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Old 05-01-2012, 03:12 AM   #276
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

Here is something that bugged me

Thor v Hulk, is very very iconic in terms of comic book history

Why then, in the movie, was the Hulk v Thor fight cut up into several small scenes?

It was already a very brief fight as it was, should have been a little longer, but then it got split into several smaller sections, to make it even worse!

WHY?

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Old 05-01-2012, 05:03 AM   #277
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A few things I didn't like :

1) The score. Just very bland and generic.
2) Almost zero tension. The world never seemed as if it was really in peril, despite the overwhelming odds.
3) The enemies were just cannon fodder and that's it. No motivations behind their actions, no insight into Loki's agenda - just very little meat to chew on. They were there too -- get smashed by the heroes and that's all the viewer needs to know. But I suppose that's just nitpicking since most people won't care once they're planted in their seats watching the spectacle unfold.
4) Second act did drag on (for me).

I have to admit, I really enjoyed this film despite the few flaws I thought it had. It was extremely entertaining. But I'll still take Batman Begins/Dark Knight over this any day of the week. Not because I like Batman, but because I think it's a much better film. More epic, more tension, more believability and more grounded.

Heck, just watching the new trailer for Dark Knight Rises puts you on edge because of the danger factor. It also feels far more epic. You don't need a team of superheroes to create an epic vibe at all.

But the thing is, I'm nitpicking here because I'm the type of person that prefers more adult, more grounded fiction. That's just me. Again, before anyone flames me, I enjoyed Avengers and I knew going in that I wouldn't be disappointed. It is the most entertained I've been in a long time and I like being entertained.

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Old 05-01-2012, 05:43 AM   #278
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

Nick Fury using a rocket launcher to bring down a jet was cool but to pull your puny handgun out for the other jet seemed kinda pointless.

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Old 05-01-2012, 05:47 AM   #279
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

The score was pretty bad, i didn't expect a great one because this isn't TDK, this film isn't about moods or colours it's about characters, dialogue and action, so a strong score isn't needed, unless you wanna overpower the audience and lose them, but i could have really done with a strong iconic theme befitting that of a team up as legendary as the Avengers, instead we got a really bland generic Silvestri score.

The usual dumb blockbuster thing of having faceless nameless aliens destroy faceless nameless humans, the end and the beginning had little moments from random people which if followed through could have given us reason to care about the cause that they are fighting for, just because it's earth doesn't mean we immediately care about it, you need to give us a personal connection so we feel the danger and peril.

Loki's army, just fodder for everyone to show their skills, i never felt any of them were in true danger by any of them.

Thor is serverely underused, i would have prefered if they explored his story with loki a little deeper and given him a better part in the finale.

Apart from that it was fantastic, clearly one of the best of the year, and probably my all time favourite marvel film (possibly even better than spider-man 2)

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Old 05-01-2012, 06:17 AM   #280
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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Originally Posted by Chewy View Post
Haven't you not seen the movie yet? Maybe you should wait before judging a scene

He wasn't just standing there talking
I've heard enough, Loki trying to exchange words with the embodiment of rage is just dumb no matter how you slice it.

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Old 05-01-2012, 06:21 AM   #281
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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Nick Fury using a rocket launcher to bring down a jet was cool but to pull your puny handgun out for the other jet seemed kinda pointless.

When Nick pulled out his gun it was a reflex action since that was the only other weapon he had. He immediately called Stark to chase down that missile once the plane took off.

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Old 05-01-2012, 06:21 AM   #282
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I've heard enough, Loki trying to exchange words with the embodiment of rage is just dumb no matter how you slice it.

Villanious Breakdown big time there

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Old 05-01-2012, 06:29 AM   #283
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I've heard enough, Loki trying to exchange words with the embodiment of rage is just dumb no matter how you slice it.
Dude got an arrow blown up in his face, as soon as he landed he got tackled by Hulk and thrown into a wall. Even a God of Mischief gets pissed at that point. So when he yelled "ENOUGH!" and began to rant, Hulk actually did stop for a moment to see what the fuss is about. Of course it didn't last for more than a couple seconds, before Hulk lost his patients. Also, let's not forget that this Loki isn't as powerful or has as many tricks as comic Loki. Comic Loki could have put up magical barriers, shoot magical blasts from his hands and stuff like that. All Movie Loki has done so far, is to create mirror images. He actually has to rely on weapons like Odin's Spear or the Scepter, for magical attacks.

