List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong

CFE · 10-20-2007, 06:17 PM

I'm in no way, shape or form condoning that a thread like this be made for all the films, but I think one more for Burton's 1992 follow up would be reasonable.

For me I feel that what they absolutely got right was the atmosphere. A lot of people bash "Returns" for being a Burton film over a Batman film, but I disagree. It's Batman with Burton's visual styling laid over it, but it's still Batman to me.

They also got right something that Burton commented on in the SE DVD Documentary, which was the level of Batman's presence in Gotham. Not necessarily how much screentime he was given but the fact that whether he was on screen or not you could feel him lurking around Gotham, keeping ever vigilant on the city. The scene of him driving the Batmobile through the deserted streets helps this idea. That even if he's not fighting with the Penguin or Catwoman he's out and about doing something, whether it's down in the Batcave digging for information on Cobblepot or patroling the streets in silence.

As for what was wrong, I only have one technical issue.

And that's that out of all the theatrical films, "Batman Returns" Gotham City, while brilliantly designed by Bo Welch, is for me the least like a City. There isn't a feeling of depth to Gotham in this film. It gives off that feeling that it IS in fact an interior set. If you watch the scene after Batman crashes the Bat Ski-Boat through the Arctic World itself and topples upon the Penguin's Duck-Mobile...if you listen...while Batman is climbing out of the Ski Boat and he props his hands onto the canopy to stand up, you can clearly hear some reverberation, despite the fact that this is supposed to be taking place in an exterior setting.

A little nit picking, I know, but I wish the Gotham "BR" actually felt like a city. They tended to stay in one place the entirety of the film, which was Gotham Plaza...surrounded by the Shreck Office/Department Store and the main streets throughout the film.

-----------

CFE

A.X.L · 10-20-2007, 06:19 PM

Right

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=286133

CFE · 10-20-2007, 06:25 PM

1: I'm talking about all aspects of the film, not a single Character...
2: Someone else posting a link to your thread is acceptable. Doing it yourself is a really jerk-type thing to do...

Right?

Right...

CFE

A.X.L · 10-20-2007, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COMICFILMEXPERT

1: I'm talking about all aspects of the film, not a single Character...
2: Someone else posting a link to your thread is acceptable. Doing it yourself is a really jerk-type thing to do...

Right?

Right...

CFE

Get a grip - no one's trying to divert attention away from your precious thread.

CFE · 10-20-2007, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vais

Get a grip - no one's trying to divert attention away from your precious thread.

That's an ironic statement, since that seems to be exactly what you think I'm doing to your thread...

EDIT: If a mod can come in here and delete all these posts until an actual one that pertains to the topic is posted...thanks.

CFE

A.X.L · 10-20-2007, 06:33 PM

You talk crap - I have never even considered you before let alone thought you were trying to do something in a thread I made(that I posted in twice), did you even post there?

CFE · 10-20-2007, 06:38 PM

Why else would you cynically post a link to your own Returns thread if not for the fact that you considered my thread would do something to yours (aka divert Hypsters from it)?

"OMG...CFE made a Returns thread...BUT I made one FIRST!!!"

CFE

again if a mod finds this, please delete all these posts so the thread isn't potentially bogged down by this nonsense.

A.X.L · 10-20-2007, 06:42 PM

Paranoid much?

I was saying Catwoman was something it got right. I couldnt care less if the thread I made was never seen again. It's the internet, get some perspective. If you want to continue to whine PM me so I can ignore you and noone else has to read.

CFE · 10-20-2007, 06:46 PM

Now I see what you mean (be clear next time). Even so, stating it would have been sufficient.

If you couldn't care less if your thread was ever seen again, why link it?

CFE

Mr. Socko · 10-20-2007, 06:49 PM

Wrong-

The 'eat fiber floor' line

Right-

Everything else.

Damiean Dark · 10-21-2007, 12:53 AM

Great movie still equal with B89 for the best watches more like one of those one of bat novels like castle of the bat love the penguin/catwoman chemistry and Walken lends great support as shreck a guy you really dont want to mess with.

