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Old 08-19-2012, 09:10 PM   #51
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

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"Once you've done what you had to do, they'll never let you do what you want to do." It's something along those lines. She doesn't want to be a thief anymore.
I wish we got to know what she wanted to do after doing what she had to

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Old 08-19-2012, 09:11 PM   #52
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"Once you've done what you had to do, they'll never let you do what you want to do." It's something along those lines. She doesn't want to be a thief anymore.
Yeah, that's true. She had to steal to survive. She could continue to steal if she had to, but I'm leaning on the side of not. If Bruce got his money back and wasn't flat broke (his money going back to Fox, who reroutes it to another account perhaps) Selina wouldn't have to be the bread (and jewellery) winner.

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Old 08-19-2012, 09:21 PM   #53
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

Yeah, especially with that quote that kthevs posted, I'm leaning towards her not stealing anymore. I can't see Bruce being broke anyway even if they can't prove the fraud. He must have some offshore/off the books accounts out there. The guy's paranoid. Also, that's how he was paying for some of his Bat gear anyway.

I could see her stealing some old guy's wallet/watch though if he dared grab her ass and Bruce turning a blind eye on that.

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Old 08-19-2012, 10:31 PM   #54
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I could see her stealing some old guy's wallet/watch though if he dared grab her ass and Bruce turning a blind eye on that.
I wonder what would've happened if Bruce didn't attend the masked ball and interject during Selina's dance? Perhaps the old guy took Selina back to his lavish house for some funky time, Selina steals his wife's (who's over in Ibiza) diamonds and then leaves the guy all alone.

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Old 08-19-2012, 10:37 PM   #55
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

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I wonder what would've happened if Bruce didn't attend the masked ball and interject during Selina's dance? Perhaps the old guy took Selina back to his lavish house for some funky time, Selina steals his wife's (who's over in Ibiza) diamonds and then leaves the guy all alone.
That's exactly what she had in mind. Go back to his place and ruffie his drink up and then have a blast stealing as much as she could.

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Old 08-19-2012, 10:55 PM   #56
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That's exactly what she had in mind. Go back to his place and ruffie his drink up and then have a blast stealing as much as she could.
Yeah, it would've been hilarious to have seen the old guy's reactions. All excited and then completely violated once he realises the joke is on him.

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Old 08-20-2012, 12:02 AM   #57
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

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I wonder what would've happened if Bruce didn't attend the masked ball and interject during Selina's dance? Perhaps the old guy took Selina back to his lavish house for some funky time, Selina steals his wife's (who's over in Ibiza) diamonds and then leaves the guy all alone.
I think that's another reason why she decided to steal Bruce's car. Not only did he take the pearl necklace back, but he ruined her plans for the night. Plus it seemed like he really pissed her off a lot which he seemed to really enjoy, so she wanted some revenge. The constant outsmarting, tense flirting, and who's better at the chase while they probably don't even realize it. God I loved the whole scene and chemistry. I'm still pissed that she lead him to Bane's trap even if she didn't know that he was Bruce, but I'm glad she learned from her mistake and knew she couldn't leave him again. It was the turning point for her character.

I really don't think she would have gone back to stealing even if Bruce had died. She clearly had develop feelings for him before he went off with the bomb, and I think she would have felt that she would be betraying his trust once again if she went back to her career as a criminal especially since he had already given her the clean state. Like she said she did what she had to in order to survive, but it's not what she truly wants to do. Bruce sees this and knows that. Just look how pissed off and desperate she is when Daggett lies to her about it not exsisting. Is it just me or did she look like she was getting teary on the rooftop when she had the gun to his face? Bruce might have been watching this as well. I think she's always wanted to help people, but never has the resources or anything like what Bruce has. This Selina Kyle isn't a thrill seeker like in the comics, but still very much alike that one.

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Old 08-20-2012, 10:20 AM   #58
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

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"Once you've done what you had to do, they'll never let you do what you want to do." It's something along those lines. She doesn't want to be a thief anymore.
and as I quote from novelizatio---Bruce: ....you are saving for your retirement...