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Old 05-01-2012, 06:31 AM   #284
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I do agree with those who felt the film was a little campy at times. I appreciate humour in a film but I felt they overused it, to their detriment. For example, when Hulk punched Thor after working together it just felt out of place. I can see how would find it funny, but it felt silly. RDJ tried "too hard" at times to be witty and cool. We know he is there for comedic relief and at times it's needed, but not all the time. Moderation is really the key here, they just grinded it out until it grated on my nerves.

Speaking of campy films, Spider Man 1 is a good example. It was cheesy, campy and that was the point - until the last act. That was tense as hell. Anyone remember that final fight? He was beaten badly, knocked through brick walls, shown to be extremely vulnerable etc. I cared about the character. I knew he would survive, but that wasn't the point. In Avengers I didn't care about anyone in this film because no one was in any real danger.

Josh needed to add more tension to this film. He needed to raise the stakes here. Perhaps show civilians being killed in the aftermath. It's one thing to imagine the death toll, but we don't need to and we should have to. He could have shown it, used a couple of scenes depicting the aftermath.

Like others, it kind of felt like the whole battle itself was irrelevant because Nick's nuke took out the mother ship. No need for any special super heroes, the army could have neutralised the threat if they felt the need. At no point was I concerned about the safety of the heroes, or even humanity. I never cared. When the mothership blew and the aliens just mysteriously died it was incredibly anti-climatic. I had a hole in my stomach after that. I expected more. I felt cheated. I know I'm sounding really negative here but in my mind this is not the perfect superhero movie, not by a long shot.

As it stands, I prefer Thor to Avengers and it has everything to do with the drama, not just the action. Thor wasn't the best action flick ever made, only a small percentage of the film was dedicated to action. I appreciated the character depth and the emotions from them. The film had heart. We got none of that in Avengers. I think the biggest issue is that the trailer made it look more epic than it turned out to be, but that's par for the course. I suspect if Josh spent another 20 minutes building up the characters, their relationships, making them more human and less cookie-cutter, it would have make me feel something. As it stands it's just action, action and more action and that's kind of what I expected, so I can't really fault them too much here.

It was a great action flick. I really enjoyed it and it did entertain me. But I would have preferred more depth. Perhaps they could rectify this in the sequel.


Last edited by Goliath; 05-01-2012 at 06:55 AM.
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Old 05-01-2012, 06:36 AM   #285
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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Originally Posted by Goliath View Post
A few things I didn't like :

1) The score. Just very bland and generic.
2) Almost zero tension. The world never seemed as if it was really in peril, despite the overwhelming odds.
3) The enemies were just cannon fodder and that's it. No motivations behind their actions, no insight into Loki's agenda - just very little meat to chew on. They were there too -- get smashed by the heroes and that's all the viewer needs to know. But I suppose that's just nitpicking since most people won't care once they're planted in their seats watching the spectacle unfold.
4) Second act did drag on (for me).

I have to admit, I really enjoyed this film despite the few flaws I thought it had. It was extremely entertaining. But I'll still take Batman Begins/Dark Knight over this any day of the week. Not because I like Batman, but because I think it's a much better film. More epic, more tension, more believability and more grounded.

Heck, just watching the new trailer for Dark Knight Rises puts you on edge because of the danger factor. It also feels far more epic. You don't need a team of superheroes to create an epic vibe at all.

But the thing is, I'm nitpicking here because I'm the type of person that prefers more adult, more grounded fiction. That's just me. Again, before anyone flames me, I enjoyed Avengers and I knew going in that I wouldn't be disappointed. It is the most entertained I've been in a long time and I like being entertained.
I'll take TDK over avengers but no way would I take batman begins over avengers. batman begins is overrated and the 3rd act is frankly boring.

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Old 05-01-2012, 06:44 AM   #286
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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Originally Posted by combocaz View Post
Nick Fury using a rocket launcher to bring down a jet was cool but to pull your puny handgun out for the other jet seemed kinda pointless.
Hence why he never fired a shot. Desperate as he was, even he knew it would be useless.

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Old 05-01-2012, 07:00 AM   #287
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I'll take TDK over avengers but no way would I take batman begins over avengers.
Interesting. With Avengers it's pretty much a case of style over substance. The exact opposite of Batman Begins or the Dark Knight. Both films are in a completely different category. Avengers is like a cartoon compared to either film.

