Marvel's losing its edge and DC's getting its back

[redmarvel]

Up until 1998 DC was the best when it came to comic book movies, but after 1998, well, you be the judge:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

(2014)
Marvel:
DC:
- Justice League
(2013)
Marvel:
- Iron Man 3
DC:
- Man of Steel
(2012)
Marvel:
- The Amazing Spider-Man
- Marvel's The Avengers
- Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance
DC:
- The Dark Knight Rises
(2011)
Marvel:
- Captain America: The First Avenger
- X-Men: First Class
- Thor
DC:
- Green Lantern
(2010)
Marvel:
- Iron Man 2
- Planet Hulk
DC:
- Jonah Hex
(2009)
Marvel:
- X-Men Origins: Wolverine
- Hulk Vs.
DC:
- Watchmen
(2008)
Marvel:
- Punisher: War Zone
- The Incredible Hulk
- Iron Man
DC:
- The Dark Knight
(2007)
Marvel:
- Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer
- Spider-Man 3
- Ghost Rider
(2006)
Marvel:
- X3: The Last Stand
DC:
- Superman Returns
- Superman II: The Richard Donner Cut
(2005)
Marvel:
- Fantastic Four
- Man-Thing
- Elektra
DC:
- Batman Begins
(2004)
Marvel:
- Blade: Trinity
- Spider-Man 2
- The Punisher
DC:
- Catwoman
(2003)
Marvel:
- Hulk
- X2: X-Men United
- Daredevil
(2002)
Marvel:
- Spider-Man
- Blade II
(2000)
Marvel:
- X-Men
(1998)
Marvel:
- Blade

[chiefchirpa]

Originally Posted by redmarvel

Up until 1998 DC was the best when it came to comic book movies, but after 1998, well, you be the judge:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

(2014)
Marvel:
DC:
- Justice League
(2013)
Marvel:
- Iron Man 3
DC:
- Man of Steel
(2012)
Marvel:
- The Amazing Spider-Man
- Marvel's The Avengers
- Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance
DC:
- The Dark Knight Rises
(2011)
Marvel:
- Captain America: The First Avenger
- X-Men: First Class
- Thor
DC:
- Green Lantern
(2010)
Marvel:
- Iron Man 2
- Planet Hulk
DC:
- Jonah Hex
(2009)
Marvel:
- X-Men Origins: Wolverine
- Hulk Vs.
DC:
- Watchmen
(2008)
Marvel:
- Punisher: War Zone
- The Incredible Hulk
- Iron Man
DC:
- The Dark Knight
(2007)
Marvel:
- Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer
- Spider-Man 3
- Ghost Rider
(2006)
Marvel:
- X3: The Last Stand
DC:
- Superman Returns
- Superman II: The Richard Donner Cut
(2005)
Marvel:
- Fantastic Four
- Man-Thing
- Elektra
DC:
- Batman Begins
(2004)
Marvel:
- Blade: Trinity
- Spider-Man 2
- The Punisher
DC:
- Catwoman
(2003)
Marvel:
- Hulk
- X2: X-Men United
- Daredevil
(2002)
Marvel:
- Spider-Man
- Blade II
(2000)
Marvel:
- X-Men
(1998)
Marvel:
- Blade

Post-2012, some of Marvel's film projects are curiously missing.

[metaphysician]

Originally Posted by chiefchirpa

Post-2012, some of Marvel's film projects are curiously missing.

And Justice League is mentioned despite there being no information about it, other than "WB hopes to make it, maybe."

[Webfoot Hero]

Originally Posted by metaphysician

And Justice League is mentioned despite there being no information about it, other than "WB hopes to make it, maybe."

I'll believe in a JL movie when there's an actual script that has been greenlighted and a director and cast hired.

[redmarvel]

Originally Posted by chiefchirpa

Post-2012, some of Marvel's film projects are curiously missing.

