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Old 06-08-2012, 11:03 AM   #76
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Got home from work and binged on new episodes up to Yellowjacket.

Relieved to see that the "Loebisodes" were not bad at all...Liked Assault on 42 and Yellowjacket especially, though I'm missing the Hulk a bit (which I never thought I would ever say!) Is it me, or is the tone getting a bit darker in the last few episodes?

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Old 06-08-2012, 12:19 PM   #77
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Tweet: I'm super bummed about EMH getting cancelled. It was quickly approaching JL/JLU levels of quality. Disagree with Mr. Loeb greatly.
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Wow... seriously?!! Speculate!

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Old 06-08-2012, 03:00 PM   #78
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Powerless-- written by MOA and Dani Wolf...
the weakest so far of the Loebisodes... the Destroyer being the only redeeming thing about the episode...

Assault on 42-- story by Chris Yost, Josh Fine, Mike Ryan and written by Brian Reed...
really strong episode with an Aliens feel to it... very exciting episode utilizing the Avengers and the prison inmates working together... satisfying...

Ultron Unlimited-- written by Chris Yost...
a welcome return of the Vision... an enjoyable Avengers vs the RoboAvengers battle as well as with Ultron, though he was dealt with too quickly and in too final a fashion...

Yellowjacket-- written by MOA and Jim Felder...
a remarkably good episode that excels in every way dealing with the mystery of YJ and Hank's dissatisfaction with the Avengers as well as the micro-prison breakdown...
an unbelievably GOOD ep which surprised me and caught me off guard, especially since it was an MOA effort...
and I ALWAYS liked YJ and preferred him to Ant-Man or Giant-Man...
ties with Assault on 42 for the strongest of these four episodes so far, IMHO...

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Old 06-08-2012, 04:58 PM   #79
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

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Originally Posted by THUNDERSTRIKE View Post
Powerless-- written by MOA and Dani Wolf...
the weakest so far of the Loebisodes... the Destroyer being the only redeeming thing about the episode...

Assault on 42-- story by Chris Yost, Josh Fine, Mike Ryan and written by Brian Reed...
really strong episode with an Aliens feel to it... very exciting episode utilizing the Avengers and the prison inmates working together... satisfying...

Ultron Unlimited-- written by Chris Yost...
a welcome return of the Vision... an enjoyable Avengers vs the RoboAvengers battle as well as with Ultron, though he was dealt with too quickly and in too final a fashion...

Yellowjacket-- written by MOA and Jim Felder...
a remarkably good episode
that excels in every way dealing with the mystery of YJ and Hank's dissatisfaction with the Avengers as well as the micro-prison breakdown...
an unbelievably GOOD ep which surprised me and caught me off guard, especially since it was an MOA effort...
and I ALWAYS liked YJ and preferred him to Ant-Man or Giant-Man...
ties with Assault on 42 for the strongest of these four episodes so far, IMHO...
TS- I am encouraged that you endorse this as a good episode because I know we both have our reservations about Loebisodes(andMoA) and Powerless wasn't helping that point either haha.

The source I use to watch EMH online finally has Yellowjacket on there and I will be watching it in minutes

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Old 06-08-2012, 06:22 PM   #80
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TS- I am encouraged that you endorse this as a good episode because I know we both have our reservations about Loebisodes(andMoA) and Powerless wasn't helping that point either haha.

The source I use to watch EMH online finally has Yellowjacket on there and I will be watching it in minutes

yeah, NOT a big fan of Loeb OR MoA, but I'd be interested in your thoughts on the Yellowjacket episode...

maybe the influence of Loeb, or especially MoA, just wasn't able to really dig their fingers in too deeply in the final few episodes that are left to air...

the basic groundwork for the remaining episodes were probably already laid out and too far ahead along the production track for them to do any REAL interference and damage... more than likely they came on board at a point where they just had to deal with what was already there and waiting... hence the relatively still good feel to the show...

hopefully, the remainder of Avengers EMH will remain stable and on a good course to the end...

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Old 06-09-2012, 02:22 AM   #81
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Tweet: I'm super bummed about EMH getting cancelled. It was quickly approaching JL/JLU levels of quality. Disagree with Mr. Loeb greatly.Wow... seriously?!! Speculate!
The show didn't get good ratings RIM. It's not a big secret. It was moved to Sundays due to low ratings at one point.

This is one thing the whiny fanboys refuse to acknowledge, the show wasn't getting the numbers.

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Old 06-09-2012, 02:29 AM   #82
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The show didn't get good ratings RIM. It's not a big secret. It was moved to Sundays due to low ratings at one point.

This is one thing the whiny fanboys refuse to acknowledge, the show wasn't getting the numbers.
It was also on a channel that alot of people don't have, I'm sure it's ratings would've been off the charts if it were on Cartoon Network.

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Old 06-09-2012, 07:53 AM   #83
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It was also on a channel that alot of people don't have, I'm sure it's ratings would've been off the charts if it were on Cartoon Network.
It airs on Cartoon Network in my country and I only go that channel for that particular show. So that's pretty much right.

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Old 06-09-2012, 11:32 AM   #84
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Wolverine and the x men and Iron man AA did well on Nicktoons.I think some new Marvel shows should go Cartoon Network and even Nick,they seem to know how to handle superhero shows better

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Old 06-09-2012, 05:22 PM   #85
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5



Well, only noticed it today. It looks like Emperor Stark episode takes place before Yellowjacket.

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Old 06-09-2012, 05:34 PM   #86
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Well, only noticed it today. It looks like Emperor Stark episode takes place before Yellowjacket.
It may be, but it's also possible Vision is just an animation gaff. The show has had a few of them. Like when Captain America had his intact shield at the end of the season one finale when Loki was being punished by Odin, even though the shield had been shattered earlier:


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Old 06-09-2012, 06:01 PM   #87
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Er, no offense but, an animation gaff that happens twice? I saw Vision talking to Johnny Storm in another scene.

The fact that he's kicking is...Wierd to say the least.


Speaking of Emperor Stark, has that been done in the comics? Any idea why Vision would wake up to a world where Tony is 'emperor?' We talking Cosmic Cube scenario or something?

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Old 06-09-2012, 06:54 PM   #88
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Yes, it's easily a gaff if the animators were told to just throw superheroes in the background of the memorial service, without bothering to check the status of the heroes on the show. They may have just used the animation model for Vision without thinking.

Now, I'm not saying it's definitely a mistake, but like I said, it's happened before. But, it could just as easily be a plot point.

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Old 06-09-2012, 09:53 PM   #89
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

I know I am far behind the curve in terms of reviewing episodes. But look at it like this; I am still ahead of the Disney XD schedule.