GoogleMe94 · 10-22-2007, 01:41 PM

walken was sooo evil in this. and Penguin is interesting but they got him both wrong AND right, but for me, mostly right. they made him a VERY dangerous guy and not some mob wannabe dope. they truly made him EVIL. i never got that evil vibe from any of the comics penguin. penguin from returns was EVIL. also catwoman was done. to. perfection. never seen a better rendtion of that character. batman was badass as always and the batmobile still kicked ass. i cant really think of anything wrong with the film, it truly retained the darkness and depth of batman. only thing is it maybe was a little TOO dark, but then again thats what makes this a great batman film.

Why Are You Crouching Spock? · 10-22-2007, 02:02 PM

Right:

It's dark
It's weird
The Penguin was more interesting in this movie than in the comics seems even more evil than the joker.
Doesn't feel like it was made for children (even with ratings)
The bat mobile does that cool thing of splitting to fit through the crack
The music score is superb, better than that of batman 89'
The movie is a visual ejaculation
Catwoman is hot and she was played extremely well
The movie uses the line "just the pussy i'v been looking for", that alone seems worth admission.
Joel Shumacher didn't make this movie.
Great closing shot to the movie

Wrong:

Batman still moves like a robot
Batman's black eye's magically disappear
Catwoman uses the line "I am catwoman hear me roar" some stinkers in there.
Gordon might as well not exist.
Story seems messy and incoherent.
It's pretty camp at times.
Joel Shumacher Took over afterwords.

Kevin Roegele · 10-22-2007, 05:23 PM

Not right or wrong as such....but it's intresting how Warner Bros pushed for more action in the Batman seque, and Burton made the action more cartoony. Just about every major action scene can be seen as slapstick.

Mr.E.Nygma · 10-22-2007, 05:56 PM

Returns is I think the most fascinating batmovie, it's very mysterious, twisted, passionated, stylish. A true artwork on film!
The thematics and tortuous relationships between each character is amazingly well done for a simple superhero movie, most of this category fail.
The Gothic aspect of the city, even if CFE brings a good point by its studio effect, is well rendered. Environment of characters help create an atmosphere for the public and the character himself, how he reacts.

Wrong : Harvey Dent is gone and WB flush Billy Dee Williams for BF...but let's not start a debate on this ;-)

GoogleMe94 · 10-22-2007, 07:24 PM

i still dont understand why some ppl think Forever is a sequel when they made harvey dent go from black to white.

David Rice · 10-22-2007, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoogleMe94

i still dont understand why some ppl think Forever is a sequel when they made harvey dent go from black to white.

I still don't why people think is not a sequel when there are very clear lines of dialogue that connect them. Dude, it's a sequel. Joel wanted Two Face to match the comics.

GoogleMe94 · 10-23-2007, 07:44 AM

he wanted it to match the comics, but not the films? and lines of dialogue? like what, that teeny reference to catwoman? thats all i can remember.

Nightwing1977 · 10-23-2007, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoogleMe94

i still dont understand why some ppl think Forever is a sequel when they made harvey dent go from black to white.

Hello again BatmanRules33/Batwing6655/Dr. Satan/brownish33. Still denying BF is a sequel here again, huh? Wheter you guys want to or not, BF is really a sequel. Keaton was going to return. I bet if Burton return too, you would say it's a sequel. Come on!! BF is a sequel & that is a fact. If you don't believe it, go ask Keaton or Burton about it then.

Some of what I like: keeping the same Batmobile, suit much better, Christopher Walken (Can't go wrong with the Walken

),

And I have many problems with BR. It was too weird (Batman movies are suppose to be dark, not too weird like crap), Catwoman surviving an impossible fall from a high rise building & learning martial arts like in one day (Wha...?!?), real penguins carrying rockets (That's real cute, Burton. So much for being dark, 'cause that one made BR less dark & more campy there), Penguin driving the big yellow duck & the silly little kiddie Batmobile ride, Penguin a poor underground mutant (Lame!!), Batman can't fight the strongman & kill him instead with a....dynamite?? (Batman can beat him up easily if it was more like the comics, since Batman use his skills & not brawn to win. And killing was not necessary. Him losing the fight & putting dynamite on him is not Batman. He is better than that.).