I used Marvel Entertainment and the wiki "Films based on DC Comics" to compile the lists. Blame the makers of those lists.


http://marvel.com/movies

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...d_on_DC_Comics

[spideymouse]

Originally Posted by redmarvel

I used Marvel Entertainment and the wiki "Films based on DC Comics" to compile the lists. Blame the makers of those lists.


http://marvel.com/movies

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...d_on_DC_Comics

Can't I blame the maker of your list?

[redmarvel]

Originally Posted by spideymouse

Can't I blame the maker of your list?

Well, if you can do better, be my guest. When it comes to blame, I accept none, but you can credit my maker for a good sense of humour and good taste as well.

[brainchild81]

Rises was a letdown for me. In the comics, where does the codename "Robin" originate from?

[roach]

Originally Posted by brainchild81

Rises was a letdown for me. In the comics, where does the codename "Robin" originate from?

I don't think there is one definite origin for the Robin codename

[Anubis]

I thought it was what Grayson's momma used to call him.

[roach]

Originally Posted by Anubis

I thought it was what Grayson's momma used to call him.

I think thats from Batman Forever.....however I have seen a bunch of other in comic reasons...to liking the bird to Robin Hood

[Thedudehimself]

I have written a very long and detailed article (Editorial) about exactly THIS TOPIC. Unfortunatly I wrote it for...."That" site. I am not sure if I am allowed to link to it.

[Calavera]

Originally Posted by Thedudehimself

I have written a very long and detailed article (Editorial) about exactly THIS TOPIC. Unfortunatly I wrote it for...."That" site. I am not sure if I am allowed to link to it.

what site!?!?

[Thedudehimself]

The infamous and trollish "**************". I figured that this site is not liked too well arround here.

Edit:

Awwww see: It even gets censored when I write it NOT as hyperlink. So I guess that means this is a site "non grata" here.

Cant link to it then.

[Anubis]

WTF are you talkin' bout dude?

[HighFivingMF]

Originally Posted by Anubis

WTF are you talkin' bout dude?

He wrote an article on Comic Book Movie. But we're not allowed to link to that site.

[Anubis]

Why?

[HighFivingMF]

Originally Posted by Anubis

Why?

The admins blocked it because they stole news pieces and didn't credit the site.

[Anubis]

Ohhh....whelp, the more you know.

[brainchild81]

Originally Posted by Thedudehimself

I have written a very long and detailed article (Editorial) about exactly THIS TOPIC. Unfortunatly I wrote it for...."That" site. I am not sure if I am allowed to link to it.

Cut & paste, please

[Thedudehimself]

Originally Posted by brainchild81

Cut & paste, please

As you wish, good sir.

Well, as I said above I wrote an quite long article about the matter of this thread on CBM, I will now pull of a glorious copypasta move, so you can read it here:

Here you go:


Marvels misdoings! Why Warner / DC will win the edge back eventually!



After this years Comic Con Marvel Studios plans for Phase II are praised to an unbelievable extent amongst ComicBook Fans. Find out why there will be a day Marvel will lose its edge, DC getting its back.




I ve got something to say. Something to whine about, actually.

While it SEEMS like Marvel has the upper hand now, since DC has nothing in the pipeline after Man of Steel, and Marvel building up and expanding even more on their cinematic universe then anyone of us would have expected 2 years ago...there is still a weak link to what Marvel is doing. A weak link that could someday break their neck, when DC eventually catches up.

What am I talking about? Easy:

DC/ Warner is actually getting very good, if not brilliant DIRECTORS to get their movies off the ground. They have Nolan obviously, who is probably the best filmmaker of his generation. Zack Snyder also does have a very unique style, and according to the footage of MoS it seems like Snyder is going to deliver. And I am sure that DC/ Warner will keep that in the future. They will search up and low for good directors, leaving them mostly free hand. Because only with free hand a skilled director can pull out his full creative genius. DC knows that!

