a much more pragmatic leader, but compared to other iterations, is it that varied?
Movie Optimus is bizarre. One moment, he's Cartoon Optimus, talking about "great compassion." The next, he's a slasher flick killer that takes faces. So yes, he's very different. Only Bay knows why that is.

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Old 07-03-2011, 07:27 AM   #19
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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Haven't seen DOTM yet, but Prime(and the other Autobots) were too brutal in the first two movies. I don't remember them having killed even one con in G1(except for Unicron, and when Optimus Prime tries to kill Megatron, but since he failed, it doesn't count). I always saw the Autobots as robotic versions of the Justice League, and Optimus Prime as Superman. Since Superman never kills, I expected Prime not to either.
No one ever dies in the cartoons. But remember, these guys are in a war. Optimus' appeal for diplomacy can only last so long.

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Optimus does what needs to be done, but I agree that his dialogue made him seem more brutal than he was. He isn't the kind of guy that says "Kill them all." Or rips someone's face off unnecessarily.

When he says "Megatron has to be stopped, no matter the cost.", to me it implies that Prime is ready to sacrifice himself, in order to protect everyone. But "Kill them all.", that's just too bloodthirsty.

I would have loved if they portrayed him as someone who doesn't like conflict, but can open a can of whoopass on you if he has to.

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Old 07-03-2011, 07:34 AM   #20
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I bet you've watched more anime than you actually realized.

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Old 07-03-2011, 04:38 PM   #21
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God damn, I hate anime.
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I bet you've watched more anime than you actually realized.
Anime? Transformers The Movie 1986 is not anime? Didn't even premiere in Japan until a year after it came out in the states. In fact the Japanese were so unaware of the plot of TFTM that their anime (the actual anime Transformers) contained characters that died in the movie, and therefore would've precluded their inclusion in Headmasters. Yeah, that scene was American.

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Old 07-03-2011, 07:37 AM   #22
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

i think the reason he says kill them all is because in the last 3 movies we saw that if you dont kill a decepticon that he can still repair himself and come back. so the only way to stop them is to kill them all.

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Old 07-03-2011, 08:33 AM   #23
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i think the reason he says kill them all is because in the last 3 movies we saw that if you dont kill a decepticon that he can still repair himself and come back. so the only way to stop them is to kill them all.
I think every time they actually went into combat in the past movies, their opponent's head was turned to scrap. They know they have only one choice during war. We know it too. We don't need Prime telling them "Kill them all."

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Old 07-03-2011, 08:29 AM   #24
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Only Voltron.

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Old 07-11-2011, 01:33 PM   #25
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Default Re: Optimus Prime's characterization (Spoilers)

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Only Voltron.
Thundercats was anime too, since its animation was done by Japanese artists. There are other series like Robotech (Macross), and older series like Astro Boy and Speed Racer that you probably didn't realize were anime to begin with, and if you watched Cartoon Network's Adult Swim then you probably saw other anime shows like Cowboy Bebop, Trigun, and Gundam MS08.

Anyway, as for the topic at hand, I think Optimus Prime had to right to kill Decepticons since technically it was for self-defense (after Decepticons were in a position to destroy the humanity), but the lines that he uttered like "We will kill them all" and to pretty much execute Sentinel Prime when he was essentially begging for his life and in a non-threatening position does made him seemed a bit...out of character. I just don't like to see the Autobots being rather helpless without Prime's presence, though; I thought they made Optimus Prime too powerful and others not enough.

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