"POWERLESS" features a soulless monster who lives only to destroy everything before it. Can you tell this is the first episode written by MAN OF ACTION under the order of new TV czar Jeph Loeb? A cheap shot, yes, but this episode has it coming. It is the first, but not the last, episode helmed by "MAN OF ACTION", who I usually dub MAN OF AVERAGE, with increased influence by Loeb under the pressure of meeting scheduling deadlines - as Yost and Fine tell it. While I am fairly certain that is true, neither Yost or Fine could likely say outright, "Well, Loeb is the new boss and he wanted to throw his weight around a bit", and for all I know Loeb is a perfectly lovely man to work with and for. However, "ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN" is an underwhelming insult to the intelligence of viewers and if this episode is a sign of what later episodes of this show may devolve to, it will be vastly disappointing. It is said that in politics, Republicans are a voice forever standing in the way of progress screaming, "STOP"; in the realm of Marvel animation, that voice may be Loeb. This week it was announced that "A:EMH" was canceled and will be replaced by something that is hardly likely to match this in quality. It is easy to despair sometimes.

While I can say with relief that this was the worst of the four episodes I saw this week and the others all vastly rebound, this is very much an episode which wants to believe it is still 1982 instead of 2012. It has the trappings of the seasonal subplot but it handles it all poorly and regresses many characterizations, and is poorly written to boot. It seems very much like an episode written to meet a deadline, in other words. That is why I am willing to take Yost and Fine at their word at that. Say this about Loeb productions, they always get turned in at the bell. Still, even underwhelming that it is, "POWERLESS" still has a few decent nods to comic fans and is far better than "USM" offers.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
It begins innocently enough by reminding us that Loki was banished to some nasty realm by Odin at the end of last season, that Amora the Enchantress is still working under Surtur's influence, and that the Avengers are about to interrupt a standard bank truck robbery by the Wrecking Crew. Right off the bat I thought it was odd that there were only 75% of the Crew present; Piledriver was gone. Why? He'd always been with them before, such as in the micro episodes and in "GAMMA WORLD". Was it because it would have made the rest of the episode more difficult? At any rate, any sign of Amora's distress and inner turmoil about being Surtur's puppet from "THE BALLAD OF BETA RAY BILL" is gone and she's reverted to standard "I want to kill Thor" type. While she refuses to free Loki from his prison, she offers to cast a spell to weaken Thor before transporting his soul into the Destroyer armor so he can kill Thor for her. Is this revenge for Thor not killing her when she begged him to in "BALLAD OF BETA RAY BILL" or am I being generous? Is Amora completely under Surtur's thrall even without the glowing eyes or am I again being generous? At any rate, as the title suggests this is a "everyone loses their powers" episode.

There are certain plots that many cartoon shows have worn into the ground over the past 20-40 years to the point that every time I see them, I groan. These include "The Amnesia Episode", "The Mind Swap Episode", "The Shrinking Episode", "The Lose Your Powers Episode" and "The Fantastic Voyage Episode". By and large "A:EMH" avoided such mundane drivel, but right off the bat the first MAN OF AVERAGE episode uses one; never a good sign. With a blast of energy, Thor is tendered mortal (without Mjolnir), Steve Rogers is back to being a 98 lb. weakling, and Tony Stark is in his Mach 1 armor with zero science skill. Only Hawkeye is left uneffected, despite being near the zap zone. One major plot hole is how Amora describes her own spell to Loki. She claims it "removes physical power", which I suppose can explain Thor and Cap, but it's effect on Iron Man is baloney. I could see it maybe vanishing his armor away in the middle of a fight (which would be a major disadvantage), but the problem with taking away his science knowledge is that KNOWLEDGE IS NOT PHYSICAL POWER. If the beam effected Stark by taking away his science lore, then it SHOULD have effected Hawkeye and took away his archery skills. The second plot hole is that Amora claims that her spell could be broken "if Thor learns humility". Now, I can understand Amora being behind the times, but hasn't Thor already learned humility? A great chunk of Season 1 was about Thor learning to appreciate mortals more, especially after they rescued him from Loki and saved Asgard. Hell, to once again mention "BALLAD OF BETA RAY BILL", Thor was literally about to hand over Mjolnir to Bill so he could avenge his people and defeat Surtur because his quest was righteous; how much more humble can Thor be? Instead we have an entire episode of Thor whining about how frail it is to be mortal and sounding very much like he might have at the start of Season 1 (and I mean the micro-episodes) until he could learn his Very Important Lesson which is so obvious even the 6 year olds in the audience will roll their eyes and see it coming. Then this dismisses the sight of even 98 lb. weakling Rogers being capable of some amazing feats of physical stamina like being hit full on by Destroyer and still getting up to fight.

On top of that, Destroyer is described as Odin's unstoppable war armor, yet the four heroes do a perfectly good job of stopping it long enough for Thor to learn his moral of the week. Subway trains, sticks, and girders even stun it. I don't know if that was because Loki in general sucks as a fighter (he's more of a wizard than a warrior), or just bad writing. There are far better ways to write "unstoppable threat" episodes; Juggernaut usually gets those, and even Rhino got it in "SPECTACULAR SPIDER-MAN". In this episode Destroyer is more of a metallic bumbler, although again I don't know if that's simply because it was powered by Loki, who was acting very much like an 1980's villain here. In fact, the very idea of Thor having to learn humility by being willing to die as a mortal in battle against the Destroyer is so obviously cribbed from "THOR" that that film's screenwriters should get royalties from this episode. It's so lazy and second-hand.

There were some highlights. As usual, Hawkeye gets some of the best lines, and I liked the bit where he uses a spare bit of wood as an arrow; in the comics he was always making random objects into bows & arrows when he had to, way before "MACGUYVER" appeared. While Thor's whining was vastly out of character, I did like the nod to his Donald Blake persona with his walking stick bit, as well as to his old identity of Sigurd Jarlson with his overall design of his "mortal form".

This was a very average episode, at best. And while "average" is the peak of quality for "ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN", for "AVENGERS: EMH" is a nosedive in quality. A forgettable and virtually pointless episode, very close to being a waste of time. Such a shame that this may be Loki's last appearance in the show and it is in such a wasted endeavor such as this.
I am sure it technically exists to help build up the Surtur arc, but surely there were better methods to do it than this. While the subsequent episodes are all better than this - namely because Yost & the old writers do return for some of them - if this is a harbinger of more to come, then it is a shame indeed.