David Rice · 10-23-2007, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoogleMe94

he wanted it to match the comics, but not the films? and lines of dialogue? like what, that teeny reference to catwoman? thats all i can remember.

Yep! He sure did. The truth is when Billy Dee was cast nobody ready thought about Two Face. His role in Batman was so small that most people in the public won't really remember. Teeny? I'd say that was pretty big. What about the line where Robin say's "Your parent weren't killed my a maniac"? Face it dude, it is a sequel... just becuase it doesn't seem like one to you doesn't mean the rest of us think the same thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightwing1977

Hello again BatmanRules33/Batwing6655/Dr. Satan/brownish33. Still denying BF is a sequel here again, huh? Wheter you guys want to or not, BF is really a sequel. Keaton was going to return. I bet if Burton return too, you would say it's a sequel. Come on!! BF is a sequel & that is a fact. If you don't believe it, go ask Keaton or Burton about it then.

So this is the same guy?

GoogleMe94 · 10-23-2007, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightwing1977

Hello again BatmanRules33/Batwing6655/Dr. Satan/brownish33.

wtf is this? dr. satan? batwing? wtf? what a flaming idiot.

Quote:

And I have many problems with BR.

i can plainly see that. but im not going to get into a flame war about it. your obviously one of those annoying as heck ppl on imdb.com that thinks they know everything and think the other bat films suck ass and that begins is the end all batman movie. first, your wrong. 2nd, shut the hell up. obviously your just another biased Begins nut who so obviously pefers nolans films, even the ones that havent been made yet. what a nolanite turd. wish there was an "ignore" option, you'd be the first to go on it. i have my opinion, and you have yours. no need to be a total dipsh** about it. i can see your developing "Troll" behavior, and if thats the case, i hope you get banned soon. this website certainly doesnt need a another begins troll, or burton troll for that matter, which i am not. but i know you probabkly think i am.

The Joker · 10-23-2007, 11:24 AM

Burgess Meredith's Penguin was awesome.

GoogleMe94 · 10-23-2007, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joker

Burgess Meredith's Penguin was awesome.

heehee

David Rice · 10-23-2007, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoogleMe94

wtf is this? dr. satan? batwing? wtf? what a flaming idiot.

i can plainly see that. but im not going to get into a flame war about it. your obviously one of those annoying as heck ppl on imdb.com that thinks they know everything and think the other bat films suck ass and that begins is the end all batman movie. first, your wrong. 2nd, shut the hell up. obviously your just another biased Begins nut who so obviously pefers nolans films, even the ones that havent been made yet. what a nolanite turd. wish there was an "ignore" option, you'd be the first to go on it. i have my opinion, and you have yours. no need to be a total dipsh** about it. i can see your developing "Troll" behavior, and if thats the case, i hope you get banned soon. this website certainly doesnt need a another begins troll, or burton troll for that matter, which i am not. but i know you probabkly think i am.

That's quite the judgement there man. Just how do you know all these things?

