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Old 12-03-2011, 10:29 PM   #26
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

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take out Magneto when he was lifting the sub?
Because Riptide did?

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Old 12-04-2011, 01:14 AM   #27
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

Riptide needed time to shine too and that was the most interesting display of his power, imo.

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Old 12-05-2011, 11:56 AM   #28
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

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You make an excellent point actually. :/

But I do believe that Charles' trauma (as in paralysis and key members of his "family" deserting him, coin likely irrelevant) will probably translate into some power issues. His power deals with the mind and psychologically he's going to be pretty messed up.

I think someone else posted on here in this thread or another about how they might make OBLIVION the baddie in the sequel, but rather than make it the strange mindchild of Erik and Charles, make it a manifestation of Charles' issues. And Erik is the one to help Charles come back to himself, a role reversal of XMFC. That's an interesting take on it as well. Man oh man can it be 2014* already?


*just a guess when XMFC2 will come out
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It could actually compound the trauma. Imagine Charles in the wheelchair, relying on his mind to experience the world more than ever, and suddenly his powers start to malfunction. He'd be even more devastated, and would give him an arc of learning not only to accept himself in a wheelchair but to rebuild his abilities.


You know, in the way that XFC was often a movie about Magneto and his pain I could easily see XFC2 focusing on Charles in that way.

But why is it needed?


This will probably be an "agree to disagree" moment. Powers going wonky is so over-used in sci-fi and fantasy that it borders on being cliche. One reason the general audience sometimes doesn't latch onto sci-fi and fantasty is because those genres can easily lose their "human" elements, relying too much on the supernatural to carry the plot.


Just imagine this--you possess the most powerful mind on the planet. And you are now limited by a disabled body. It's not just traumatic; it's also ironic. Charles won't be able to do the same things he had done, and now with the discovery of mutants, he'll want that more than ever. It'll crush him to have those limitations. Despite his powerful mind, he will feel helpless.


Then, we add yet another conflict on top of all that with his powers not working for whatever reason (coin attack, his body out of sorts at the time, etc...). That will take away that irony and distract from the HUGE, devastating conflict of being disabled.


Less is more. The audience will sympathize with Charles and cheer for him when he starts to cope with his new limitations, and it'll all by very human and relatable.

And if they want to have a "role reversal" with Magneto helping Charles battle his demons, then he can help with Charles coping with his disability. Charles needs to know that he can still contribute and do good despite what's happened to him physically. Helping or even going up against Magneto will prove that to him.

And yes, I'm very excited about the sequel, too. Super-awesome!

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Old 12-05-2011, 03:37 PM   #29
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

I hesitate to say that any glitch in his powers is "needed" but like I said earlier there's been an issue with Charles being overly powerful in the original trilogy. He needed to be out into a coma or killed in order for the villain's plan to be able to succeed. Having Charles struggle with his powers would be a way to increase tension by making him vulnerable without removing him from the action.

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Old 12-05-2011, 04:24 PM   #30
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

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I hesitate to say that any glitch in his powers is "needed" but like I said earlier there's been an issue with Charles being overly powerful in the original trilogy. He needed to be out into a coma or killed in order for the villain's plan to be able to succeed. Having Charles struggle with his powers would be a way to increase tension by making him vulnerable without removing him from the action.
Now, this is true. It's the "Superman" problem; you make a character too powerful, then there's no real conflict. Honestly, one issue isn't Charles at all, but Cerebro. It's overly-used to solve problems or to give Charles much more power than he, himself, has on his own.

If you take that machine away (like they did in the middle of XM:FC), then Charles' abilities diminish greatly. Also, there's Magneto's helmet and also other telepaths can get in his way, which is one reason having Emma there was a great idea. Sure, she was a tramp, but she had some purpose.

And now that Charles is paralyzed, that's yet another limitation.

So...there are ways around the power-issue besides making him "sick" as it were. But I get what you're saying.

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Old 12-06-2011, 06:13 PM   #31
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

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But why is it needed?


This will probably be an "agree to disagree" moment. Powers going wonky is so over-used in sci-fi and fantasy that it borders on being cliche. One reason the general audience sometimes doesn't latch onto sci-fi and fantasty is because those genres can easily lose their "human" elements, relying too much on the supernatural to carry the plot.


Just imagine this--you possess the most powerful mind on the planet. And you are now limited by a disabled body. It's not just traumatic; it's also ironic. Charles won't be able to do the same things he had done, and now with the discovery of mutants, he'll want that more than ever. It'll crush him to have those limitations. Despite his powerful mind, he will feel helpless.


Then, we add yet another conflict on top of all that with his powers not working for whatever reason (coin attack, his body out of sorts at the time, etc...). That will take away that irony and distract from the HUGE, devastating conflict of being disabled.


Less is more. The audience will sympathize with Charles and cheer for him when he starts to cope with his new limitations, and it'll all by very human and relatable.

And if they want to have a "role reversal" with Magneto helping Charles battle his demons, then he can help with Charles coping with his disability. Charles needs to know that he can still contribute and do good despite what's happened to him physically. Helping or even going up against Magneto will prove that to him.

And yes, I'm very excited about the sequel, too. Super-awesome!
I agree with this. To have Charles' powers going out of control would be too much.

I want to see him try to deal with his new physical limitations - just as he was getting excited about finding new mutants and training them he has limited mobility. He can't rush or run anywhere, he's got to adapt to a different life altogether.

But I see it that his powers were honed in isolation and loneliness during his childhood in that mansion. It almost feels like his mind was reaching out for friends, love, family, in the absence of his parents. He was therefore able to practise his telepathy.

And he might therefore hone his powers further in the absence of mobility and the loneliness and frustration that brings - in other words, the astral plane and (in denial, perhaps?) mental projections of a fully-walking self. Disability will lead to his powers going to the next level when he finally accepts what has happened.

And then we can have that astral plane battle between Xavier and Emma, or Xavier and Shadow King, or whoever.

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Old 01-05-2012, 12:05 AM   #32
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

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Why didn't Superman just speed blitz Doomsday into paste in "Death of Superman"? Why doesn't Thor just send Hulk to another dimension when they fight? Why doesn't Silver Surfer just open a black hole on someones face when they annoy him?

That's just the way things are. It's for dramatic effect. Best not to think about it too much.
This.

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Old 01-15-2012, 06:19 PM   #33
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

I was thinking of this and it is completely probable that while Charles is a very powerful psychic, he probably hadn't developed his powers to their highest potential yet. I'm wagering that it is the loss of his ability to walk that is the impetus for him exercising the powers of his mind because that would be the only thing he could do to keep his mind off his crippled state.

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Old 01-22-2012, 12:08 AM   #34
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

Azazel doesn't have to do everything. There are other people there. And he still has to stick to orders


Last edited by NewCaptain; 01-22-2012 at 12:13 AM.
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Old 01-23-2012, 04:49 AM   #35
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

azazel had soo much potential but the movie did not make good use of his skills. ANd isnt the father of kurt was mr sinester?

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Old 01-23-2012, 05:45 AM   #36
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Default Re: Why didnt Azazel

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azazel had soo much potential but the movie did not make good use of his skills. ANd isnt the father of kurt was mr sinester?
Nope. His father was Azazel in the comics. I think the interesting development for Azazel is that he actually loves Mystique in the comics and she's the only woman among his conquests that he actually does love too. It was that affection for Mystique that forced him to leave her so she and Kurt would be safe from getting killed.

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