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Old 07-24-2011, 01:57 PM   #26
Tigerman
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Default Re: the fight scenes

I absolutely hated the action scenes in Batman Begins and The Dark Knight (save for maybe the first Batman fight scene from Begins). When I saw this (the link below) for the first time, I instinctively said to myself, "This is how Batman should be fighting!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHRwo48twyE

Bam. Perfect combination of stylized camerawork (especially for the close-ups), kinetic and logical editing, rough, not-to-stylized action choreography and performances, and atmosphere. You can't see every move that's being thrown like in a HK-style fight scene, but a lot of the action is clearly seen and it works well with the fact that some of it needs to be implied by the audience too (like how Nolan intended the Batman Begins fights to be). The moving wide shot captures everything that goes on while cutting back and fourth to the close-ups and it really help this fight scene sell.

Another one that's very similar in style is the Travolta vs. gang fight from From Paris With Love. This one is just a bit more stylized because of the slow-motion, but it has the same principals and flow of action.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWKM0bzoh5k

Of the two, I'd say the fight from The Book of Eli is more suited for a Nolan Batman film.


Last edited by Tigerman; 07-24-2011 at 02:00 PM.
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Old 07-24-2011, 02:16 PM   #27
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Default Re: the fight scenes

I just think as one of the best martial artists in fiction the fight scenes in Batman films should be a big draw. They should be awe inspiring. They should make people literally go "holy ****". No Batman movie... ever... has accomplished this i feel. To be honest it's a bit of a joke really.

Batman is a master of multiple styles. He should demonstrate a vast knowledge of martial arts, not just KFM, which frankly, is boring to watch. He should mix it up a bit.

Now that he has a villain he can properly engage with in one on one, stand up fights, I expect the wow factor that should come with a Batman movies fight scenes.

I rewatched TDK a few weeks ago and the Hong Kong fight in particular is just atrocious. I mean seriously, how did that cut make it into the film? It was soooooooooo bad.

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Old 07-24-2011, 02:21 PM   #28
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Default Re: the fight scenes

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Originally Posted by The Morningstar View Post
I just think as one of the best martial artists in fiction the fight scenes in Batman films should be a big draw. They should be awe inspiring. They should make people literally go "holy ****". No Batman movie... ever... has accomplished this i feel. To be honest it's a bit of a joke really.

Batman is a master of multiple styles. He should demonstrate a vast knowledge of martial arts, not just KFM, which frankly, is boring to watch. He should mix it up a bit.

Now that he has a villain he can properly engage with in one on one, stand up fights, I expect the wow factor that should come with a Batman movies fight scenes.

I rewatched TDK a few weeks ago and the Hong Kong fight in particular is just atrocious. I mean seriously, how did that cut make it into the film? It was soooooooooo bad.
You are exactly right. My cousin always makes the argument with me that the Nolan Batman films are about the characters, not about the action. WTF? Batman is an action comic book hero. And just because the action is "not the point" of the film doesn't mean that it shouldn't be done as well as everything else in the production!

I never saw the character tied down to a single style either, which is why I found the choice of KFM to be odd.

It's a real shame that Nolan seems to be talented in every area except action direction, which is a major negative considering the amount of action his latest movies have contained. It's a damn shame.

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Old 07-24-2011, 02:28 PM   #29
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Default Re: the fight scenes

Well yea don't get me wrong, you need good character moments. You need those momets to drive the action. Because for me, action, no matter how well done, is meaningless if you don't care about the characters involved or the plot.

But, yes, Batman is a ****ing bad ass martial artist. He's the GODDAMN BATMAN! Nolan and co really, really, really need to ramp up the fight scenes in TDKR. Especially when the villain is Bane. It's gotta be fast, brutal, bone crunching and above all, awe inspiring and iconic. Fight scenes in Batman movies should be making the top 10 movie fight scene lists.

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Old 07-24-2011, 02:40 PM   #30
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Well, Nolan seems to have a grip on the storytelling, so my gripes are definitely not with that. It's just that with as popular as his movies are with both the mainstream and among comic fans, the inadequacy of quality action scenes is a huge blemish on what I would consider personally the ideal Batman film.

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Old 07-24-2011, 07:46 PM   #31
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Default Re: the fight scenes

Please, Please, PLEASE! Nolan get rid of KFM. It's not pretty and flashy nor is it effective in real life situations. Bring in Kali/Escrima/Silat!!! Maybe some Combat Sambo and Judo as well!