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Old 05-01-2012, 07:12 AM   #288
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Interesting. With Avengers it's pretty much a case of style over substance. The exact opposite of Batman Begins or the Dark Knight. Both films are in a completely different category. Avengers is like a cartoon compared to either film.
I'd say Avengers is more like a comic book than the Batman films, even though the respective comics are also pretty different.

The different styles make different things work well. The darker Batman has it easier to feel serious and threatening, but on the other hand extreme things like the idealistic hero switching to supervillain in a short time works less well when it's a more realistic tone. The lighter and more epic Avengers has it easier to wow the audience with big things and make the heroes larger than life. On the flip side of that coin the lighter humor and so on can make it harder to reach the darker scenes.

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Old 05-01-2012, 07:15 AM   #289
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

It's quite simple, if you liked the other Marvel Movies, you'll like Avengers as well.

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Old 05-01-2012, 07:29 AM   #290
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

3D was useless.... in fact it made the things that are supposed to be closer to you look all blurry

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Old 05-01-2012, 07:41 AM   #291
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

Okay, after the initial hype of seeing it, I've been giving a lot of thought to why even in the midst of my own buzz from seeing it, I still wouldn't have given it a 10/10.

I immediately felt like something was missing.

It was incredibly fun, great one liners, got the whole cinema laughing. The action scenes were very well constructed, and all the main characters were so well written.

But the villains motivations and execution were just really really awful IMO.

I mean, he's literally yelling 'kneel' to a crowd of people, and I can't help thinking 'yeah, this villain is about as exciting as Zod in Superman 2, decades ago when villains where much more simplistic'.

What bugs me most about the failures in Loki's storyline, is that I completely loved him in Thor. I really felt for him, and I connected with his motivations.

But here he felt like a mixed bag of a villain.

One minute he'd be completely savage, or be saying something effectively menacing, and you'd think 'yeah, he's pretty badass'... And the next he'd be the butt end of a Whedon joke or doing something that made him look kind of dumb.

And it totally took away from the seriousness of the threat. It took away from the emotional impact for Thor. And it made Loki feel empty...

And then his defeat just cemented it.

Every good villain deserves a 'final showdown'. That last battle they've been waiting for with the object of their anger.

And IMO Loki deserved that. The movie needed that for closure of all the issues brought up in Thor, and throughout the movie.

Not to have his defeat be a comedy moment where Hulk bashes him around the room (as classic as that was, it didn't have to be his final defeat). And not to then simply say 'I'd like that drink now' like he's shrugging his shoulders and going 'oh well, guess you win'... Like he hadn't really been all that bothered

He should have had a one on one showdown with Thor IMO. That should have been his defeat. And with a dialogue that meant something to the story I.e. Loki would tell Thor, if he wants to stop him he's going to have to kill him, so it's clear he'll stop at NOTHING to get his revenge... And put some emotion into it. Make it obvious Loki is desperate because he can see he might not win. Bring out all his pent up resentment about being the second best to his perfect brother, the 'real son'... Make him push Thor right to the edge so he nearly does snap and kill him, but it'd end with a line like 'no I'm not like you, brother' or 'no, you don't get off that easy'. Something that makes a point.

Anything like that would have been a satisfying ending to the film. A satisfying conclusion to Loki's villainy since his discovery of his true origins.

What we got was the kind of villain you make 'sssss' noises at during a pantomime.

And it really is a dissapointment to me that they didn't treat him with more respect. It lowered the whole tone of the film.

And why Whedon? When I know for a fact that you know how to build up a villain's demise and finish it properly. When I've seen the amazing takes on villain motivations you've produced over the years.

Why did you pick this movie to have the villain we were supposed to be fearing the whole movie, be taken out in seconds by Hulk? To have the entire cinema laughing at him like 'hehe, stupid Loki, Hulk rocks!'

I have no idea why he decided to do that.

Unless it really was just because the entire film was taylor made for kids, and all they wanted was to have moments that's get kids talking in the payground.

Cause I'm sure if that was their intention, it worked like a charm

Just felt dissapointing to me, cause I expected it to be handled with a little bit more maturity.


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Old 05-01-2012, 08:09 AM   #292
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

I agree. The "God of Mischief" did not seem nearly mischievous enough. He's supposed to be a trickster. We saw it a number of times in Thor but he was useless in Avengers.