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Old 06-09-2012, 10:05 PM   #90
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Well, only noticed it today. It looks like Emperor Stark episode takes place before Yellowjacket.
You rule my man, you have kept this site AS current as humanly possible Aussie wise with these to-the-minute updates.

Thanks again for occupying my last 2 weeks with girthy AEMH marathons of which DISNEY S%$-D would NEVER provide with their god awful attempts at maniplating ratings with horrendous movie cross promotions. There's just not enough time on this Earth to wait for these dunderheads to meander through season 2, 22 minutes every 3 weeks...PUKE!! I'll be dead before they get through season 2.

That said, I assume you saw "Emperor Stark", so was that piggy backed by "Code Red"? Can you give us a lil plot synopsis of what you've seen? And when will these be available?


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Old 06-09-2012, 10:29 PM   #91
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It was also on a channel that alot of people don't have, I'm sure it's ratings would've been off the charts if it were on Cartoon Network.
If it were on CN, CN would be burying it in the schedule so no one could watch it ala Super Hero Squad.

It sort of sucks to hear but the ****** Disney tweencoms get much better ratings than this show on Disney XD.

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Old 06-09-2012, 10:30 PM   #92
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

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Originally Posted by Dread View Post
I know I am far behind the curve in terms of reviewing episodes. But look at it like this; I am still ahead of the Disney XD schedule.

"POWERLESS" features a soulless monster who lives only to destroy everything before it. Can you tell this is the first episode written by MAN OF ACTION under the order of new TV czar Jeph Loeb? A cheap shot, yes, but this episode has it coming. It is the first, but not the last, episode helmed by "MAN OF ACTION", who I usually dub MAN OF AVERAGE, with increased influence by Loeb under the pressure of meeting scheduling deadlines - as Yost and Fine tell it. While I am fairly certain that is true, neither Yost or Fine could likely say outright, "Well, Loeb is the new boss and he wanted to throw his weight around a bit", and for all I know Loeb is a perfectly lovely man to work with and for. However, "ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN" is an underwhelming insult to the intelligence of viewers and if this episode is a sign of what later episodes of this show may devolve to, it will be vastly disappointing. It is said that in politics, Republicans are a voice forever standing in the way of progress screaming, "STOP"; in the realm of Marvel animation, that voice may be Loeb. This week it was announced that "A:EMH" was canceled and will be replaced by something that is hardly likely to match this in quality. It is easy to despair sometimes.

While I can say with relief that this was the worst of the four episodes I saw this week and the others all vastly rebound, this is very much an episode which wants to believe it is still 1982 instead of 2012. It has the trappings of the seasonal subplot but it handles it all poorly and regresses many characterizations, and is poorly written to boot. It seems very much like an episode written to meet a deadline, in other words. That is why I am willing to take Yost and Fine at their word at that. Say this about Loeb productions, they always get turned in at the bell. Still, even underwhelming that it is, "POWERLESS" still has a few decent nods to comic fans and is far better than "USM" offers.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
It begins innocently enough by reminding us that Loki was banished to some nasty realm by Odin at the end of last season, that Amora the Enchantress is still working under Surtur's influence, and that the Avengers are about to interrupt a standard bank truck robbery by the Wrecking Crew. Right off the bat I thought it was odd that there were only 75% of the Crew present; Piledriver was gone. Why? He'd always been with them before, such as in the micro episodes and in "GAMMA WORLD". Was it because it would have made the rest of the episode more difficult? At any rate, any sign of Amora's distress and inner turmoil about being Surtur's puppet from "THE BALLAD OF BETA RAY BILL" is gone and she's reverted to standard "I want to kill Thor" type. While she refuses to free Loki from his prison, she offers to cast a spell to weaken Thor before transporting his soul into the Destroyer armor so he can kill Thor for her. Is this revenge for Thor not killing her when she begged him to in "BALLAD OF BETA RAY BILL" or am I being generous? Is Amora completely under Surtur's thrall even without the glowing eyes or am I again being generous? At any rate, as the title suggests this is a "everyone loses their powers" episode.

There are certain plots that many cartoon shows have worn into the ground over the past 20-40 years to the point that every time I see them, I groan. These include "The Amnesia Episode", "The Mind Swap Episode", "The Shrinking Episode", "The Lose Your Powers Episode" and "The Fantastic Voyage Episode". By and large "A:EMH" avoided such mundane drivel, but right off the bat the first MAN OF AVERAGE episode uses one; never a good sign. With a blast of energy, Thor is tendered mortal (without Mjolnir), Steve Rogers is back to being a 98 lb. weakling, and Tony Stark is in his Mach 1 armor with zero science skill. Only Hawkeye is left uneffected, despite being near the zap zone. One major plot hole is how Amora describes her own spell to Loki. She claims it "removes physical power", which I suppose can explain Thor and Cap, but it's effect on Iron Man is baloney. I could see it maybe vanishing his armor away in the middle of a fight (which would be a major disadvantage), but the problem with taking away his science knowledge is that KNOWLEDGE IS NOT PHYSICAL POWER. If the beam effected Stark by taking away his science lore, then it SHOULD have effected Hawkeye and took away his archery skills. The second plot hole is that Amora claims that her spell could be broken "if Thor learns humility". Now, I can understand Amora being behind the times, but hasn't Thor already learned humility? A great chunk of Season 1 was about Thor learning to appreciate mortals more, especially after they rescued him from Loki and saved Asgard. Hell, to once again mention "BALLAD OF BETA RAY BILL", Thor was literally about to hand over Mjolnir to Bill so he could avenge his people and defeat Surtur because his quest was righteous; how much more humble can Thor be? Instead we have an entire episode of Thor whining about how frail it is to be mortal and sounding very much like he might have at the start of Season 1 (and I mean the micro-episodes) until he could learn his Very Important Lesson which is so obvious even the 6 year olds in the audience will roll their eyes and see it coming. Then this dismisses the sight of even 98 lb. weakling Rogers being capable of some amazing feats of physical stamina like being hit full on by Destroyer and still getting up to fight.

On top of that, Destroyer is described as Odin's unstoppable war armor, yet the four heroes do a perfectly good job of stopping it long enough for Thor to learn his moral of the week. Subway trains, sticks, and girders even stun it. I don't know if that was because Loki in general sucks as a fighter (he's more of a wizard than a warrior), or just bad writing. There are far better ways to write "unstoppable threat" episodes; Juggernaut usually gets those, and even Rhino got it in "SPECTACULAR SPIDER-MAN". In this episode Destroyer is more of a metallic bumbler, although again I don't know if that's simply because it was powered by Loki, who was acting very much like an 1980's villain here. In fact, the very idea of Thor having to learn humility by being willing to die as a mortal in battle against the Destroyer is so obviously cribbed from "THOR" that that film's screenwriters should get royalties from this episode. It's so lazy and second-hand.