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Old 07-25-2011, 07:11 AM   #32
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Default Re: the fight scenes

The fighting that Batman does in the Arkham Asylum/Arkham City games is in my mind the best representation of how the character should fight. There are elements of KFM visible there, but there are also a vast amount of other moves too. His ninja-like speed that's "supposed" to be portrayed in the movies is shown very well in the game, plus the more bruiser-like qualities from the comics and the animated series. The games got it so right and it's absolutely fantastic to watch and play.

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Old 07-25-2011, 10:58 AM   #33
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The fight scenes in TDK lacked any semblance of fluidity or naturalness (is that even a word?). The only fight that somewhat captured that was the scene in Maroni's club. Say what you want about how the fights were filmed in BB, at least they looked like real fights with fluid motion.

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Old 07-25-2011, 01:51 PM   #34
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Yeah, the scene in Maroni's club was probably the best because it seemed there was a direction to follow, unlike the rest of the fights where it seemed as if the actors performed the fights and the cameras just kind of floated around them aimlessly.

The problem was that in the Batman Begins' fight scenes the filmmakers took their intentions too far with trying to make the action look threatening by shooting them frantically and editing the **** out of them. I see what they were trying to do and it makes sense for a Batman film, but they failed at it. I'm assuming the crew heard the complaints because the fight scenes in The Dark Knight are practically devoid of any sort of direction or style. The two films are almost complete opposites in that sense, yet neither film accomplishes anything in the action department. If I had to choose, I prefer Batman Begins over The Dark Knight. At least the spastic confusion and illogical editing in the action scenes could be passed off as a "stylistic choice".

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Old 07-27-2011, 10:32 AM   #35
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Default Re: the fight scenes

I wish we saw more Wing Chun in the batbattles. In forever we get a little of him working with a wingchun wooden dummy, but it never showed up in the fights.
If anyone here is familar with it, wingchun is devastating when employed by someone who knows it well, (bruce lee started with wingchun) and the concepts used suit the batman perfectly. straightforward direct attacks, even when intercepting an attack. it's never block then stick, it's block and strike at the same time.

I don't think it should be the only style we see, but there should be a noticable amount.
KFM works good for him, but it needs to be balanced out for the sake of entertainment.
Kali and Sambo would be welcome additions

The batman should be able to destroy most opponents in a moment, with minimal effort and motion, Wingchun Kali and Sambo allow you to do this. No fancy spinkicks and what not, leave that for the acrobat in the redvest. The bat man just ruins your day in a couple quick motions and moves on to the next. This is what we want to see on screen, and with all the money we've given to WB over the years, I say they owe it to us

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Old 01-07-2012, 09:09 PM   #36
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Default Re: the fight scenes

To maintain the his edge on fear an illusion and whatever, we know batman is a crime fighter who sticks to the nights. First 2 films show him only fighting at night as batman. TDK actually had him saying that it's not wry subtle to be driving the batpod as batman in daylight, hence why he went to save the day as Bruce Wayne.

Now.....knowing all this....why are we seeing pictures and scenes of bagman fighting in broad daylight and even using his vehicles in board daylight, like the new batwing.........anyone else notice this and care to comment on it????

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Old 01-08-2012, 10:19 AM   #37
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Default Re: the fight scenes

If the fight scenes in The Dark Knight Rises can be like the ones in Warrior that would be cool. But its been common even in the comics that the Joker isnt a good fighter, there are very VERY few villains who can go up against Batman in a fight.

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Old 02-20-2012, 05:15 PM   #38
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Default Re: the fight scenes

How can there be a fight scene between Batman and Bane when Batman's suit is covered with jagged blades on the forearms? I mean think about how hard it would be to fight against someone, even someone a lot smaller and weaker than yourself, if the other person had those Shredder-style gauntlets. In the other movies they got around this issue by having the fights happen effectively off-camera, with only a few brief, unrevealing glimpses of the action, but in this movie the physical confrontation between Batman and Bane is such an important part of the movie, I don't see how they can get around showing it at least somewhat clearly.

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Old 03-04-2012, 08:44 AM   #39
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Default Re: the fight scenes

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Now.....knowing all this....why are we seeing pictures and scenes of bagman fighting in broad daylight and even using his vehicles in board daylight, like the new batwing.........anyone else notice this and care to comment on it????
It doesn't look like Batman is bringing his toys out - It seems to be Banes army.

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