(They failed with Green Lantern, but I guess that was because they did not care very much for the character. Batman and Superman are their crown jewels, after tasting Nolans goodness DC/ Warner will never again give those two properties into bad hands). In the future DC will put quality over quantity. They have learned their lesson.

Marvel on the other hand...eww, not so much. They basically get hacks to direct their movies. Marvel Studios exes, most importantly that fat ugly asshat called FEIGE, is pushing arround their directors like toys. Marvel and Feige are basically saying in every production:

" You do it this way, you do it that way. No Mr...(Directors Name)...dont come up with any ideas. WE ARE MARVEL - We know what to do, we know how to please fans."

While that might be true, knowing how to please fans by including all that sneaky easter eggs, they always end up with movies that appear as unbelievable MEDIOCRE to the General Audience, to put it nicely.

Marvel Studios is making movies just for ComicBook fans.

Nolans Batman, Snyders Superman, Webbs Spider-Man, Vaughns X-Men...those are for EVERYONE to enjoy equally.

A director is the maker of a film. He is responsable for what the film is and what it is not.

Good studios understand that. And many Hollywood directors with big names, or younger creative ones can do best if they do it THEIR way.

Of course studios KNOW that they dont have to interfere with names like SPIELBERG, JACKSON, SCOTT, CAMERON, FINCHER and TARANTINO. But that is also because they WOULDNT let the studio interfere. If a studio would try to interfere with them they would tell the studio to go [frick] themselves.

Thats why such big directors will never direct a Marvel film. They dont need to put their talent under the "godly" direction of Marvel Studios.

What do you think why Jon Favreau left? Yeah, he said he wanted to do something else, but really....we all know it was because Marvel Studios was touching his ass during the whole production of Iron Man 2. Thats why it ended up beeing so bad.

About Branagh and Thor: Branagh is a good director. He delieverd an "okay film" which still could have been so MUCH better. It was astoundingly uninspired and safe. He is not returning because Marvel didnt have let him make the movie he wanted to make. Thats for sure. He was praising the production in interviews...but jeez...what else could he say?

Johnston and Cap: Well, Johnston is not too good as an director to begin with, but he is still a very crafty dude. He might not be the greatest story teller, but he knows his stuff. However, good for Marvel Studios that Johnston has some "hack-genes" in himself naturally, making him an director who is comparably easy to push arround. Captain America is probably the most disappointing film in the MCU to date. While Iron Man 2 reamains the worst, Captain America ended up as an generic cheese fest, featuring weak characterization of almost every leading figure, a astoundingly cheap storyline, not a single scene which could be called memorable and last but not least a bland overall look and tone which led to the lamest action scenes ever to be seen in a big budget CBM. All that is such a shame, because Cap really deserved an good FIRST major movie outing.

Joss Whedon and The Avengers: Yes, the movie was good. But I really think the reason why it ended up quite good is that they let Joss Whedon write story and screenplay. Dude knows how to have characters interact with each other in an entertaining way. The production on the other hand...in some interviews Whedon gave slight hints about that he didnt feel so comfortable during the production. And we all know why: Feige was holding Whedons xxxx in steel-claws.

I mean, seriously, box office over 1 Billion, third highest grossing film of all time...and he is NOT SURE about returning? Obviously something went wrong.

But it gets worse:

While I admit that Shane Black seems like a quite decent choice for Iron Man 3, it only gets worse from here. Alan Taylor to helm Thor 2. Really Marvel? A mediocre TV director...Meh. But here comes the bummer: Russo Brothers for Cap 2!!! When they were announced I didnt even know them! I had to google them.

Sure, I cant judge them before seeing their movies, but the thing that really makes me mad at Marvel is this:

Its like they re not EVEN TRYING anymore to get a good director. They just go for hacks, Yes-Sayers, who wont come up with their own ideas because they are too shy and unexperienced. Marvel WANTS to push arround their directors. Marvel Studios WANTS to make the movies by themselves, they hire alibi directors who dont acctually direct the movie. Marvel does. Feige does.

