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Old 07-23-2012, 06:05 PM   #76
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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The way Hemsworth was built would not work for Batman. That's a convention of the last 20 years of comics that is purely BS. A bodybuilder could not do what Batman does. And Bale's physique was much closer to modern depictions than you're suggesting. Much much closer.

The Neal Adams era really has the proportions right, and they fit with most of Bruce's primary training regimens... gymnastics, calisthenics and martial arts. Batman wouldn't spend an inordinate amount of time on the bench press... and that's precisely what Hemsworth did for Thor.
Sorry, I don't want a bodybuilding physique for Batman either, but you are very misinformed.

"A bodybuilder could not do what Batman does". I assume you subscribe to the persistent myth that bodybuilders are slow and inflexible. Bodybuilders can be fast and very agile. In fact a powerlifter who squats heavy will have a very high vertical jump. Lifting heavy weights and getting the results you want requires a full range of motion in your exercises. A lack of flexibility simply will not work.

All you have to do is look at American football players or rugby players to see how fast big people can move.

Writing off Hemsworth's training as simply being long hours of bench pressing demonstrates a vast level of ignorance. Yes, Hemsworth did the Bench Press. But he also did Squats, Deadlifts, Barbell Rows, Overhead Press... these are core exercises that are essential for a balanced and strong physique. Even athletes like Tiger Woods do these exercises.

The only reason why Batman shouldn't be a bodybuilder is that the time and investment to maintain that level of size is unnecessary for his goals (also Batman looks better lean). It's not that being a bodybuilder will limit him in any way. If anything, a swimmer or running physique will be more of a hinderance.

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Old 07-23-2012, 06:57 PM   #77
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

I'm sorry, you're wrong. Bodybuilding tends to result in less functionality and than calisthenics and gymnastics. Gymnasts rarely ever move heavy weights, and look at them. And none of the bodybuilding exercises you mention are, in fact, necessary for a balanced physique.

Case in point, Eugene Sandow. His core training was the light dumbbell program he advocated in his books which he got from Professor Attila.


Gymnast physique:


It might be worth his while for Bruce Wayne to do some bodybuilding training early on... when he's trying to build mass in a hurry. But at the end of the day, he's going to abandon that for more functional training that hardwires the qualities he needs for what he does. Gymnastics is likely to be a staple because of the nature of how he gets around the city, calisthenics, maybe kettlebells... but he's definitely not going to be putting the time it takes to look like a bodybuilder. There are many potentially dangerous weaknesses that tend to become ingrained in bodybuilders anyway.

And to be clear, we are defining bodybuilder here not with a handful of exercises that you point out above and taking into consideration football players or rugby players(who surely use some of the staples of bodybuilder routines in their training but use WAAAY more sport specific functional training). When we say bodybuilder we are talking about bodybuilders, not athletes. athletes are not bodybuilders and don't fully train like bodybuilders and to use them as an example for why you think a bodybuilder can do what Batman does is, frankly, dishonest. Football players and rugby players are not bodybuilders.

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Old 07-23-2012, 07:04 PM   #78
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

A bodybuilder is someone who builds their body, in most cases to be bigger.

So yes, Eugene Sandow was a bodybuilder. Football players and rugby players who are supposed to be big will be doing bodybuilding exercises. That gymnast is also pretty big, and he almost certainly did heavy barbell work along with specific gymnast training.

I don't see why you are telling me that isn't worth Bruce Wayne's time to be a bodybuilder when I already said that. You've essentially repeated a point I already made.

Point is, the bodybuilder physique will not hinder Batman's abilities if that is the bodytype he happens to choose.

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Old 07-23-2012, 08:44 PM   #79
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

I'll throw my suggestion in.



Lenses don't have to be permanently there, but it would be nice for him to use them in certain situations.

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Old 07-24-2012, 12:31 AM   #80
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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A bodybuilder is someone who builds their body, in most cases to be bigger.

So yes, Eugene Sandow was a bodybuilder. Football players and rugby players who are supposed to be big will be doing bodybuilding exercises. That gymnast is also pretty big, and he almost certainly did heavy barbell work along with specific gymnast training.

I don't see why you are telling me that isn't worth Bruce Wayne's time to be a bodybuilder when I already said that. You've essentially repeated a point I already made.

Point is, the bodybuilder physique will not hinder Batman's abilities if that is the bodytype he happens to choose.
JAK, if you think the gymnast did barbell work to get that I recommend you check out Coach Sommer's work. They don't do barbell work to get where they are. Bodyweight is the vast majority of their training.