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Old 08-20-2012, 10:30 AM   #59
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I think that's another reason why she decided to steal Bruce's car. Not only did he take the pearl necklace back, but he ruined her plans for the night. Plus it seemed like he really pissed her off a lot which he seemed to really enjoy, so she wanted some revenge. The constant outsmarting, tense flirting, and who's better at the chase while they probably don't even realize it. God I loved the whole scene and chemistry. I'm still pissed that she lead him to Bane's trap even if she didn't know that he was Bruce, but I'm glad she learned from her mistake and knew she couldn't leave him again. It was the turning point for her character.
Batman want her to lead him to Bane---so she did fulfill their agreement

outcome 1, if Batman defeat Bane---Selina may feels good

outcome 2, if Bane defeat Batman---Selina may feels ok(she was starting to feel awful when she learns Batman actually is Bruce )

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Old 08-20-2012, 11:36 AM   #60
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

Without meaning to really alter the movie because of dissatisfaction because I love the movie as is. I think from a character and story point it would have been much stronger if Bruce had slept with Selina before confronting Bane. Hear me out, Miranda's betrayel works with or without her sleeping with Bruce. And since the endgame is Bruce and Selina it only adds to the guilt Selina feels.
In her head she's doing what she has to in order to live. She cuts a deal with Bane, and really who is she betraying some guy she just met on a rooftop. And he's insisting she take him to Bane anyway. Figures buys herself an out then goes back to the guy she is beginning to care about.
Then Bane drops the little bombshell the guy she just made love to is the same guy she led into a trap. I mean we see the feelings all over her face in the movie as is. Imagine her feelings after a night of passion with Bruce to see him broken by Bane.
Again the film works as is, and the relationship and feelings between them still develops even in such a subtle way. I just think with that one tweak you keep the integrity of the story but add just a little bit more romantic drama for Bruce and Selina.

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Old 08-20-2012, 11:46 AM   #61
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

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Without meaning to really alter the movie because of dissatisfaction because I love the movie as is. I think from a character and story point it would have been much stronger if Bruce had slept with Selina before confronting Bane. Hear me out, Miranda's betrayel works with or without her sleeping with Bruce. And since the endgame is Bruce and Selina it only adds to the guilt Selina feels.
In her head she's doing what she has to in order to live. She cuts a deal with Bane, and really who is she betraying some guy she just met on a rooftop. And he's insisting she take him to Bane anyway. Figures buys herself an out then goes back to the guy she is beginning to care about.
Then Bane drops the little bombshell the guy she just made love to is the same guy she led into a trap. I mean we see the feelings all over her face in the movie as is. Imagine her feelings after a night of passion with Bruce to see him broken by Bane.
Again the film works as is, and the relationship and feelings between them still develops even in such a subtle way. I just think with that one tweak you keep the integrity of the story but add just a little bit more romantic drama for Bruce and Selina.
Yeah, that's great but the next part won't be as good as it is now. If they made love before, the sewer scene would portray Selina's feelings but they would not be the same. I mean we can see her inner fights about what's right and wrong. The remorse written all over her face is priceless to me and vital as to why I love that scene so much. If she however slept with Bruce, she would hate herself and would probably try to save him.
Not to mention that the bridge scene where they meet again won't be the same. The second part is really good because you can see how Selina has changed and in the end she stays in order to help Bruce. Not because she is madly in love with him, but because she thinks that this is the right thing to do and he's probably the only person to ever believe she is something more. To me that makes it so much powerful than you know "sleep with Bruce and is madly in love with him scenario".

Plus, Talia sleeping with Bruce takes her betrayal on emotional level. She spits in the face of both his love and faith in people.

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Old 08-20-2012, 12:04 PM   #62
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

I agree with everything you are saying, Demonhunter. The relationship works as is. My reaction to Bruce sleeping with Miranda comes from the feeling of there really not being a romantic connection between them. Just like I never felt a romantic connection with Rachel. The betrayal still works without it because Bruce gives her his trust at the Reactor scene. I get the let's show Bruce at his most vulnerable and watch her take advantage of him. She workd him emotionally, and Bane workd him physically. I still believe if Selina sleeps with him the later scenes play out exactly the same but with just a bit more gravitas. I didn't mean their having sex leads to instant love, she isn't Vicki Vale, and this isn't Batman 89. Just that it begins her on her path to falling for Bruce since the scene that precedes it is her telling Jen he isn't a mark. So then what is he to her? Alreadybto her he isn't like every other guy.