They always go for the same formula, ending up mediocre.While hardcore Marvelites who would love to kiss Feiges face all day long obviously love it and praise it as the best things ever happened, the General Audience will most definatly eventually figure out that Marvel Studios is delievering fast food which makes an uncomfortable feeling in the stomach.

When that day comes, and it will come, and DC is making just a FEW good movies then, the whole thing could turn to DC!

At the very least Marvel Studios should do it like Sony and FOX with their Marvel properties. Keep it very safe and marketable, yet leave the director a bit free reign. The Amazing Spider-Man for example had more heart than any Marvel Studios movie combined.

But that wont happen. Marvel thinks they know exactly what fans want. They are wrong. They know what Marvelites want. Genreal Audience will punish them sooner or later. Mark my words.

[Anubis]

You know what? Maybe we woulda been better off not having read that.

[Lord Valumart]

Originally Posted by Thedudehimself

As you wish, good sir.

Well, as I said above I wrote an quite long article about the matter of this thread on CBM, I will now pull of a glorious copypasta move, so you can read it here:

Here you go:


Marvels misdoings! Why Warner / DC will win the edge back eventually!



After this years Comic Con Marvel Studios plans for Phase II are praised to an unbelievable extent amongst ComicBook Fans. Find out why there will be a day Marvel will lose its edge, DC getting its back.




I ve got something to say. Something to whine about, actually.

While it SEEMS like Marvel has the upper hand now, since DC has nothing in the pipeline after Man of Steel, and Marvel building up and expanding even more on their cinematic universe then anyone of us would have expected 2 years ago...there is still a weak link to what Marvel is doing. A weak link that could someday break their neck, when DC eventually catches up.

What am I talking about? Easy:

DC/ Warner is actually getting very good, if not brilliant DIRECTORS to get their movies off the ground. They have Nolan obviously, who is probably the best filmmaker of his generation. Zack Snyder also does have a very unique style, and according to the footage of MoS it seems like Snyder is going to deliver. And I am sure that DC/ Warner will keep that in the future. They will search up and low for good directors, leaving them mostly free hand. Because only with free hand a skilled director can pull out his full creative genius. DC knows that!

Debatable. From Snyder I've seen Watchmen and that Sucker Punch thing. Watchmen was good but Sucker Punch was a horrible mess. Same for Nolan. I've seen his films, they're good, The Prestige is probably one of my favourate films. His Batman films are full of impossible to follw and badly directed action. Calling him the "best filmmaker of his generation" instantly slants your entire argument with massive DC tinted goggles.

(They failed with Green Lantern, but I guess that was because they did not care very much for the character. Batman and Superman are their crown jewels, after tasting Nolans goodness DC/ Warner will never again give those two properties into bad hands). In the future DC will put quality over quantity. They have learned their lesson.

Right, so now we see that DC's trying something new didn't sit well with you and that once again you're kissing Nolan's arse. The exact same thing could have been saind about Burton's Batman but then they made Forever so I'll let you figure that one out.

Marvel on the other hand...eww, not so much. They basically get hacks to direct their movies. Marvel Studios exes, most importantly that fat ugly asshat called FEIGE, is pushing arround their directors like toys. Marvel and Feige are basically saying in every production:

" You do it this way, you do it that way. No Mr...(Directors Name)...dont come up with any ideas. WE ARE MARVEL - We know what to do, we know how to please fans."

I can't honestly think of a Marvel movie where I've been baffled by the action thats happening on screen. And well done on calling Branagh a hack. I think it's fair enough that if Marvel have a plan then the directors they get should atleast be able to follow the plan they want to happen.

While that might be true, knowing how to please fans by including all that sneaky easter eggs, they always end up with movies that appear as unbelievable MEDIOCRE to the General Audience, to put it nicely.