Sandow's physique is more what I couod see being a template for Wayne, and that's not the result of heavy barbell work. Sandow, and every strongman of his era, and the man that trained them, Professor Attila, all attest that thwir primary training was a light dumbbell protocol that took about 20 minutes a day to do. The heaviest dumbbells they would use were 7.5 lbs. Those guys also routinely did gymnastics training.

You're really expanding the definition of "bodybuiler" here to say bodybuilding exercises could be used by Batman. Which I'd agree with. Of course, there are different bosybuilding exercises. But when you say "bodybuilder" you aee evoking a very specific image.. that of Mr Universe and d muscle mags. Not athletes whose traini g is much more than some bodybuikding exercises and include all types of sport specific functional training.

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Old 07-24-2012, 12:40 AM   #81
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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Black and grey suit that looks like material with an armored substructure. Cap's suit from Avengers is a great place to start. Armored boots and gloves, but not too bulky like in AC. Cape that can close all the way around. Yellow/gold oval symbol with a matching color for the belt. Short ears on a close fitting, Jim Lee-esque cowl. No trunks. Maybe (as some have suggested before) a kind of climbing harness integrated into the belt with the straps evoking the shape of the trunks and breaking up the grey.

As for the original post. Not just no, hell no. Batman does not need to be climbing walls like spidey. The only time I want to see a full mask is if they do a Batman Beyond movie. And we should see more grappling and swinging, not less.
god no i hated cap's avengers suit the fabric they used was very cheap looking

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Old 07-24-2012, 03:07 AM   #82
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god no i hated cap's avengers suit the fabric they used was very cheap looking
While I disagree immensely, that was just an example of a suit that was clearly armored while still maintaining the look of fabric.

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Old 07-24-2012, 04:11 AM   #83
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While I disagree immensely, that was just an example of a suit that was clearly armored while still maintaining the look of fabric.
Agreed. The point is to aim for something similar, not copy it exactly.

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Old 07-24-2012, 12:49 PM   #84
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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I'll throw my suggestion in.



Lenses don't have to be permanently there, but it would be nice for him to use them in certain situations.
I like that.....

how about his....


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Old 07-24-2012, 01:28 PM   #85
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The challenge with a fabric suit is that people are 'spoiled' after having a suit with such a great explanation, a suit that has a 'just cuz' or contrived explanation will seem weak.

The fabric has to be convincing as protection, not just look serious, but feel like a natural extension of Batman's story.

EDIT: The fabric armor could very well be a plot point, perhaps Penguin might use it for some giant bird or something, or Wayne Enterises developed it for undercover cops/intelligence agents, and now Bruce is employing it as his full body armor because it allowed him the freedom of movement when he was being 'undercover' or whatever.



Scott Adkins is passable as the typical stoic martial artist. That doesn't mean he's a great actor, that means people know that you don't write martial arts movies that require a lot of acting.

Which kinda falls into the whole issue with the suit. If the acrobatic stylized martial arts is the focus, then the movie becomes less about being an emotional symbol and more about getting angry and unleashing cool martial arts moves. Which could be cool, but I don't know if that's what people want from Batman at this point, as there is a both a danger and perception of a stylized Batman being Schumacher-esque.

Scott Adkins for a live-action series, not movie. That was my suggestion. His acting skills are completely passable for a 1-hour weekly show. Check him out in Undisputed 3.

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Old 07-24-2012, 03:24 PM   #86
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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Scott Adkins is passable as the typical stoic martial artist. That doesn't mean he's a great actor, that means people know that you don't write martial arts movies that require a lot of acting.

Which kinda falls into the whole issue with the suit. If the acrobatic stylized martial arts is the focus, then the movie becomes less about being an emotional symbol and more about getting angry and unleashing cool martial arts moves. Which could be cool, but I don't know if that's what people want from Batman at this point, as there is a both a danger and perception of a stylized Batman being Schumacher-esque.
You do know that Scott Adkins is an actor on a british TV show that has nothing to do with martial arts, right? He's quite good in it.

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Old 07-24-2012, 04:56 PM   #87
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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I'll throw my suggestion in.



Lenses don't have to be permanently there, but it would be nice for him to use them in certain situations.
I like this, except for the symbol on the chest. In my opinion, the Bat symbol on his chest, Batarangs, and Bat Signal should all look like this in the reboot.


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Old 07-24-2012, 05:14 PM   #88
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

Trying to make a "real world" Batsuit is a waste of time IMO. Batman is ultimately a fantasy character.

Trying to ground him in the real world just calls attention to everything that is unrealistic about the character and his universe. A grounded character limits what you can do with the Batmobile, side kicks, villains, and even Gotham.

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Old 07-24-2012, 05:28 PM   #89
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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I want this with a cowl which is a mixture of these two:



And the gauntlets/gloves and boots from the Nolan films.