There were some highlights. As usual, Hawkeye gets some of the best lines, and I liked the bit where he uses a spare bit of wood as an arrow; in the comics he was always making random objects into bows & arrows when he had to, way before "MACGUYVER" appeared. While Thor's whining was vastly out of character, I did like the nod to his Donald Blake persona with his walking stick bit, as well as to his old identity of Sigurd Jarlson with his overall design of his "mortal form".

This was a very average episode, at best. And while "average" is the peak of quality for "ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN", for "AVENGERS: EMH" is a nosedive in quality. A forgettable and virtually pointless episode, very close to being a waste of time. Such a shame that this may be Loki's last appearance in the show and it is in such a wasted endeavor such as this.
I am sure it technically exists to help build up the Surtur arc, but surely there were better methods to do it than this. While the subsequent episodes are all better than this - namely because Yost & the old writers do return for some of them - if this is a harbinger of more to come, then it is a shame indeed.
JLU had an episode where they all get turned into kids. This episode was considerably better. Comics have done this before as well, de-powering characters.

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Old 06-09-2012, 11:02 PM   #93
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Exclamation Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

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JLU had an episode where they all get turned into kids. This episode was considerably better. Comics have done this before as well, de-powering characters.
"KID STUFF" was considerably better than "POWERLESS" to me if only because that was genuinely funny far more often, and even furthered the subplot of Batman and Wonder Woman's romantic tension in an adorable way. It's only flaw was the random appearance of Entrigan the Demon.

Moving on...

Coming off "POWERLESS", I needed a rebound and fortunately, "ASSAULT ON 42" is it. I was pleased to see Brian Reed and Chris Yost involved in the writing again; it seems Loeb & MAN OF ACTION didn't write EVERY episode of Season 2 after "BEHOLD...THE VISION", but at least from this week's ratio roughly half of them. That's actually better than I expected. "ASSAULT ON 42" sees a return to the infamous prison for super-villains as well as introducing and handling yet another Fantastic Four villain better than an actual Fantastic Four show did. This episode also sees a return of suspense, with some nods owed to "ALIEN" and all that.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The episode begins with Cap, Thor, Ms. Marvel, and Wasp escorting Whirlwind to what they hope is a longer stint in 42 than his last; the fact that the prison exists in the Negative Zone where there seems to be nothingness is cemented, only this time something ominous is in the air. Of all the villains in 42, it is the Leader (a returning Jeffrey Combs) who senses the incoming terror the most. While the heroes aren't quick to believe this and some consider it some sort of ploy, it becomes very real when the prison is attacked by nasty looking bugs. They're capable of rending metal and tearing through SHIELD guards. Before long the heroes are trapped on 42 and their task is to hold the line and prevent the bugs from making it back to their world when the next shift of guards returns in two hours - no matter the cost. We get to see many old villains from the previous two seasons and much like in "PRISONERS OF WAR", the heroes have to trust their backs to at least some of their enemies if they hope to live. Once again, Capt. America gives a stirring speech which recruits some added help. There is a nod to "WELCOME TO THE KREE EMPIRE" with Ms. Marvel willing to allow Mar-Vell to aid in the crisis, although Cap's refusal to accept aid from Zemo is naturally a sign of his difference from "Skrull-Cap", who both was willing to accept Zemo's aid and then betray him. While most of the villains refuse, the Avengers get aid from Radioactive Man, Absorbing Man, Abomination, Whirlwind, Skurge the Executioner, a few spare AIM grunts, Leader, and Blizzard. Blizzard in particular continued to remind me of DC's Capt. Cold in his design, and Whirlwind's line about slicing Wasp up when it was over came off more disturbing than quite a few of the bugs themselves. I liked how via good cutaways and storyboards - as well as some horrific screams from the ADR department - it was heavily implied that not all the SHIELD or AIM grunts survived their encounters with the bugs without offending a censorship board. We also got neat little character bits with some of the villains such as Thor and Skurge finding some common ground as Asgardians, and Absorbing Man's loyalty (to a degree) to the Leader. Cap offered any villains who aided them positive word with a parole board, and since both Radioactive Man and Blizzard were Thunderbolts in the comics, could that team emerge this season?

The villain of the piece was Annihilus, a villain Yost utilized in "FANTASTIC FOUR: WORLD'S GREATEST HEROES" to decent effect initially until later focusing on comedy. This episode plays him dead straight as the warlord of a bug empire and using Leader to "communicate" his intentions rather than give Annihilus some squeaky voice was a good move - and another nod to horror films. Naturally, exposition about Annihilus feeling the invasion of positive matter in the Negative Zone and wanting to spite it is ripped from ANNIHILATION, but it's all good stuff. A part of me did wonder where the Guardians Of The Galaxy were, but it was already a busy episode. Fighting endless waves of bugs can get repetitive so the episode's crew wisely played up the suspense of the situation, of being trapped in a void with a skeleton crew of allies and enemies attempting to not only survive, but hold back an invasion. As always with most of these characters, the character model for Annihilus played up his classic design while still making it kick ass. Dr. Doom, the Skrulls, and now Annihilus, all handled better than I've ever seen an FF show handle them.

Last season, I thought casting Jeffrey Combs as the Leader was brilliant, and that "GAMMA WORLD" was the best version of Hulk's arch nemesis ever put to animation, or perhaps even the screen in general. Therefore, I was incredibly pleased to see the Leader return and actually play a crucial role in the episode. While the episode did demand that Leader wail in agony a lot, he was more or less the MVP of the mission.

If the episode has any flaw, it is that the ending seemed a little abrupt. Yes, the heroes successfully drove off the horde and prevented them from invading earth, and welcomed the new shift. But obviously, a lot of work would have to be done to either fortify the prison or move it entirely out of the Negative Zone. What was to stop Annihilus from returning with an even larger horde the next time, and who knows when THAT would be? I suppose there's only so much one episode can do and winning the battle was still crucial, I just found the ending a tad more abrupt than I expected.


Overall, great to see some returning villains, as well as some effective use of suspense and horror techniques to execute what could have been a generic episode if left in poorer hands. In interviews Yost and/or Craig Kyle desired to do a Brood story with the X-Men or anyone and I like to think this episode was perhaps as close as Yost could get with that in "A:EMH". A very great rebound from "POWERLESS", which the show drastically needed to restore faith.