I dunno, I've seen lots of people who care nothing about comic books flock to see these movies. I mean I'm probably the most into comic books out of my group of friends and I was like "I'll just wait for the dvd..." on a few things and thet were all of going to see it at the cinema. Easter Eggs are cool for the fans but really, I see nothing that could make them lessen a movie for people not in the know.

Marvel Studios is making movies just for ComicBook fans.

Nolans Batman, Snyders Superman, Webbs Spider-Man, Vaughns X-Men...those are for EVERYONE to enjoy equally.

Right, so these films, one of which isn't even near release yet, are the ones everyone can enjoy? Yeh, sure, because it was impossible for my dad to enjoy Captain America.

A director is the maker of a film. He is responsable for what the film is and what it is not.

And the story, script writers, actors....

Good studios understand that. And many Hollywood directors with big names, or younger creative ones can do best if they do it THEIR way.

Not always. Sometimes even the best director can utterly mishandle a script and make a hugh pile of crap.

Of course studios KNOW that they dont have to interfere with names like SPIELBERG, JACKSON, SCOTT, CAMERON, FINCHER and TARANTINO. But that is also because they WOULDNT let the studio interfere. If a studio would try to interfere with them they would tell the studio to go [frick] themselves.

Yeh, you think they really want to go and do comic book movies? They've pretty much earned the right to just get money thrown at them when they walk in and say "I've had an idea..." That being said why the hell is Jackson on there? Or Tarantino? Actually thinking about it Tarantino would probably make on hell of a Punisher film.

Thats why such big directors will never direct a Marvel film. They dont need to put their talent under the "godly" direction of Marvel Studios.

No, they won't direct a Marvel film bcause they don't need to. They've done the popular crap in the past to reach where they have now. Done work, got aclaim, doing own thing.

What do you think why Jon Favreau left? Yeah, he said he wanted to do something else, but really....we all know it was because Marvel Studios was touching his ass during the whole production of Iron Man 2. Thats why it ended up beeing so bad.

Iron Man 2 wasn't bad. Again, opinion.

About Branagh and Thor: Branagh is a good director. He delieverd an "okay film" which still could have been so MUCH better. It was astoundingly uninspired and safe. He is not returning because Marvel didnt have let him make the movie he wanted to make. Thats for sure. He was praising the production in interviews...but jeez...what else could he say?

I thought it was really well done how the two worlds were represented, one taken deadly seriously, the other more jokey.

Johnston and Cap: Well, Johnston is not too good as an director to begin with, but he is still a very crafty dude. He might not be the greatest story teller, but he knows his stuff. However, good for Marvel Studios that Johnston has some "hack-genes" in himself naturally, making him an director who is comparably easy to push arround. Captain America is probably the most disappointing film in the MCU to date. While Iron Man 2 reamains the worst, Captain America ended up as an generic cheese fest, featuring weak characterization of almost every leading figure, a astoundingly cheap storyline, not a single scene which could be called memorable and last but not least a bland overall look and tone which led to the lamest action scenes ever to be seen in a big budget CBM. All that is such a shame, because Cap really deserved an good FIRST major movie outing.

They made a WW2 action film in the sort of Indiana Jones mould. What else ar they supposed to do with Cap? You have a hero, a McGuffin, a bad guy and thats your film. Most of the stuff that people like about Cap is the stuff when he's unfrozen and wandering about the now.

Joss Whedon and The Avengers: Yes, the movie was good. But I really think the reason why it ended up quite good is that they let Joss Whedon write story and screenplay. Dude knows how to have characters interact with each other in an entertaining way. The production on the other hand...in some interviews Whedon gave slight hints about that he didnt feel so comfortable during the production. And we all know why: Feige was holding Whedons xxxx in steel-claws.