I understand and accept that Hulk would beat Loki easily in a physical fight. I just expected more from Loki. Perhaps create a diversion of sorts. Why not create duplicates of himself against Hulk? Do something? He could have kept Hulk preoccupied and eventually got the beat down that he did. But for it to end so abruptly was a little weak.

Loki must have had a death wish to think he could take on Hulk. His comments about being a "God" made no sense either. We all know that's not true. They can be killed, they're just tougher to kill. Frost giants could kill Asguardians pretty easily and they didn't strike me as being particularly powerful beings. I mean Odin had his eye taken out for god's sake by ice. Did Loki really expect to be able to beat Hulk physically? Or just stand there while being pounded into the earth? These are just advanced aliens, not literally Gods.

Oh well, at least Hulk was given an opportunity to curb stomp Loki in the ground and get the audience laughing which I suspect was the intention all along.

That's the problem : the audience shouldn't be laughing almost all the damn time. Even when Coulson died I laughed a little. It's like being shot and then having a final comedic send-off. I don't know if Josh intended for the audience to actually care about agent Coulson, but I certainly didn't.

I'm no filmmaker but even I realise that you need to back off at some point with the humour, otherwise it's all one big joke.


Last edited by Goliath; 05-01-2012 at 08:34 AM.
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Old 05-01-2012, 08:13 AM   #293
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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Originally Posted by hopefulsuicide View Post
Okay, after the initial hype of seeing it, I've been giving a lot of thought to why even in the midst of my own buzz from seeing it, I still wouldn't have given it a 10/10.

I immediately felt like something was missing.

It was incredibly fun, great one liners, got the whole cinema laughing. The action scenes were very well constructed, and all the main characters were so well written.

But the villains motivations and execution were just really really awful IMO.

I mean, he's literally yelling 'kneel' to a crowd of people, and I can't help thinking 'yeah, this villain is about as exciting as Zod in Superman 2, decades ago when villains where much more simplistic'.

What bugs me most about the failures in Loki's storyline, is that I completely loved him in Thor. I really felt for him, and I connected with his motivations.

But here he felt like a mixed bag of a villain.

One minute he'd be completely savage, or be saying something effectively menacing, and you'd think 'yeah, he's pretty badass'... And the next he'd be the butt end of a Whedon joke or doing something that made him look kind of dumb.

And it totally took away from the seriousness of the threat. It took away from the emotional impact for Thor. And it made Loki feel empty...

And then his defeat just cemented it.

Every good villain deserves a 'final showdown'. That last battle they've been waiting for with the object of their anger.

And IMO Loki deserved that. The movie needed that for closure of all the issues brought up in Thor, and throughout the movie.

Not to have his defeat be a comedy moment where Hulk bashes him around the room (as classic as that was, it didn't have to be his final defeat). And not to then simply say 'I'd like that drink now' like he's shrugging his shoulders and going 'oh well, guess you win'... Like he hadn't really been all that bothered

He should have had a one on one showdown with Thor IMO. That should have been his defeat. And with a dialogue that meant something to the story I.e. Loki would tell Thor, if he wants to stop him he's going to have to kill him, so it's clear he'll stop at NOTHING to get his revenge... And put some emotion into it. Make it obvious Loki is desperate because he can see he might not win. Bring out all his pent up resentment about being the second best to his perfect brother, the 'real son'... Make him push Thor right to the edge so he nearly does snap and kill him, but it'd end with a line like 'no I'm not like you, brother' or 'no, you don't get off that easy'. Something that makes a point.

Anything like that would have been a satisfying ending to the film. A satisfying conclusion to Loki's villainy since his discovery of his true origins.

What we got was the kind of villain you make 'sssss' noises at during a pantomime.

And it really is a dissapointment to me that they didn't treat him with more respect. It lowered the whole tone of the film.

And why Whedon? When I know for a fact that you know how to build up a villain's demise and finish it properly. When I've seen the amazing takes on villain motivations you've produced over the years.

Why did you pick this movie to have the villain we were supposed to be fearing the whole movie, be taken out in seconds by Hulk? To have the entire cinema laughing at him like 'hehe, stupid Loki, Hulk rocks!'

I have no idea why he decided to do that.

Unless it really was just because the entire film was taylor made for kids, and all they wanted was to have moments that's get kids talking in the payground.