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Old 06-09-2012, 11:36 PM   #94
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Next up from the land down under is "ULTRON UNLIMITED", which was probably the crowning jewel of the four episodes I saw this week. It is an episode that Chris Yost seemed to write personally, which is often a sign of passion and quality to come. The villain of the piece is obvious in the title and it is very much a sequel to "BEHOLD...THE VISION" and even in a grander sense, "THE ULTRON IMPERATIVE" last season. While it isn't nearly as good as "UI" was - likely because it only had two episodes of build up as opposed to 3 plus - it still provided a very exciting and at times spooky confrontation with one of the Avengers nearest and dearest foes.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
At the end of "BEHOLD...THE VISION" we learned that Ultron was not only reborn, but had sired a "son" to run errands for him - which included stealing supplies to build a better body for himself. While Vision failed to claim Vibranium, he did deliver all the Adamantium from Weapon X that Ultron needed. Peter Jessop reprises his role as Vision and Tom Kane especially returns as Ultron, and as always Kane is KILLER as the menacing mechanoid. This time Ultron's plan is to capture all of the Avengers and replace them with his "visions of the future", which are emotionless robot duplicates who operate on all logic and zero emotion. To this end Ultron has to capture the Avengers one by one and implant an "uplink" device to the base of the Avengers' skulls to keep them under and I presume download enough of their "data" into their robot doubles. Much like "ASSAULT ON 42" and even "GAMMA WORLD", the episode uses cut-away horror techniques to never quite show exactly where the implants go, implying they're somewhere terrible and painful. The only exception to Ultron's scheme is as usual, the Wasp, who he plans to download into his robotic bride, Jocasta. A part of me does find it ironic that Hank Pym often seems to avoid Janet of late, yet his robotic creation can't seem to get enough of her. Ultron himself sports a new design to go with his Adamantium body, which also bares some inspiration from Ultron's design in ANNIHILATION CONQUEST, and is bad-ass.

I was surprised to see this episode show such a nasty looking burn on Wasp's shoulder and the crux of this episode is Vision's ultimate rebellion against Ultron. In "BEHOLD...THE VISION", Vision was both confused and fascinated - if not frustrated - by the human willingness to continue to fight despite logically impossible odds. While Vision seemed far less powerful in this episode - either he was holding back or some of the damage he suffered via Black Panther's tactics couldn't be totally repaired - he once again got a refresher course in human determination from the determinator himself, Captain America. Speaking of Cap, I called immediately that he was impersonating his duplicate, and I was glad Ultron wasn't fooled either. I was surprised Thor or the others didn't immediately fear their doubles were the result of more Skrulls, although Hawkeye at least makes a reference to that. It was especially strange to see an Ultron battle without Pym (or the Hulk), and I did like the nod to the previous season where Ultron determined that Thor was his greatest physical threat, and later on Thor would prove him right. The little scene between Cap and Hawkeye at the start was good, and while Wasp continues to get beat up a lot in this show, I did like how she was the one to cut through Ultron's bull of attempting to be apart from humanity, yet desperate to replicate at least part of the experience via "building himself a girlfriend" or even a son.

I did find Vision's "solution" to helping defeat Ultron a little crude, which is probably why I don't consider this as good as Ultron's first appearance. In this case it was a sequel which wasn't quite as good as the original. That said, it was still a very good episode spotlighting another memorable confrontation with one of the franchise's best villains with some great character designs and acting from the VA booth. Corey Burton gets a lot of well deserved praise as Brainiac in DC Animation, and I feel Tom Kane deserves similar credit for his role as Ultron here, which he did reprise since being originally cast in the role in the DTV "NEXT AVENGERS" years back. Kane's Ultron was arguably the best thing about that flick, and it is great that this series gave him better heroes to battle against. I did find the ending scene with Vision touching, although some fans may be miffed that it didn't include the "even an android can cry" moment from the comics. Personally I think it might have been a little over the top in this particular episode, so I didn't miss it and thought the scene was still effective. Overall, considering Vision's last TV appearance was in the dreadful "AVENGERS: UNITED THEY STAND" from 1999-2000, this show has done a great deal to redeem him as well. In it Vision's been both a mysterious bad-ass as well as the robot who wants to be a man that Avengers fans know and love. Even if Wasp was still right on to complain about his choice of colors.


Great episode; not the best the show has ever done with Ultron, but still a damn good time and an effective use of the title villain. I got a great kick out of it and this was easily my favorite episode since "SECRET INVASION".

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Old 06-09-2012, 11:41 PM   #95
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Thumbs up Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dread View Post
"KID STUFF" was considerably better than "POWERLESS" to me if only because that was genuinely funny far more often, and even furthered the subplot of Batman and Wonder Woman's romantic tension in an adorable way. It's only flaw was the random appearance of Entrigan the Demon.

Moving on...

Coming off "POWERLESS", I needed a rebound and fortunately, "ASSAULT ON 42" is it. I was pleased to see Brian Reed and Chris Yost involved in the writing again; it seems Loeb & MAN OF ACTION didn't write EVERY episode of Season 2 after "BEHOLD...THE VISION", but at least from this week's ratio roughly half of them. That's actually better than I expected. "ASSAULT ON 42" sees a return to the infamous prison for super-villains as well as introducing and handling yet another Fantastic Four villain better than an actual Fantastic Four show did. This episode also sees a return of suspense, with some nods owed to "ALIEN" and all that.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The episode begins with Cap, Thor, Ms. Marvel, and Wasp escorting Whirlwind to what they hope is a longer stint in 42 than his last; the fact that the prison exists in the Negative Zone where there seems to be nothingness is cemented, only this time something ominous is in the air. Of all the villains in 42, it is the Leader (a returning Jeffrey Combs) who senses the incoming terror the most. While the heroes aren't quick to believe this and some consider it some sort of ploy, it becomes very real when the prison is attacked by nasty looking bugs. They're capable of rending metal and tearing through SHIELD guards. Before long the heroes are trapped on 42 and their task is to hold the line and prevent the bugs from making it back to their world when the next shift of guards returns in two hours - no matter the cost. We get to see many old villains from the previous two seasons and much like in "PRISONERS OF WAR", the heroes have to trust their backs to at least some of their enemies if they hope to live. Once again, Capt. America gives a stirring speech which recruits some added help. There is a nod to "WELCOME TO THE KREE EMPIRE" with Ms. Marvel willing to allow Mar-Vell to aid in the crisis, although Cap's refusal to accept aid from Zemo is naturally a sign of his difference from "Skrull-Cap", who both was willing to accept Zemo's aid and then betray him. While most of the villains refuse, the Avengers get aid from Radioactive Man, Absorbing Man, Abomination, Whirlwind, Skurge the Executioner, a few spare AIM grunts, Leader, and Blizzard. Blizzard in particular continued to remind me of DC's Capt. Cold in his design, and Whirlwind's line about slicing Wasp up when it was over came off more disturbing than quite a few of the bugs themselves. I liked how via good cutaways and storyboards - as well as some horrific screams from the ADR department - it was heavily implied that not all the SHIELD or AIM grunts survived their encounters with the bugs without offending a censorship board. We also got neat little character bits with some of the villains such as Thor and Skurge finding some common ground as Asgardians, and Absorbing Man's loyalty (to a degree) to the Leader. Cap offered any villains who aided them positive word with a parole board, and since both Radioactive Man and Blizzard were Thunderbolts in the comics, could that team emerge this season?