Mr.E.Nygma · 10-23-2007, 07:51 PM

All bickerings apart, the point is Batman Returns is good

10-20-2007, 06:17 PM	#1
CFE This is a job for... Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Dark Bowels of Man's Domain... Posts: 8,895	List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong I'm in no way, shape or form condoning that a thread like this be made for all the films, but I think one more for Burton's 1992 follow up would be reasonable. For me I feel that what they absolutely got right was the atmosphere. A lot of people bash "Returns" for being a Burton film over a Batman film, but I disagree. It's Batman with Burton's visual styling laid over it, but it's still Batman to me. They also got right something that Burton commented on in the SE DVD Documentary, which was the level of Batman's presence in Gotham. Not necessarily how much screentime he was given but the fact that whether he was on screen or not you could feel him lurking around Gotham, keeping ever vigilant on the city. The scene of him driving the Batmobile through the deserted streets helps this idea. That even if he's not fighting with the Penguin or Catwoman he's out and about doing something, whether it's down in the Batcave digging for information on Cobblepot or patroling the streets in silence. As for what was wrong, I only have one technical issue. And that's that out of all the theatrical films, "Batman Returns" Gotham City, while brilliantly designed by Bo Welch, is for me the least like a City. There isn't a feeling of depth to Gotham in this film. It gives off that feeling that it IS in fact an interior set. If you watch the scene after Batman crashes the Bat Ski-Boat through the Arctic World itself and topples upon the Penguin's Duck-Mobile...if you listen...while Batman is climbing out of the Ski Boat and he props his hands onto the canopy to stand up, you can clearly hear some reverberation, despite the fact that this is supposed to be taking place in an exterior setting. A little nit picking, I know, but I wish the Gotham "BR" actually felt like a city. They tended to stay in one place the entirety of the film, which was Gotham Plaza...surrounded by the Shreck Office/Department Store and the main streets throughout the film. ----------- CFE __________________ Follow CFE on Facebook BAT-MANIA 2012 - The Exhibition Blog Last edited by CFE; 10-23-2007 at 11:56 AM.

10-20-2007, 06:19 PM	#2
A.X.L Banned User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 512	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Right http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=286133

10-20-2007, 06:25 PM	#3
CFE This is a job for... Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Dark Bowels of Man's Domain... Posts: 8,895	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong 1: I'm talking about all aspects of the film, not a single Character... 2: Someone else posting a link to your thread is acceptable. Doing it yourself is a really jerk-type thing to do... Right? Right... CFE __________________ Follow CFE on Facebook BAT-MANIA 2012 - The Exhibition Blog

10-20-2007, 06:33 PM	#6
A.X.L Banned User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 512	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong You talk crap - I have never even considered you before let alone thought you were trying to do something in a thread I made(that I posted in twice), did you even post there?

10-20-2007, 06:38 PM	#7
CFE This is a job for... Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Dark Bowels of Man's Domain... Posts: 8,895	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Why else would you cynically post a link to your own Returns thread if not for the fact that you considered my thread would do something to yours (aka divert Hypsters from it)? "OMG...CFE made a Returns thread...BUT I made one FIRST!!!" CFE again if a mod finds this, please delete all these posts so the thread isn't potentially bogged down by this nonsense. __________________ Follow CFE on Facebook BAT-MANIA 2012 - The Exhibition Blog

10-20-2007, 06:42 PM	#8
A.X.L Banned User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 512	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Paranoid much? I was saying Catwoman was something it got right. I couldnt care less if the thread I made was never seen again. It's the internet, get some perspective. If you want to continue to whine PM me so I can ignore you and noone else has to read. Last edited by A.X.L; 10-20-2007 at 06:46 PM.

10-20-2007, 06:46 PM	#9
CFE This is a job for... Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Dark Bowels of Man's Domain... Posts: 8,895	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Now I see what you mean (be clear next time). Even so, stating it would have been sufficient. If you couldn't care less if your thread was ever seen again, why link it? CFE __________________ Follow CFE on Facebook BAT-MANIA 2012 - The Exhibition Blog

10-20-2007, 06:49 PM	#10
Mr. Socko Side-Kick Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Fleet Street Posts: 23,329	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Wrong- The 'eat fiber floor' line Right- Everything else. __________________ "When a naked man is chasing a woman through an alley with a butcher's knife and a hard on, I figure he isn't out collecting for the Red Cross"- Harry Callahan

10-21-2007, 12:53 AM	#11
Damiean Dark Banned User Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 1,889	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Great movie still equal with B89 for the best watches more like one of those one of bat novels like castle of the bat love the penguin/catwoman chemistry and Walken lends great support as shreck a guy you really dont want to mess with.