Cause I'm sure if that was their intention, it worked like a charm

Just felt dissapointing to me, cause I expected it to be handled with a little bit more maturity.
While I thought the "I'll have that drink now" line was a bit too much, I felt like they handled Lokis demise quite well. That whole Thor might just snap and kill Loki was there when they had their little tussle. I liked it because that was basically Thor trying for one last time to reach out to his brother and try to make him redeem himself, but Loki makes the decision not to. That's what Thors been trying to do the whole movie, but Loki continues to refuse and even tries to kill his brother. So eventually Thor decides that enough is enough and he needs to take matters into his own hands. I don't think they needed another final showdown in a way that Thor and Loki basically do the same thing over again. I think it would have been better if they didn't go the Phantom Menace route and Loki would still try to make a final attempt with the forces that remained, but I don't know how that would exactly work. Either way I think Joss did a great job here, I'm still amazed how good it turned out to be.

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Old 05-01-2012, 08:18 AM   #294
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

Oh and btw I feel that whole Hulk smash Loki scene was just right. Loki's doing what he knows best, he's trying to use his silver tongue to get himself out of the situation, the problem is Hulk isn't the right person to try this tactic on. Besides I don't think he was prepared it would happen, when he speaks to Tony he says "I thought the beast had wandered off", he wasn't expecting Hulk to even show up much less help the heroes out.

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Old 05-01-2012, 09:32 AM   #295
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

The main reason why I would have liked the Hulk vs Loki thing to go a bit differently is that Hulk's weakness should be his intellect and then a trickster would be able to fool, or manipulate, him.

I like how Thor fails a few times when he just rushes in against Loki and I would have liked the theme, where brute force isn't the way to go against Loki, to have continued. If strength is all you need it becomes a bit too simple.

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Old 05-01-2012, 10:02 AM   #296
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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Considering how Loki knew who the Hulk was, it wasn't too far fetched that he knew Captain America too. Also, a couple of scans from The Avengers movie book had an extended dialogue.

Loki: "Ah, the Super-Soldier from the Great War"

Captain America: "It wasn't that great"

Loki: "Mine will be"
Wow, too bad they didn't use that,

I thought it would've been cool that in Loki's travels he had come across the Red Skull and that would've been how he heard of Captain America.

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Old 05-01-2012, 10:04 AM   #297
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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I've heard enough, Loki trying to exchange words with the embodiment of rage is just dumb no matter how you slice it.
It's not dumb. It's the ego of a supervillain. He also thought he still had control over his mind.

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Old 05-01-2012, 10:06 AM   #298
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

They don't like it because it's not TDKR :P

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Old 05-01-2012, 10:10 AM   #299
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

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I agree. The "God of Mischief" did not seem nearly mischievous enough. He's supposed to be a trickster. We saw it a number of times in Thor but he was useless in Avengers.

I understand and accept that Hulk would beat Loki easily in a physical fight. I just expected more from Loki. Perhaps create a diversion of sorts. Why not create duplicates of himself against Hulk? Do something? He could have kept Hulk preoccupied and eventually got the beat down that he did. But for it to end so abruptly was a little weak.

Loki must have had a death wish to think he could take on Hulk. His comments about being a "God" made no sense either. We all know that's not true. They can be killed, they're just tougher to kill. Frost giants could kill Asguardians pretty easily and they didn't strike me as being particularly powerful beings. I mean Odin had his eye taken out for god's sake by ice. Did Loki really expect to be able to beat Hulk physically? Or just stand there while being pounded into the earth? These are just advanced aliens, not literally Gods.

Oh well, at least Hulk was given an opportunity to curb stomp Loki in the ground and get the audience laughing which I suspect was the intention all along.

That's the problem : the audience shouldn't be laughing almost all the damn time. Even when Coulson died I laughed a little. It's like being shot and then having a final comedic send-off. I don't know if Josh intended for the audience to actually care about agent Coulson, but I certainly didn't.

I'm no filmmaker but even I realise that you need to back off at some point with the humour, otherwise it's all one big joke.
Completely agree.

Joss Whedon is usually so good at getting the balance right between humour and meaning. A few well placed 'quips', but also a few moments of reflection, emotion or tension that remind you just because the writer has a sense of humour, doesn't mean the episode/film is not dealing with anything serious.

But Avengers didn't deal with anything all that seriously. Not even Coulson's death had enough emotional impact. And it easily could have.

God, even the 'betrayal' of setting the nuke on the city was all hunky dory just cause they found a good use for it and the city didn't get blown up.

