The SuperHeroHype Forums  

Go Back   The SuperHeroHype Forums > Superman > The Comics

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-16-2008, 12:01 AM   #1
ScottishFogg
Narnian
 
ScottishFogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Posts: 1,832
Default Why Does Frank Miller Hate Superman?

I just finished reading the TPB of All-Star Batman and Robin and realized something . . . Frank Miller hates Superman.

Every time he writes a Batman book, he throws in something that makes Superman out to be a clown, a child, or just a puppet of the government. In Miller's books, Bruce belittles Clark, looks down on him, and continually disrespects him. Why is that?

If this was the relationship Supes and Bats have, there would be no way they could have ever been on the Justice League together. They'd never team up. They'd never do anything together.

It's such a stark contrast to the way Loeb writes them. In his run on Superman/Batman, they respect each other and their differences. They actually seem like friends.

So what's Frank's deal? Is he just re-writing Batman, working him into his vision of what he thinks Batman should be like? Making him a character that should haunt Sin City, not Gotham?

__________________
had an idea today . . .
http://scottfogg.blogspot.com/
ScottishFogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 05:47 AM   #2
TruerToTheCore
Banned User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Earth-1
Posts: 2,936
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

well, you realize things really... fast It has always been that way. Perhaps Superman is too "clean" for him or something like that.

TruerToTheCore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 05:52 AM   #3
chamber-music
Hail Hydra
 
chamber-music's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 23,559
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

I don't know Frank Miller doesn't exactly like the Green Latern either from the looks of All Star Batman and Robin.

__________________
King Of Strong Style
chamber-music is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 06:37 AM   #4
TruerToTheCore
Banned User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Earth-1
Posts: 2,936
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Well, he always seemed to like Hal Jordan.

In ASBR all are retarded

TruerToTheCore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 10:23 AM   #5
ScottishFogg
Narnian
 
ScottishFogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Posts: 1,832
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

I've always known, but ASBR just pushed it over the edge.

__________________
had an idea today . . .
http://scottfogg.blogspot.com/
ScottishFogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 12:21 PM   #6
luca_frontino
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 386
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

I remember one of his interview in wich he described psychologically the two, completely different. Hence putting them at odds.
Can anyone post it, please? I don't remember where it is.

luca_frontino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 03:42 PM   #7
ScottishFogg
Narnian
 
ScottishFogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Posts: 1,832
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

I agree. They are very different people. But every chance Miller gets, he puts this really strong animosity between them, especially coming from Batman. I think in ASBR, he literally says, "I'm smarter than you, I'll always be smarter than you!" And then laughs and laughs.

Who's smarter is up for debate, I suppose. But to dimish Kal's otherworldly knowledge just seems juvenile. It's like, in Miller's world, Batman is the nerdy little kid in eighth grade who picks on the jock from behind his back.

__________________
had an idea today . . .
http://scottfogg.blogspot.com/
ScottishFogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 04:00 PM   #8
TruerToTheCore
Banned User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Earth-1
Posts: 2,936
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Superman is - of course - more intelligent than Batman, The authentic Superman that is.

TruerToTheCore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2008, 03:28 AM   #9
twofacetoface
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Why does Frank Miller hate Superman? Personally, I like Batman better, but I don't feel the need to belittle Supes to make Batman seem cooler! They are each coolin their own ways. I would have to say that Bats is actually the more intellegent of the two, but lets face it, he can't do a lot of the things Supes can do. If only for his amazing power, Supes is a leader. People naturally follow him and listen to him because he is Superman! Batman certainly has leadership skills, but he likes to keep to himself. Sure, he has his extended family of sidekicks, but they all had to go through a lot to earn his trust and he still keeps them all out of the loop on many things. Miller plays favorites like no one's business! And with every character he takes on, he gives them that same Miller twist! Sure, any time a new writer takes on a character that already exists, they're gonna give them thier own twist, but Miller takes it to an extreme. Superman, The Man of Steel, is always made to look like some loser boyscout who is all brawn and no brains, and that is not Superman at all. I think that Superman and Batman would each understand and respect each other, despite how different they are. Miller pretty much feels like he can do whatever he wants and he gets away with it because he's Frank Miller. I HATE The Dark Knight Strikes again because not only does he belittle Superman, he does the same thing to Dick Grayson! My opinion is that Miller should just stick to doing his own original stuff and stop ruining everything that is good about the classics!

  Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2008, 06:06 AM   #10
TruerToTheCore
Banned User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Earth-1
Posts: 2,936
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by twofacetoface View Post
I would have to say that Bats is actually the more intellegent of the two,
No he is not. Superman has "super-intellect" and a super-brain. The Smallville and Lois & Clark Superman is kinda dumb, that's correct. And the STAS Superman. Batman is just a human genius, Superman comes from a species on his peak of evolution, and out of one of the finest families there.

TruerToTheCore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2008, 03:27 PM   #11
Michael Corleone
Don Corleone
 
Michael Corleone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: D.C.
Posts: 4,182
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TruerToTheCore View Post
No he is not. Superman has "super-intellect" and a super-brain. The Smallville and Lois & Clark Superman is kinda dumb, that's correct. And the STAS Superman. Batman is just a human genius, Superman comes from a species on his peak of evolution, and out of one of the finest families there.
What continuity? What age? You say that like it's fact when it's actually opinion. I suppose you could say he has super-intellect right now, but we don't know what his limits are or where the character is headed. He's only had these changes for the past couple years so far. It's fine to post your opinion, and debate this stuff, but don't assume you are just right and no one can challenge that.

__________________

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science"
Albert Einstein

Michael Corleone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2008, 04:22 PM   #12
TruerToTheCore
Banned User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Earth-1
Posts: 2,936
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

it was that way from 1938 'til 1986 but then Superman became Super-Simp. I am glad they re-introduced it in 2006. I don't care about fanboy's favourite thing, "continuity", I just look at the essence of the character and how he was created, "with powers far beyond those of mortal man" AND so his LOGICALLY his brain. He is a super-inventor and seems to build super-robots now! Superman, greatest character ever invented.



Only Superman haters deny his super-intellect.


Last edited by TruerToTheCore; 07-22-2008 at 04:26 PM.
TruerToTheCore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2008, 03:32 PM   #13
Michael Corleone
Don Corleone
 
Michael Corleone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: D.C.
Posts: 4,182
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TruerToTheCore View Post
it was that way from 1938 'til 1986 but then Superman became Super-Simp. I am glad they re-introduced it in 2006. I don't care about fanboy's favourite thing, "continuity", I just look at the essence of the character and how he was created, "with powers far beyond those of mortal man" AND so his LOGICALLY his brain. He is a super-inventor and seems to build super-robots now! Superman, greatest character ever invented.



Only Superman haters deny his super-intellect.
You're still posting an opinion, not fact. You do realize that you as much a fanboy as anyone on this board right? I think you should just relax and not get so defensive about this. Especially with the "Superman haters" crap. Calm down.

__________________

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science"
Albert Einstein

Michael Corleone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 12:27 AM   #14
Kal L
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Why Does Frank Miller Hate Superman?

Frank Miller writes Superman that way because he doesn't understand him.

He can't get his mind wrapped around the fact that a character can be as good as Superman.

Just look at EVERYTHING he has ever written, it's as dark as can be. You only write about the things you know, and the basic things that make Superman who he is do not exist in Frank Miller's mind.

He's a crackpot.


  Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 07:08 AM   #15
C. W. Saturn
Banned User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 240
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Corleone View Post
You're still posting an opinion, not fact. You do realize that you as much a fanboy as anyone on this board right? I think you should just relax and not get so defensive about this. Especially with the "Superman haters" crap. Calm down.
Why is this an "opinion"? Superman is super-intelligent, of course. That was featured in so many stories in the golden/silver and bronze age and today it is SAID to be back - but we haven't seen it.

C. W. Saturn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 10:22 AM   #16
Nixon
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 472
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

cwstriumphant, is that you?!

Is everybody leaving the DCboards now?

Nixon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 03:52 PM   #17
Michael Corleone
Don Corleone
 
Michael Corleone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: D.C.
Posts: 4,182
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by C. W. Saturn View Post
Why is this an "opinion"? Superman is super-intelligent, of course. That was featured in so many stories in the golden/silver and bronze age and today it is SAID to be back - but we haven't seen it.
Because the character is a living character. He's changed so many times that it's pointless to say one iteration of the character is the correct one. It boils down to personal preference of which version of the character is yours. Superman currently has no established origin or continuity. So to say one or the other is flat out wrong is, well wrong. To pass off anyone's opinion of the character as incorrect. To consider said person as a Superman hater or a fanboy is also wrong. But what do I know? I apparently hate the character and can't see past my fanboyism. This is the last I'm post on the topic as it's one persons view against another, and I think people are missing that fact.

