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Old 11-20-2013, 03:40 PM   #1
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Default Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

"Obviously we sidestepped it in this movie (Man Of Steel)"

Around the 1:12:00 mark.

http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=37841

Goyer admits he wrote himself into a "corner" for the sequel. They never came up with a plan on how the 'Clark Kent' disguise could make sense in a film grounded in logic.

I wonder how they'll realistically explain it in the sequel or if they'll bother to explain it.

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Old 11-20-2013, 03:47 PM   #2
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

That's a bit too long for me to listen to, but if I had to think on it I would say like it's always been done.

The idea is that people can never realistically believe someone like Clark could be Superman. They just have to reinforce that notion so the audience can understand why that is the case.

It can be easily done like they always do it. Someone says Clark looks like Superman...then everyone starts to think about it. Clark hears them with super hearing then conveniently trips for their benefit and then everyone laughs that thought off as ridiculous.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:04 PM   #3
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Originally Posted by charl_huntress View Post
That's a bit too long for me to listen to, but if I had to think on it I would say like it's always been done.

The idea is that people can never realistically believe someone like Clark could be Superman. They just have to reinforce that notion so the audience can understand why that is the case.

In the world of "Man of Steel," the public is already aware that Kal-El has been living among humans for years with a human identity.

So everyone already knows Superman has a human identity.


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It can be easily done like they always do it. Someone says Clark looks like Superman...then everyone starts to think about it. Clark hears them with super hearing then conveniently trips for their benefit and then everyone laughs that thought off as ridiculous.
Thats usually because Reeve+Routh portrayed Clark as drastically different from Superman in mannerisms and appearance, so it was easier to swallow. even in voice. I didn't buy that Steve and Perry didn't recognize him as Superman in that final scene. The glasses alone without any of the other changes isn't a believable disguise.


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It'll be the same as how they approached it in Smallville, they play off the assumption that no one like Superman could possibly ever live among normal folk.
Smallville completely failed with the disguise. He wasn't even wearing the glasses at his own wedding in the finale. They betrayed their own logic.


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Old 11-20-2013, 04:07 PM   #4
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

longer hair. one thing i liked about returns actually.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:07 PM   #5
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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In the world of "Man of Steel," the public is already aware that Kal-El has been living among humans for years with a human identity.

So everyone already knows Superman has a human identity.




Thats usually because Reeve+Routh portrayed Clark as drastically different from Superman in mannerisms and appearance, so it was easier to swallow. even in voice. I didn't buy that Steve and Perry didn't recognize him as Superman in that final scene. The glasses alone without any of the other changes isn't a believable disguise.

Right, which is why they have to reinforce the notion that people have thought it, but that they dismissed it as ridiculous. We as the audience have be given a reason for why they can easily dismiss this.

Plus, it was obvious they didn't recognize him. The only one who did was Lois. In fact, Perry or Steve never really got a good look at Superman when he was fighting Zod. No one did. The only people who got a good look are the military.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:15 PM   #6
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Right, which is why they have to reinforce the notion that people have thought it, but that they dismissed it as ridiculous. We as the audience have be given a reason for why they can easily dismiss this.

Plus, it was obvious they didn't recognize him. The only one who did was Lois. In fact, Perry or Steve never really got a good look at Superman when he was fighting Zod. No one did. The only people who got a good look are the military.

Well if Superman is not a public figure in this universe, and just a 'Red-Blue' Blur that no one catches a glimpse at, your theory could make sense.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:18 PM   #7
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Well if Superman is not a public figure in this universe, and just a 'Red-Blue' Blur that no one catches a glimpse at, your theory could make sense.
IMO...that's the only way it could be. He's hair was a bit different and all that, but if he's around all the time then it's the perception that Clark could NEVER be Superman... That's what has to be reinforced. I don't care how they do it, but it has to be done for it to be believable.

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Old 11-21-2013, 05:11 AM   #8
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Originally Posted by charl_huntress View Post
That's a bit too long for me to listen to, but if I had to think on it I would say like it's always been done.

The idea is that people can never realistically believe someone like Clark could be Superman. They just have to reinforce that notion so the audience can understand why that is the case.