But I can over look stuff like that as long as the villain is taken seriously.

You don't take your villain seriously, and the whole plot becomes a bit of a joke in itself.

I mean, the had to get together the Avengers? Really, for that guy? The one Hulk easily pummled followed by a stereotypically comedic wheeze.

It made him look pathetic. It made him look like a joke.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComicForAWife View Post
While I thought the "I'll have that drink now" line was a bit too much, I felt like they handled Lokis demise quite well. That whole Thor might just snap and kill Loki was there when they had their little tussle. I liked it because that was basically Thor trying for one last time to reach out to his brother and try to make him redeem himself, but Loki makes the decision not to. That's what Thors been trying to do the whole movie, but Loki continues to refuse and even tries to kill his brother. So eventually Thor decides that enough is enough and he needs to take matters into his own hands. I don't think they needed another final showdown in a way that Thor and Loki basically do the same thing over again. I think it would have been better if they didn't go the Phantom Menace route and Loki would still try to make a final attempt with the forces that remained, but I don't know how that would exactly work. Either way I think Joss did a great job here, I'm still amazed how good it turned out to be.
But Loki's entire motivation was his hatred of Thor.

That's why there should have been a final showdown. There needed to be a resolution to that. They've been fighting each other for two whole movies now, he threatened to destroy an entire world just to get at him - I don't care how easily Hulk could defeat him, it should have been Thor's fight. It should have been personal.

Cause that's how you build the drama of the big finish.

Instead, all the 'big finish' was on a nuke being thrown through the hole, and Loki was treated like an annoyance of a secondary villain that needed to be swatted away.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComicForAWife View Post
Oh and btw I feel that whole Hulk smash Loki scene was just right. Loki's doing what he knows best, he's trying to use his silver tongue to get himself out of the situation, the problem is Hulk isn't the right person to try this tactic on. Besides I don't think he was prepared it would happen, when he speaks to Tony he says "I thought the beast had wandered off", he wasn't expecting Hulk to even show up much less help the heroes out.
Loki has never been portrayed as stupid enough to think Hulk would bow down to his silver tongue...

It was completely OOC IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mjölnir View Post
The main reason why I would have liked the Hulk vs Loki thing to go a bit differently is that Hulk's weakness should be his intellect and then a trickster would be able to fool, or manipulate, him.

I like how Thor fails a few times when he just rushes in against Loki and I would have liked the theme, where brute force isn't the way to go against Loki, to have continued. If strength is all you need it becomes a bit too simple.
Agreed

__________________
I think back to my father. As a farmer, he had a natural understanding for the Earth. I remember him telling me this world is capable of providing for all its creatures. Even now, with so many more people, there exists enough food for everyone.

"The problem," Pa used to say, "is people. As far back as we go, we've always had problems with sharing. Seems everyone's too busy holding on to what they've got to care how their neighbors are doing."


*\S/T*

Last edited by hopefuldreamer; 05-01-2012 at 10:21 AM.
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Old 05-01-2012, 10:13 AM   #300
SimiOfDoom
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Default Re: What people DIDN'T like from The Avenger ........Spoilers

Confronting Hulk verbally was a really stupid move, but clearly Loki was desperate. Loki is a Trickster, best with his tonuge and as long as he just played the Avengers against each other he had the upper hand; in combat though, expecially against Hulk or Thor, he has no chance. Even trying to take them on was a move of desperation.

The whole movie over (especially after the scene with that hooded guy) I got the feeling that Loki somewhere realized that he may has been playing out of his league, there are several moments where he and Thor confront each other and he hesitates, considers Thors offers to come back, before chosing to go on his way, since on one hand he wants nothing more than to be better than Thor and beat him and on the other hand hes driven by his fear of Thanos. The scene where the hooded guy spoke of torture Loki looked really uneasy.
Then he was thrown off Stark Tower, took an exploding arrow to the face and was blasted through a wall, in other words he once again realized that he´s physically unable to deal with all of them (just as Stark said). Cue his last attempt to stop Hulk. And Hulk hesitates for a moment, keep that in mind.

Also he NEEDED to be broken. He was driven largely by hubris; had they tried defeating him in a way where he still looked graceful there would be no chance of redemtion anymore, since he wouldn´t have realized that his way was the absolute wrong. He had to be humiliated badly, and they succeded in that.

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