Joss is very much about doing his own things. He always has been. If there's a reason he did Avengers there's a good reason. If there's a reason he's not going to come back, there's a good reason. Have you not heard of what Joss does? He does a bit of this, a bit of that, weeps about Firefly, then decides that he'll do something else, because he wants to.

I mean, seriously, box office over 1 Billion, third highest grossing film of all time...and he is NOT SURE about returning? Obviously something went wrong.

Again, Joss is about doing what he wants.
But it gets worse:

While I admit that Shane Black seems like a quite decent choice for Iron Man 3, it only gets worse from here. Alan Taylor to helm Thor 2. Really Marvel? A mediocre TV director...Meh. But here comes the bummer: Russo Brothers for Cap 2!!! When they were announced I didnt even know them! I had to google them.

Yes, judge them before you've seen their films, thats the way to go! I mean you've allready acepted that Snyders Superman is going to be the second coming so why not cast scorn upon the Marvel movies that have different directors with the same ammount of off handed insanity?

Sure, I cant judge them before seeing their movies,

oh, but you have...

but the thing that really makes me mad at Marvel is this:

Its like they re not EVEN TRYING anymore to get a good director. They just go for hacks, Yes-Sayers, who wont come up with their own ideas because they are too shy and unexperienced. Marvel WANTS to push arround their directors. Marvel Studios WANTS to make the movies by themselves, they hire alibi directors who dont acctually direct the movie. Marvel does. Feige does.

How do you know these people weren't hired becaue they went in an said "well, have you thought about this...?" and Marvel liked that idea? Or they saw something in the previous work that you didn't? There's any number of reasons for getting a director. If they wanted a hack they'd throw money at Kevin Smith.

They always go for the same formula, ending up mediocre.While hardcore Marvelites who would love to kiss Feiges face all day long obviously love it and praise it as the best things ever happened, the General Audience will most definatly eventually figure out that Marvel Studios is delievering fast food which makes an uncomfortable feeling in the stomach.

Not always the same formula. There's only so many ways you can intorduce a hero in their first film. It's going to be the same basic film no matter what happens. Pre-hero, event, hero, villain, wimsical charm, battle, romance, bigger battle, end.

When that day comes, and it will come, and DC is making just a FEW good movies then, the whole thing could turn to DC!

Like the JL movie they've been trying to make for the past 15 years? Or the Flash movie they were going to make after GL? I mean jesus, DC/WB is so terrified they're not even trying. Marvel is altest busting out something interesting with Gaurdians of the Galaxy.

At the very least Marvel Studios should do it like Sony and FOX with their Marvel properties. Keep it very safe and marketable, yet leave the director a bit free reign. The Amazing Spider-Man for example had more heart than any Marvel Studios movie combined.

Yeh, because out of all the Marvel/FOX team ups we've have what? 3 good movies out 9? So yeh, that's working wonders...

But that wont happen. Marvel thinks they know exactly what fans want. They are wrong. They know what Marvelites want. Genreal Audience will punish them sooner or later. Mark my words.

Marvel are giving people more of what they want with sequals to films that did well at th box office because the general audience went to see them. Then they're giving us all something different with Gaurdians of the Galaxy and AntMan. Who knows what else they'll pull out?

So yeh, I just feel that you're unfairly slanted towards DC for unfathomable reasons that are nothing more than "I liked Nolans films and Snyder will make a good movie".

[Chewy]

lol

[Adamantium Man]

Originally Posted by Thedudehimself

As you wish, good sir.

Well, as I said above I wrote an quite long article about the matter of this thread on CBM, I will now pull of a glorious copypasta move, so you can read it here:

Here you go:


Marvels misdoings! Why Warner / DC will win the edge back eventually!



After this years Comic Con Marvel Studios plans for Phase II are praised to an unbelievable extent amongst ComicBook Fans. Find out why there will be a day Marvel will lose its edge, DC getting its back.




I ve got something to say. Something to whine about, actually.

[cut because we really don't need to read it again]

Thanks! I needed a laugh just now.