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Old 08-20-2012, 12:07 PM   #63
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

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Not to mention that the bridge scene where they meet again won't be the same. The second part is really good because you can see how Selina has changed and in the end she stays in order to help Bruce. Not because she is madly in love with him, but because she thinks that this is the right thing to do and he's probably the only person to ever believe she is something more. To me that makes it so much powerful than you know "sleep with Bruce and is madly in love with him scenario".
This.

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Old 08-20-2012, 12:42 PM   #64
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Yeah, that's great but the next part won't be as good as it is now. If they made love before, the sewer scene would portray Selina's feelings but they would not be the same. I mean we can see her inner fights about what's right and wrong. The remorse written all over her face is priceless to me and vital as to why I love that scene so much. If she however slept with Bruce, she would hate herself and would probably try to save him.
Not to mention that the bridge scene where they meet again won't be the same. The second part is really good because you can see how Selina has changed and in the end she stays in order to help Bruce. Not because she is madly in love with him, but because she thinks that this is the right thing to do and he's probably the only person to ever believe she is something more. To me that makes it so much powerful than you know "sleep with Bruce and is madly in love with him scenario".

Plus, Talia sleeping with Bruce takes her betrayal on emotional level. She spits in the face of both his love and faith in people.
Mostly true, but part of the reasons she comes back to save him is because she has feelings for him. It's not just because it's the right thing to do, because she doesn't really care all that much about that. She sees that he's the only one who sees a good person in her, deep down, which mirrors their relationship in certain versions of the comics. By the time she wants him to run away with her, she's fallen for him, but probably doesn't even realize it herself until she hears herself speak those worlds: "Come with me."

As for her sleeping with him rather than Miranda, I just don't think that would work. Her character isn't like that. She's not the type to sleep with someone she barely knows, and she doesn't particularly like Bruce at that point. She's a con artist and a grifter who uses men to get what she wants. Her sleeping with someone she barely knows would ruin her character.


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Old 08-20-2012, 07:20 PM   #65
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Mostly true, but part of the reasons she comes back to save him is because she has feelings for him. It's not just because it's the right thing to do, because she doesn't really care all that much about that. She sees that he's the only one who sees a good person in her, deep down, which mirrors their relationship in certain versions of the comics. By the time she wants him to run away with her, she's fallen for him, but probably doesn't even realize it herself until she hears herself speak those worlds: "Come with me."

As for her sleeping with him rather than Miranda, I just don't think that would work. Her character isn't like that. She's not the type to sleep with someone she barely knows, and she doesn't particularly like Bruce at that point. She's a con artist and a grifter who uses men to get what she wants. Her sleeping with someone she barely knows would ruin her character.
Perfectly said. Her betryal was the turning point for her character because she realized the mistake she just made. For a while she can't stand Bruce, and thinks he's just another rich snob that cares for no one, but him and his money. Her opinion on him seems to be gradually changing when he comes to her apartment because she acts different, and of course they both call each other on their BS.She probably also enjoyed their kiss a lot more than she expected, lol.Then comes the betryal scene, and Bane reveals Batman "Mr. Wayne, and Bruce." She's very affected by this, regrets her desicsion, and realizes how wrong she is about Bruce Wayne. She realizes he isn't all about the money (which he didn't even seem to be very effected when he lost it), and will whatever he can to help people and a city. She leaves though knowing she isn't strong enough to defeat Bane when even the Batman gets his ass whipped and wants to leave Gotham and Bane as fast as she can without the clean slate. She has five months to realize and feel guilty about what she did, and obiviously thinks a lot about Bruce. Does that exactly mean she had fallen for him romantically in that five month period? No. But the look in her eyes when she saw him come back to Gotham showed happiness, relief, and guilt all in 5-10 seconds and of course she tried to hide it by going back to her hard ass self, lol. She's shocked to find out he still trusts her even after all she had done, wants her help, and still believes she's better than what she did. Add all that up and this is definitely when she is falling for him.