The villain of the piece was Annihilus, a villain Yost utilized in "FANTASTIC FOUR: WORLD'S GREATEST HEROES" to decent effect initially until later focusing on comedy. This episode plays him dead straight as the warlord of a bug empire and using Leader to "communicate" his intentions rather than give Annihilus some squeaky voice was a good move - and another nod to horror films. Naturally, exposition about Annihilus feeling the invasion of positive matter in the Negative Zone and wanting to spite it is ripped from ANNIHILATION, but it's all good stuff. A part of me did wonder where the Guardians Of The Galaxy were, but it was already a busy episode. Fighting endless waves of bugs can get repetitive so the episode's crew wisely played up the suspense of the situation, of being trapped in a void with a skeleton crew of allies and enemies attempting to not only survive, but hold back an invasion. As always with most of these characters, the character model for Annihilus played up his classic design while still making it kick ass. Dr. Doom, the Skrulls, and now Annihilus, all handled better than I've ever seen an FF show handle them.

Last season, I thought casting Jeffrey Combs as the Leader was brilliant, and that "GAMMA WORLD" was the best version of Hulk's arch nemesis ever put to animation, or perhaps even the screen in general. Therefore, I was incredibly pleased to see the Leader return and actually play a crucial role in the episode. While the episode did demand that Leader wail in agony a lot, he was more or less the MVP of the mission.

If the episode has any flaw, it is that the ending seemed a little abrupt. Yes, the heroes successfully drove off the horde and prevented them from invading earth, and welcomed the new shift. But obviously, a lot of work would have to be done to either fortify the prison or move it entirely out of the Negative Zone. What was to stop Annihilus from returning with an even larger horde the next time, and who knows when THAT would be? I suppose there's only so much one episode can do and winning the battle was still crucial, I just found the ending a tad more abrupt than I expected.


Overall, great to see some returning villains, as well as some effective use of suspense and horror techniques to execute what could have been a generic episode if left in poorer hands. In interviews Yost and/or Craig Kyle desired to do a Brood story with the X-Men or anyone and I like to think this episode was perhaps as close as Yost could get with that in "A:EMH". A very great rebound from "POWERLESS", which the show drastically needed to restore faith.
Dread you're right on point as usual but this "Powerless" goes back waayy before JLU and "Kids Stuff". I think SUPERFRIENDS did it like at least 3x to my knowledge.

-There was an episode with Dr. Frankenstein that drained Batman,Superman, Wonder Woman's powers onto his new creation and ROBIN (Hawkeye) was the only one at full strength to pull the team through as he eventually absorbed their remaining powers to fight the SF monster

-Another ep where Aquaman, Superman, and Wonder Woman got turned into the Scarecrow, Tin-man, and Lion from THE WIZARD OF OZ by Mxyp and stripped them of most of their powers.

-Another one was CHALLENGE OF THE SFs called "World's Deadliest Game" where Green Lantern, Wonder Woman, Batman and Robin lost their powers and gadgets and the LOD hunted them for sport.

-As well as another where the SF's got turned into kids which I think was a 7 minute short in those weird early 80s seasons.

-Also X-MEN 90's second season finale "Reunion" had the team in the Savage Land lose all their powers for a while an have to fight without them against The Nasty Boys.

-Also the mid 90s FANTASTIC FOUR brilliant 2nd season (the best FF ever by far) had an episode with Daredevil (Hawkeye) called "A Blind Man Shall Lead Them" where the FF lost all their powers and had to tackle Dr. Doom. Daredevil DIDN'T lose his power(s) and abilities and had to hold their hands.

etc etc. But I was done with that cliche' by SUPERFRIENDS. FANTASTIC FOUR toons are OBSESSED with that plot device and completely beat it death. So like you, seeing this tired cliche' in a 2012 toon just made my brain flatline. ESPECIALLY after you just had Cap in a friggin Skrull prison for 9 eps and Thor was dry humping Asgard/Midguard. The LAST thing I wanted to see Cap and Thor not at full strength at that point where they're fighting a very cool nemesis in THE WRECKING CREW, Cap's first interaction with them.

And although I despise it, didn't that hideous FF WGH from a few years ago have a few eps where they lost their powers as well?


P.S. "Dread, did I miss your "Along Came a Spidey" review? I feel like you may not have posted that along with the "Behold the Vision" debut???


Last edited by Arthur Curry; 06-09-2012 at 11:46 PM.
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Old 06-10-2012, 01:12 AM   #96
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Exclamation Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

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Dread you're right on point as usual but this "Powerless" goes back waayy before JLU and "Kids Stuff". I think SUPERFRIENDS did it like at least 3x to my knowledge.

-There was an episode with Dr. Frankenstein that drained Batman,Superman, Wonder Woman's powers onto his new creation and ROBIN (Hawkeye) was the only one at full strength to pull the team through as he eventually absorbed their remaining powers to fight the SF monster

-Another ep where Aquaman, Superman, and Wonder Woman got turned into the Scarecrow, Tin-man, and Lion from THE WIZARD OF OZ by Mxyp and stripped them of most of their powers.

-Another one was CHALLENGE OF THE SFs called "World's Deadliest Game" where Green Lantern, Wonder Woman, Batman and Robin lost their powers and gadgets and the LOD hunted them for sport.

-As well as another where the SF's got turned into kids which I think was a 7 minute short in those weird early 80s seasons.

-Also X-MEN 90's second season finale "Reunion" had the team in the Savage Land lose all their powers for a while an have to fight without them against The Nasty Boys.