It can be easily done like they always do it. Someone says Clark looks like Superman...then everyone starts to think about it. Clark hears them with super hearing then conveniently trips for their benefit and then everyone laughs that thought off as ridiculous.
Of course, i mean, what a nerd


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Old 11-20-2013, 03:53 PM   #9
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

What realism! Glasses, A bit of slouching a bit of clumsiness but not too much and don't bring attention to yourself. Lois will cover for him when he has to go and do his superhero business.

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Old 11-20-2013, 03:55 PM   #10
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

They would not a real need to go in-depth on the explanation. Just have him act clumsy here and there and Lois could cover for him.

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Old 11-20-2013, 03:57 PM   #11
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Inb4peoplejustifythisasBvSisunplanned

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:01 PM   #12
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I'm going to call bull**** on nobody realizing Clark is Superman. Superman was the biggest thing that happened to the world and Metropolis. Maybe nobody got a good look of his face during the destruction, but later, assuming he is going to be in the public alot, someone is going to snap a picture or meet him in the effing Daily Planet. It's just biggest bull**** ever. Mehhhh.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:04 PM   #13
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I'm going to call bull**** on nobody realizing Clark is Superman. Superman was the biggest thing that happened to the world and Metropolis. Maybe nobody got a good look of his face during the destruction, but later, assuming he is going to be in the public alot, someone is going to snap a picture or meet him in the effing Daily Planet. It's just biggest bull**** ever. Mehhhh.
It's called Suspension of disbelief.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:03 PM   #14
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

It'll be the same as how they approached it in Smallville, they play off the assumption that no one like Superman could possibly ever live among normal folk.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:04 PM   #15
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

It seems in the movie the only people who really got a good look at him where the military folk. And he plainly told Swannick he grew up in Kansas. The rest of the population didn't really see him that clearly. There's absolutely no recognition from anyone at the DP when he walked in except Lois.

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It'll be the same as how they approached it in Smallville, they play off the assumption that no one like Superman could possibly ever live among normal folk.
I doubt that because it was revealed to the public at large that he already has a secret identity and HAS been living among them already. They have to go with the tradition on this...I think.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:08 PM   #16
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Inb4peoplejustifythisasBvSisunplanned
We've had this debate many times over. When Ben Affleck was announced as Batman, it was stated that this was done in January and that this sequel was planned back then, long before MOS has its first review.

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It seems in the movie the only people who really got a good look at him where the military folk. And he plainly told Swannick he grew up in Kansas. The rest of the population didn't really see him that clearly. There's absolutely no recognition from anyone at the DP when he walked in except Lois.
Exactly.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:06 PM   #17
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I don't see how they've written themselves into a corner. They just didn't really explore Clark Kent the disguise yet. We haven't really even seen how Clark Kent the disguise acts in this franchise. We just saw that he will BE.

The joke has always been that no one recognizes Clark as Superman because they don't look past how he acts as Clark. The glasses are symbolic of this.

I don't understand why fans don't get this. It's not about realism. It's never been about realism.

I would imagine we'll see this in the sequel, along with Luthor and some other trappings of the Superman mythology.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:08 PM   #18
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I don't see how they've written themselves into a corner. We haven't really even seen how Clark Kent the disguise acts in this franchise yet.

The joke has always been that no one recognizes Clark as Superman because they don't look past how he acts as Clark. The glasses are symbolic of this.

I don't understand why fans don't get this. It's not about realism. It's never been about realism.
Someone sticky this please?

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:12 PM   #19
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I don't see how they've written themselves into a corner. We haven't really even seen how Clark Kent the disguise acts in this franchise yet.

The joke has always been that no one recognizes Clark as Superman because they don't look past how he acts as Clark. The glasses are symbolic of this.

I don't understand why fans don't get this. It's not about realism. It's never been about realism.
It's more about logic. We have to believe that these characters aren't idiots. Kal needs to do something drastically different with Clark in order to make him be divergent from the public Superman identity.

He didn't really do anything with it in that last scene. No change in voice or mannerisms. No change in hair. Etc. It was hard to buy.

But given Goyer's comments here that he didn't actually plan a solution for this yet, the portrayal in that last scene made sense.