Then comes the bat pod scene. She makes a "stuck up girlfriend" jealously type comment, lol. Who said Miranda was Bruce's girlfriend? They screwed each other one night, and then he disappeared for five months. And then she asks him to runaway and escape with her. She just said he has a stuck up girlfriend, and then she asks him to escape with her, but she has no feelings for him? Yeah right, Selina isn't the character to ask a guy to escape with her, but have no romantic feelings for him. She clearly did, otherwise she could care less about what happens to him. Just look at her eyes. She has everything she needs to escape, but she's letdown Bruce trust down once already and knows he's put to much trust in her to let him down again. Again she isn't the type of character that cares about millions of people's lives, but does care about people closest to her. She comes back for Bruce, and help him in his task to save Gotham, basically saving his life in the process by taking out Bane. Like someone on another board said he basically brings out the best in her, and helps her realize she's capable of doing good. Just the way she kisses him before he supposedly dies just tells you how much feelings she had developed for him.

A sex scene between Selina and Bruce would have rushed their relationship. I liked how well their relationship progressed in this movie, and her views and feelings for him.


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Old 08-20-2012, 07:24 PM   #66
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

agreed i thought their relationship was done perfectly, it didn't feel rushed or forced at all, it was natural

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Old 08-20-2012, 07:55 PM   #67
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Not to mention that she insists on kissing him even though there's a nuclear bomb that's about to go off.

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:06 PM   #68
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Not to mention that she insists on kissing him even though there's a nuclear bomb that's about to go off.
From the novelisation:
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She stepped closer and wrapped her arm around his neck. She kissed him, not defiantly like before, not as a challenge, but tenderly and with feeling. He kissed her back, wishing that this moment could be longer, that they had more time. But time was the one thing they didn't have.
The Dark Knight Rises - A Tale of Two Kisses.

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:31 PM   #69
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Not to mention that she insists on kissing him even though there's a nuclear bomb that's about to go off.
Exactly. She knew there wasn't much time left at all. If she didn't have feelings for him, or just saw him in the friend zone, she could easily just give him a quick kiss on the cheeks, but lol she had to go pretty deep and with passion.

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:32 PM   #70
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Obviously, the implication in the end is she's done being a burglar and she'll be starting fresh with Bruce but my friend said that she felt that she'll go back to being a thief had Bruce died. I told her that my impression is that she wanted to start fresh (hence her aggressively seeking out the "clean slate" program) regardless of whether Bruce died or not. And in a way, I felt that she wanted to prove Bruce right even if he died. My friend did bring up a good point though that being a burglar is what Selina is and she lives for the excitement of it (at least in the comics). Somehow, my impression is that Nolan's Selina isn't exactly like that and this one wanted that fresh start.
This is certainly a contrast between Nolan's Kyle and comic book Kyle. It's very rare when comic book Selina Kyle wants a normal life and a way to escape her criminal ways. Perhaps Nolan wrote her this way to be more like Bruce Wayne in a way: the two of them want to retire from their lifestyles. Bruce never wanted to be Batman forever, and it's certain that Selina doesn't want to be a thief forever. They both have a common, similar goal, which is one of the reasons the two of them ending up together and starting a new life together makes so much sense. They both yearn for a clean slate.

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She stepped closer and wrapped her arm around his neck. She kissed him, not defiantly like before, not as a challenge, but tenderly and with feeling. He kissed her back, wishing that this moment could be longer, that they had more time. But time was the one thing they didn't have.
Love this. At least Bats doesn't seem passive here.

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:33 PM   #71
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

She seems to enjoy having a Bat between her lips.

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:37 PM   #72
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She seems to enjoy having a Bat between her lips.


No kidding.

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:49 PM   #73
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No kidding.
I loved how she made the first move on both kiss. :lol:

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:50 PM   #74
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No kidding.
That pic pretty much shows what happens in TDKR with the 2 kisses there.

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Old 08-20-2012, 08:56 PM   #75
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Default Re: Anne Hathaway as Selina Kyle/Catwoman XXXIII

I'm glad they didn't have sex in the movie. The lack of it made their attraction stronger. It's like Bats has this girl who's freely offering herself (Miranda) and yet he's still insanely drawn by this other woman who's not right for him on paper.


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Love this. At least Bats doesn't seem passive here.
In the movie, he kinda looked passive. I blame though the camera angle but I think that was done because Batman's mask was stabbing Anne's face so they were trying to hide that.

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