-Also the mid 90s FANTASTIC FOUR brilliant 2nd season (the best FF ever by far) had an episode with Daredevil (Hawkeye) called "A Blind Man Shall Lead Them" where the FF lost all their powers and had to tackle Dr. Doom. Daredevil DIDN'T lose his power(s) and abilities and had to hold their hands.

etc etc. But I was done with that cliche' by SUPERFRIENDS. FANTASTIC FOUR toons are OBSESSED with that plot device and completely beat it death. So like you, seeing this tired cliche' in a 2012 toon just made my brain flatline. ESPECIALLY after you just had Cap in a friggin Skrull prison for 9 eps and Thor was dry humping Asgard/Midguard. The LAST thing I wanted to see Cap and Thor not at full strength at that point where they're fighting a very cool nemesis in THE WRECKING CREW, Cap's first interaction with them.

And although I despise it, didn't that hideous FF WGH from a few years ago have a few eps where they lost their powers as well?


P.S. "Dread, did I miss your "Along Came a Spidey" review? I feel like you may not have posted that along with the "Behold the Vision" debut???
My "ALONG CAME A SPIDER" review is here: http://forums.superherohype.com/show...&postcount=999

Keep in mind that when I mentioned certain episode themes, I didn't JUST mean superhero episodes. Plenty of other shows had "the amnesia episode", "the shrinking episode", "the powerless episode", etc. Off the top of my head, "HE-MAN AND THE MASTERS OF THE UNIVERSE" had "HE-MAN'S QUEST" as the amnesia episode, written by Paul Dini no less - and it was dreadful. Seriously, He-Man fights a purple rabbit named Plunder.

"FANTASTIC FOUR: WORLD'S GREATEST HEROES" didn't have a "everyone loses their powers" episode, but they DID have a mind-swap episode ("DOOMED"), the shrinking episode ("WORLD'S TINIEST HEROES"), the amnesia episode ("THE CURE"), and the power-swap episode ("BAIT AND SWITCH"). Now, that isn't to say one can't make a good episode out of these endlessly repeated plots. "THE CURE" for instance was written by Dan Slott and was easily the best episode of the show. "JLU" did "THE GREAT BRAIN ROBBERY" swapping Flash's mind with Lex Luthor and it was also handled well. Usually, though, they wind up bland.

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Old 06-10-2012, 02:01 AM   #97
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

Episode 44, "YELLOWJACKET", is a return of writing duties by MAN OF ACTION after a refreshing two episode detour back into quality. In fairness, though, this is a much better episode than "POWERLESS" was. In fact I'd argue it's the best episode of Marvel Animation that MAN OF ACTION has yet written. Hey, a 1:10 ratio isn't too bad, is it? Yes, yes it is. But let's appreciate the one. That said, it did repeat a plot gimmick which is common in many cartoon shows and it is certainly one of the stranger episodes of the show's run in my opinion.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
This episode picks up after "TO STEAL AN ANT-MAN" but in many ways it picks up the Hank Pym subplot left from last season. By that I mean, this is the episode where Hank Pym goes bat-**** crazy. To be honest, this was not a character turn I was looking forward to, even though I know it is usually what Pym is best known for. The problem is in recent years those negative traits have become so exaggerated by writers such as Brian Bendis and Mark Millar that to many, the ONLY thing Hank Pym is known for is being a maniac who hit his wife and made Ultron. There was plenty of stuff he did before and after. It is worth noting that Spider-Man once had a story where he went buggy (catch the pun) and hit his wife MJ in the 90's - a moment even immortalized in "SPIDER-MAN 3" - yet almost nobody merely refers to Spider-Man as "the guy who hit his wife". Hell, Mr. Fantastic's on and off verbal abuse and belittlement of Invisible Girl throughout the 60's and 70's is something that's rarely mentioned and at worst he's neglectful because he's busy being awesome. My point is that when a character is only defined by their flaws and worst moments, they become a shell rather than something interesting. I feared how this show would handle Pym and more often than not I was pleased. Sure, he was always odd and neurotic, but he wasn't some deranged maniac and served well in their role as science hero. Well, this episode changes all that - Hank Pym goes insane. Thankfully, no Wasps were hit in the making of this episode.

Tony Stark and Janet visit Pym in his college campus lab, and find it in complete disarray, along with Pym himself. He's unshaven and rambling like a mad-man about his new "Big House" prison, the shrunken down prison he ran for SHIELD before the Avengers assembled during "THE BREAK OUT". Concerned for both his mental health and his unsafe use of dangerous materials, Tony and Jan want him to come with them for help...until Pym is blown up. We get a funeral for Ant-Man (although why nobody remembers he was Giant-Man half the time is beyond me) in which virtually every superhero who has shown up before turns up - including Vision, Iron Fist, Luke Cage, and the Fantastic Four. The team in general and Janet in particular are crushed to have lost their founding comrade in such a random manner, until it stands revealed that Pym's death was no accident - the explosion was deliberately triggered. Pym had been keeping tabs on the Serpent Society, although a new vigilante has emerged in NYC. He's named Yellowjacket and his theme appears to be blasting the members of the Serpent Society to nothingness, commanding swarms of bees, flying without wings, and talking in some borderline ridiculous "Dirty Harry" imitation dialogue. The idea of someone stealing Pym's inventions and using it without him is naturally also a theme from "TO STEAL AN ANT-MAN", something Pym settled on his own with the Heroes for Hire (although presumably the Avengers may eventually notice a new Ant-Man running around). While there is no love for the Serpent Society, this Yellowjacket is considered unstable and the Avengers seek to bring him in - especially when he brags about being the one who killed Pym. And who is Yellowjacket? Despite having a different body type and signature, Wasp is sure it's Pym - call it her "Psycho Man Sense" which attracted Michael Korvac to her. It turns out that she's right, only Yellowjacket appears to be a completely new personality who considers Pym someone else and someone "weaker", worthy of being killed off. Just when everyone is a mix of enraged and confused as hell, Yellowjacket's gun gets mangled and everyone is trapped in his new "Big House" prison; only now it is shrinking out of control and about to crush them all.

Thus we get another episode in which some Avengers are stuck in a situation where they're all about to die and they have to ask the Serpent Society for help, and the Serpents instead battle them to the last. This happened in "ALONG CAME A SPIDER" and with King Cobra in "PRISONERS OF WAR", practically. At the very least, they're consistent villains. Viper herself isn't anywhere to be seen but to be honest she'd probably have cluttered the episode further. There is a bit of "the shrinking episode" gimmick here as everyone is shrunken and that's about to kill them, but thankfully it isn't run into the ground like "POWERLESS" was. Apparently Yellowjacket is better at zapping people and talking in a raspy voice than he is at science, so everyone has to eventually shake Pym out of him to save the day. Then comes the weird ending where Pym is still very much in his new personality as Yellowjacket and mad as a hatter, yet the Avengers still keep him aboard - mostly because Wasp begs them. I know this is from the comics but as an episode in itself on TV, it all seems very bizarre.