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Old 07-24-2012, 10:11 PM   #90
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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Scott Adkins for a live-action series, not movie. That was my suggestion. His acting skills are completely passable for a 1-hour weekly show. Check him out in Undisputed 3.
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You do know that Scott Adkins is an actor on a british TV show that has nothing to do with martial arts, right? He's quite good in it.
I stand corrected, he's definitely a passable TV actor. Still not feeling him for a film.

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Trying to make a "real world" Batsuit is a waste of time IMO. Batman is ultimately a fantasy character.

Trying to ground him in the real world just calls attention to everything that is unrealistic about the character and his universe. A grounded character limits what you can do with the Batmobile, side kicks, villains, and even Gotham.
The real world Batsuit in Begins/TDK/TDKR definitely wasn't a waste of time and didn't draw attention to how unrealistic he was. That's something I've heard a lot of fanboys who want a more stylized Batman that they're familiar with say, but commoners aren't saying "man, there's no way he could be camped out in that cave without passing out from all the methane generated by the guano." All their questions have been abundantly answered.

It does limit what can be done with him, but it pays of in making what is done with him more valuable to the masses.

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Old 07-25-2012, 07:51 AM   #91
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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I stand corrected, he's definitely a passable TV actor. Still not feeling him for a film.



The real world Batsuit in Begins/TDK/TDKR definitely wasn't a waste of time and didn't draw attention to how unrealistic he was. That's something I've heard a lot of fanboys who want a more stylized Batman that they're familiar with say, but commoners aren't saying "man, there's no way he could be camped out in that cave without passing out from all the methane generated by the guano." All their questions have been abundantly answered.

It does limit what can be done with him, but it pays of in making what is done with him more valuable to the masses.
Except I've heard a number of people outside of this forum talk about how stupid he looks. Complete strangers have said this. Still, it's not as bad as how people make fun of his voice.

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Old 07-26-2012, 07:31 AM   #92
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

I agree with everyone who said they should look at the Captain America Avengers suit. That should be the starting point. No rubber suits and looking like a walking Tank, with all those armor plates covering Batman.

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I'll throw my suggestion in.

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Lenses don't have to be permanently there, but it would be nice for him to use them in certain situations.
But if they have to go with an armor look like that picture, which looks pretty cool, maybe they should design it like the costume in the Power Rangers movie. Those outfits allowed for great mobility.


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Old 07-26-2012, 07:38 AM   #93
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

Jeremy Irons for Alfred!

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Old 07-26-2012, 09:52 AM   #94
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

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I agree with everyone who said they should look at the Captain America Avengers suit. That should be the starting point. No rubber suits and looking like a walking Tank, with all those armor plates covering Batman.



But if they have to go with an armor look like that picture, which looks pretty cool, maybe they should design it like the costume in the Power Rangers movie. Those outfits allowed for great mobility.

I support that. If wushu can be done in that outfit it's suitable for Batman.

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Old 07-26-2012, 11:09 AM   #95
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

When you think about it, that kind of is how the TDK suit is designed...it's just a little more bulky. It didn't need to be, but it is.

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Old 07-26-2012, 12:00 PM   #96
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When you think about it, that kind of is how the TDK suit is designed...it's just a little more bulky. It didn't need to be, but it is.
True. And the "armor" plates are way more prominent for the sake of evoking medieval armor.

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Old 07-26-2012, 02:36 PM   #97
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

Since some of you are talking about the physical build of Batman. I think in terms of build alone Jason Statham has the perfect build for Batman.

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Old 07-26-2012, 06:49 PM   #98
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

I'd like a more lightweight suit that's closer in terms of color to the comic counterpart. However, a cowl similar to the Batman Beyond suit would be better than the original that leaves the lower jaw exposed. In order to play off the fear of his adversaries, batarangs that explode on impact to release a nonlethal dose of fear toxin should be used. That, in combination with the full body suit, would cause Batman's foes to see a bat-creature before them, rather than a man in a costume.

Nolan talked Fear in BB, but it never really seemed to factor into his Batman past that film. I'd like to see it explored further in regards to Batman's fighting style.

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Old 07-26-2012, 09:09 PM   #99
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I support that. If wushu can be done in that outfit it's suitable for Batman.
Even these guys, fully suited up, were capable of some great stunts.



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Why is it that Hollywood, with a multi-million dollar budget, can't create a Batman suit that doesn't constrict your movement?

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Old 07-27-2012, 03:40 AM   #100
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Default Re: How the Next Batman Reboot is Driven by the Suit

^I dunno. I mentioned it in previous incarnations of the Bat-suit thread but look at the TMNT outfits. No problems moving and fighting, and I'm sure those were just as uncomfortable, heavy and hot as any Bat-suit has been.

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