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Old 11-20-2013, 09:39 PM   #20
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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It's more about logic. We have to believe that these characters aren't idiots. Kal needs to do something drastically different with Clark in order to make him be divergent from the public Superman identity.

He didn't really do anything with it in that last scene. No change in voice or mannerisms. No change in hair. Etc. It was hard to buy.
It's not about logic, though. It's about suspension of disbelief and the beauty/inherent sadness/relevance of someone being overlooked because most people can't or don't look below the surface of a person. That's always what the concept has been about.

It has never been about LOGICALLY being able to fool people with a pair of glasses, a different hairstyle, slouching, etc.

And you can apply logic to anything. That doesn't invalidate the strength of the actual concept as a storytelling device.

As for them not doing anythng with it...Clark Kent in that final scene didn't exactly scream "Superman" to me. So I think they did "do something" with it, albeit in a more subtle sense than we're historically used to. We just haven't seen Clark's whole "plan" for blending in. Which makes sense, since that sequence is essentially just a tease to say "See, Clark has a plan for blending in".

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:32 PM   #21
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

That's why I'd like them to tone back a bit on the hyper realism. Sometimes when you introduce an element of verisimilitude you only point out how ridiculous the concepts of the story are.

Just let him be Clark. Audiences have been nitpicking about the glasses for generations, nobody cares anymore, they just accept it.

That said the Earth One Superman did a good job of this.



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Old 11-20-2013, 04:39 PM   #22
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Originally Posted by The Valeyard View Post
"Obviously we sidestepped it in this movie (Man Of Steel)"

Around the 1:12:00 mark.

http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=37841

Goyer admits he wrote himself into a "corner" for the sequel. They never came up with a plan on how the 'Clark Kent' disguise could make sense in a film grounded in logic.

I wonder how they'll realistically explain it in the sequel or if they'll bother to explain it.
This is is additional proof, although none is really needed, that Goyer really didn't put that much (or even enough) thoughts into his screenplay. The way the secret identity thing was handled in the film is simply outrageous anyways.

When you fail to properly write or at least properly introduce something that is so integral to the character, it just means that you're not the right person for the job.

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Old 11-20-2013, 04:45 PM   #23
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This is is additional proof, although none is really needed, that Goyer really didn't put that much (or even enough) thoughts into his screenplay. The way the secret identity thing was handled in the film is simply outrageous anyways.

When you fail to properly write or at least properly introduce something that is so integral to the character, it just means that you're not the right person for the job.
He also made it seem that having Lois know his secret from before he even became Superman was a cop-out, because they wouldn't know how to pull off the Clark/Superman secret with her in play.

Seems lazy to me.

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That said the Earth One Superman did a good job of this.


That's the Brandon Routh approach there. Didn't have a problem with it. It worked. He wasn't a goof like Reeve's.

Harder to do with Cavill, his jawline and hairline are a dead giveaway.

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Old 11-20-2013, 05:00 PM   #24
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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This is is additional proof, although none is really needed, that Goyer really didn't put that much (or even enough) thoughts into his screenplay. The way the secret identity thing was handled in the film is simply outrageous anyways.

When you fail to properly write or at least properly introduce something that is so integral to the character, it just means that you're not the right person for the job.
I guess the writers of Smallville we're lazy too huh? How about you write a screenplay and submit it to the WB. If they like it then we could see your Supes on screen in about 20 years. I just don't get all this hate on Goyer, like it's been said over and over he is a great idea man and he is obviously crafting a DCU on the big screen for us to enjoy. I just wish he had a hand in the Green Lantern movie, just imagine how much better that would have been.

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Old 11-20-2013, 05:07 PM   #25
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I guess the writers of Smallville we're lazy too huh? How about you write a screenplay and submit it to the WB. If they like it then we could see your Supes on screen in about 20 years. I just don't get all this hate on Goyer, like it's been said over and over he is a great idea man and he is obviously crafting a DCU on the big screen for us to enjoy. I just wish he had a hand in the Green Lantern movie, just imagine how much better that would have been.
That's a good one
Kudos for writing down the most stupid thing I had the displeasure to read on these boards for months.

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