10-22-2007, 01:41 PM	#12
GoogleMe94 Banned User Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 2,401	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong walken was sooo evil in this. and Penguin is interesting but they got him both wrong AND right, but for me, mostly right. they made him a VERY dangerous guy and not some mob wannabe dope. they truly made him EVIL. i never got that evil vibe from any of the comics penguin. penguin from returns was EVIL. also catwoman was done. to. perfection. never seen a better rendtion of that character. batman was badass as always and the batmobile still kicked ass. i cant really think of anything wrong with the film, it truly retained the darkness and depth of batman. only thing is it maybe was a little TOO dark, but then again thats what makes this a great batman film.

10-22-2007, 02:02 PM	#13
Why Are You Crouching Spock? Banned User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 10,907	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Right: It's dark It's weird The Penguin was more interesting in this movie than in the comics seems even more evil than the joker. Doesn't feel like it was made for children (even with ratings) The bat mobile does that cool thing of splitting to fit through the crack The music score is superb, better than that of batman 89' The movie is a visual ejaculation Catwoman is hot and she was played extremely well The movie uses the line "just the pussy i'v been looking for", that alone seems worth admission. Joel Shumacher didn't make this movie. Great closing shot to the movie Wrong: Batman still moves like a robot Batman's black eye's magically disappear Catwoman uses the line "I am catwoman hear me roar" some stinkers in there. Gordon might as well not exist. Story seems messy and incoherent. It's pretty camp at times. Joel Shumacher Took over afterwords.

10-22-2007, 05:23 PM	#14
Kevin Roegele Side-Kick Join Date: May 2000 Location: England Posts: 23,318	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Not right or wrong as such....but it's intresting how Warner Bros pushed for more action in the Batman seque, and Burton made the action more cartoony. Just about every major action scene can be seen as slapstick. __________________ Read Cobalt Blue's comic strip adventures online - http://www.facebook.com/pages/Cobalt...68148599902345

10-22-2007, 05:56 PM	#15
Mr.E.Nygma Side-Kick Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Optical fiber Posts: 2,006	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Returns is I think the most fascinating batmovie, it's very mysterious, twisted, passionated, stylish. A true artwork on film! The thematics and tortuous relationships between each character is amazingly well done for a simple superhero movie, most of this category fail. The Gothic aspect of the city, even if CFE brings a good point by its studio effect, is well rendered. Environment of characters help create an atmosphere for the public and the character himself, how he reacts. Wrong : Harvey Dent is gone and WB flush Billy Dee Williams for BF...but let's not start a debate on this ;-) __________________ GOLDENEYE NEVER DIES (FUSION OF 2 BOND TITLES)! (my DEVIANTART account! I invite you to check my concepts, not necessarly my techniques...)

10-22-2007, 07:24 PM	#16
GoogleMe94 Banned User Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 2,401	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong i still dont understand why some ppl think Forever is a sequel when they made harvey dent go from black to white.

10-23-2007, 07:44 AM	#18
GoogleMe94 Banned User Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 2,401	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong he wanted it to match the comics, but not the films? and lines of dialogue? like what, that teeny reference to catwoman? thats all i can remember.

10-23-2007, 11:24 AM	#22
The Joker Clown Prince of Crime Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Jollity Farm Posts: 33,712	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong Burgess Meredith's Penguin was awesome. __________________ "Sometimes I remember it one way. Sometimes another. If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!" - The Joker

10-23-2007, 07:51 PM	#25
Mr.E.Nygma Side-Kick Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Optical fiber Posts: 2,006	Re: List of Things Batman Returns got Right/Wrong All bickerings apart, the point is Batman Returns is good __________________ GOLDENEYE NEVER DIES (FUSION OF 2 BOND TITLES)! (my DEVIANTART account! I invite you to check my concepts, not necessarly my techniques...)

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