Remember an episode of "THE NEW GOTHAM ADVENTURES" called "JUDGEMENT DAY" from 1998? In that episode Harvey Dent, who already has a split personality as Two-Face, develops a third personality as "The Judge", a brutal vigilante. None of the personalities are aware of the other to the point that the Judge wants to kill Two-Face and vice versa. At the end of the episode, Dent naturally winds up in his usual straight jacket in Arkham. Imagine if years later in "JLU" when they expanded the roster, Batman went to his pals and said, "Look, Harvey Dent used to be my friend and a good D.A., and he's a total lunatic, but when he's the Judge he could be good back-up if we encourage him to not be as violent and not switch to Two-Face. So how about we induct the Judge into the team and I'll monitor him." At that point I imagine everyone would look at Batman and assume he was telling a dark joke, but this episode of "A:EMH" comes very close to that. On the other hand, the Creeper WAS very much a member of the expended "JLU", and Batman was very much aware that The Creeper was a completely insane TV reporter who was dunked into chemicals by Joker but wound up so crazy that even Joker wanted away from him. "BEWARE THE CREEPER" ended with Batman insisting that Jack Ryder take patches to prevent becoming "The Creeper", but he obviously didn't and Batman apparently later was just fine having him join the "JLU" alongside Supergirl, Steel, Green Arrow and the rest. And while I am playing Devil's Advocate, "A:EMH" made it very clear that the Hulk was Bruce Banner's second personality, to the point that they would "talk" to each other within their minds only to everyone else it would look like Banner or Hulk were talking to themselves. The Avengers were therefore just fine with having Banner's split persona who disliked Banner be a founding member of the team because he was good at smashing. So I guess the moral is that if you're insane and dress in a costume and take politicians hostage (like Lock-Up in "LOCK-UP", from "B:TAS" circa 1994), you're a criminal and you go down. But if you're insane and dress in a costume and basically scare the wits out of criminals like the Creeper or Yellowjacket, than instead of a padded cell you too can join the earth's mightiest heroes!

Still, as crazy as Hulk and Banner may be, the Hulk never tried to KILL Banner in the presence of the Avengers - although he did make Banner agree to become the secondary persona in exchange for Hulk being a hero. Yellowjacket tried to blow up "Pym", and nearly killed Wasp if not for Iron Man, and basically kidnapped the Serpent Society against their will very much like Lock-Up would do to criminals. This also seemed sudden because there was no obvious "trigger" for Pym; he's been trying to quit being a superhero almost since he became an Avenger, and now all of a sudden he makes a personality who is a hardcore vigilante? I do suppose it is a slow burn thing; the "Big House" failed, he failed to rehabilitate any of the super-villains, he built Ultron and Ultron turned on him, and his Ant-Man gear was stolen from under him by a janitor. The bit in the comics where Pym desired Wasp's approval doesn't work because in this series, Wasp usually did approve of him; Pym usually rejected it to deny being a hero unless she was in trouble in his presence.

I'll be blunt; I have NEVER liked Yellowjacket. It just never sat with me, neither the design or the brash demeanor. Pym's worst moments were under that persona, to the point that in the comic book SECRET INVASION, his Skrull imposter took that form. I could accept Giant-Man or Ant-Man but I always preferred just Doctor Pym from the 90's; no limitations or gimmicks and just pure science hero. After all, almost nobody still calls Reed Richards "Mister Fantastic". Thus, while this episode did do a lot to try to make Yellowjacket seem edgy and threatening - mission accomplished - it's a turn that I haven't been eager for regardless of who wrote it. I'm not entirely thrilled that the last we see of Pym in this show as it winds down is as the insane Yellowjacket, the house nut who is there to fill the "unstable member spot" left void by the Hulk lately. While it is all interesting and holds my attention, I certainly prefer Season 1 Pym to Season 2 Pym.


Overall, though, still a decent episode and the best from MAN OF ACTION yet. Which, trust me, was not a very high bar.

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Old 06-10-2012, 04:20 AM   #98
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

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Originally Posted by venomfangs125 View Post
Speaking of Emperor Stark, has that been done in the comics?
Yes, they had a similar storyarc in the Exiles comic (#23-25):

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"In the Exiles series (alternate reality) Iron Man is a malevolent despot and the tyrant ruler of the World which as a whole is pretty annoying for everyone else. He also seems to have taken up wearing Dr Dooms cloak (his favorite trophy) in a bit of super villain cross dressing.

In a world plagued by all kinds of bad stuff, the people sought out a strong leader. Tony Stark came to the rescue; first becoming President of the United States for life, and later, as of an emergency edict ten years ago, Monarch of Earth. He ruled Earth with an iron fist. And this was all his plan from the beginning.

This world’s Tony Stark was brutally ambitious. He killed his father when he was just fourteen, enabling him to take over the mighty Stark fortune. Slowly he plotted, eventually getting the world economy in a stranglehold. The industrialist then bided his time. He waited for just the right moment before tightening his grip.

Then came the Mutant War, courtesy of Stark himself. Magneto, clandestinely funded by Stark, attacked humanity. In the chaos, the world begged for Stark’s assistance. He came forward to master the crisis.



In taking over the world, he had to kill many heroes and villains. His battle with Dr. Doom left him horribly wounded, and he had to design a special suit of armor to aid in his recovery. (Doom was killed.) Also, because his face sustained a massive radiation blast from just a foot away, he uses a hologram to project a human face to his people.

This Stark had imperial designs beyond the bounds of earth. He wanted to move on to conquer other worlds. And he found the future of his intergalactic army in the untapped genetic power of the Inhumans. (I told you he was ambitious.) He launched an attack on the Inhumans’ island of Attilan with his army of Iron Men, four battalions—40,000 of them. These Iron Men squadrons, what Stark blithely called "flyers" were destroyed by a screaming Black Bolt.

This alternate reality Stark was then killed by the same reality’s Sue Storm at the end of Exiles #25."

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Old 06-10-2012, 04:30 AM   #99
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

^ That reminds me of the time Thor took over earth when he was "King Thor", I never knew Iron Man did the same.

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Old 06-10-2012, 04:45 AM   #100
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Default Re: Avengers cartoon - Part 5

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^ That reminds me of the time Thor took over earth when he was "King Thor", I never knew Iron Man did the same.
Oh yeah, Lord Thor arc was pretty intense! I mean, the whole Dan Jurgens storyline was plain awesome, because he thought of everything, y'know. I think that he's one of the best Thor writers ever (right there with Walter Simonson and Jack Kirby)! He did a very magnificent job on the character development and the expansion of the legends of Asgard.

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