__________________

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science"
Albert Einstein

Michael Corleone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 04:27 PM   #18
Nixon
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 472
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

^^^

If it is CWS then I wouldn't worry too much about it. That's his schtick, complain about everything and then accuse anybody that doesn't agree with him of hating Superman and not being a true fan like him.

Nixon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 05:33 PM   #19
TruerToTheCore
Banned User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Earth-1
Posts: 2,936
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Corleone View Post
Because the character is a living character. He's changed so many times that it's pointless to say one iteration of the character is the correct one. It boils down to personal preference of which version of the character is yours. Superman currently has no established origin or continuity. So to say one or the other is flat out wrong is, well wrong. To pass off anyone's opinion of the character as incorrect. To consider said person as a Superman hater or a fanboy is also wrong. But what do I know? I apparently hate the character and can't see past my fanboyism. This is the last I'm post on the topic as it's one persons view against another, and I think people are missing that fact.
Amazing that Superman fans want their character to be "dumb".

TruerToTheCore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 07:01 PM   #20
Michael Corleone
Don Corleone
 
Michael Corleone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: D.C.
Posts: 4,182
Default Re: why does Frank Miller hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TruerToTheCore View Post
Amazing that Superman fans want their character to be "dumb".
Yeah, that's what I want


P.S. Try not to be so angry about everything.

__________________

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science"
Albert Einstein


Last edited by Michael Corleone; 07-24-2008 at 07:14 PM.
Michael Corleone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2008, 09:32 PM   #21
Metropolis_Man
Collectin' ain't easy!
 
Metropolis_Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 3,712
Default Re: Why Does Frank Miller Hate Superman?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal L View Post
Frank Miller writes Superman that way because he doesn't understand him.

He can't get his mind wrapped around the fact that a character can be as good as Superman.

Just look at EVERYTHING he has ever written, it's as dark as can be. You only write about the things you know, and the basic things that make Superman who he is do not exist in Frank Miller's mind.

He's a crackpot.

That about sums it up for me. I think Frank Miller just doesn't understand that a man would want to strive to be the best he can possibly be and shine through as a symbol of hope. Batman inspires people in one way but Superman tries to do it the best way he can without forcing anything on anyone. I think this is a concept that most people don't want to, or are afraid to comprehend.

__________________
"It's not an 'S'. On my world it means hope."6/14/13
Metropolis_Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2008, 12:58 AM   #22
ScottishFogg
Narnian
 
ScottishFogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Posts: 1,832
Default Re: Why Does Frank Miller Hate Superman?

^^^

That's the conclusion I've come to as well. Why does DC let him tarnish Supes that way?

__________________
had an idea today . . .
http://scottfogg.blogspot.com/
ScottishFogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2008, 08:52 PM   #23
Andy C.
Repent, Harlequin!
 
Andy C.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: The Basement
Posts: 3,543
Default Re: Why Does Frank Miller Hate Superman?

Because they can make a ton of money by slapping his name on whatever dreck he puts out. Notice that they don't let him anywhere near the mainstream DC ongoing series, though--it's always in an alternate timeline. They know damn well not to let him have a permanent impact on the characters' actual stories.

Andy C. is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2008, 08:59 PM   #24
Pluto
Side-Kick
 
Pluto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Inside this realm.
Posts: 537
Default Re: Why Does Frank Miller Hate Superman?

Of course. He's a Batman defender!

Pluto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2008, 02:31 AM   #25
markstrange
Side-Kick
 
markstrange's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Muskogee, Ok
Posts: 1,002
Default Re: Why Does Frank Miller Hate Superman?

Because Batman is the Goddamn Batman and Superman is just a retarded boyscout in blue PJ's who wares bright red underwear on the outside of his pants and has a huge freaking S for "stupid" a cross his chest. He may be an Icon to many people but I just wish Lex Luthor would toss him in the recycling bin already.

__________________
Superheroes fill a gap in the pop culture psyche, similar to the role of Greek mythology ... Superman is essentially a god, but Batman is more like Hercules: he`s a human being, very flawed, and bridges the divide. - Christopher Nolan
markstrange is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:43 AM.

monitoring_string = "dee460792f24517621e3ca080805de7e"
Contact Us - Mobile - SuperHeroHype - ComingSoon.net - Shock Till You Drop - Lost Password - Clear Cookies - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Top - AdChoices


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SuperHeroHype.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.