The Official Lex Luthor Casting Thread - Part 6

[Oberon sexton]

Would he shoot himself at the end?

[Rust]

I actually wouldnt mind, I think. Last resort. Better that than being caught by the man of steel.

Of course, they could do it a bit more grand than just Lex blowing his brains out.

[ThePowerCosmic]

So... a Lex that isn't a billionaire or charming to the public eye, then ends up killing himself to avoid being caught by Superman?

That's not a Lex I want to see.

[Oberon sexton]

The Lex I want to see is the guy who has to draw on eyebrows.

[Rust]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

So... a Lex that isn't a billionaire or charming to the public eye, then ends up killing himself to avoid being caught by Superman?

That's not a Lex I want to see.

I only commented on the suicide thing. Which might be too much after all, I agree. I just dont want him thrown in jail at the end of a possible trilogy after all he's done. It has to have more resolution. A really fitting and satisfying end.

[DrCosmic]

Originally Posted by ElDuderino

What I think would be intriguing is a Moriarty-like charachter, similar to the version in BBC's Sherlock. He doesn't have to be a billionaire. He doesn't have to be charming (in a traditional sense). But he could use his mind and offscreen henchmen to screw with Superman the way Moriarty does Sherlock.

You probably have to have seen the show to realize what I'm getting at. But that sort of character would be a true match for Superman. He doesnt need an army or a suit of armor or kyptonite. This type of charachter would think those types if things are beneath him. He would believe his mind is an equal to Superman's strength.

It would require some very creative, thoughtful writers.

I did see that series, and yes, this. Lex Luthor should be on that Sherlock Holmes/Moriarty level of intelligence, manipulating everyone, even Superman, to work towards his ends - and even better if Lex Luthor pulls that trick BBC Moriarty pulled and hides in plain sight, meeting Superman as "Al" wearing disguising glasses and a wig and everything. Even some of the movie Holmes/Moriarity tricks, like just predicting/determining everything from just a few clues, or having a simple plot to change the entire world. And honestly, he should conclude the secret identity pretty easily.

Having him use things from the comics in new ways, such as using a battlesuit to fake his death, or processing typical Kryptonite into Red Kryptonite, or trapping him in a Red Sun room just to prove he can best him on even footing would just make him more boss. I think one of the bossest things he could do is give Superman a sadistic choice in which he can't actually save both people or fix both problems and he actually has to choose. I guess Joker did this in TDK too, but Luthor I think would elevated by being able to pull it off as well, but Luthor should play it straight, driving home how limited Superman's morality actually is.

I think Luthor, overall, should feel like he is the best of humanity, and be genuinely offended that an outsider (he should conclude Superman's alien heritage logically by observing him in their first conversation) would try to help him be better. A humanitarian, but as a means of gaining control of everything and everyone. Noble, but only because it gets him more money. His true depravity and villainy shouldn't be fully understood til near the end, when his 'twist' plan comes to fruition. I agree there should be another villain in the meantime, someone to box with. Metallo's a good choice because he can be a 'prototype' for the Lex Suit, but Bizzarro or Parasite also work as creations of Lex.

He, like Joker, shouldn't be ultimately defeated by Superman... simply... stopped. I would even dare say he should be an ally of sorts in a threequel, should one occur, though obviously he double crosses in the end. *cups hands over mouth* then he has my permission to die.

[ElDuderino]

Originally Posted by Oberon sexton

Would he shoot himself at the end?

oh, don't you know he's not dead either?

[ThePowerCosmic]

Originally Posted by Rust

I only commented on the suicide thing. Which might be too much after all, I agree. I just dont want him thrown in jail at the end of a possible trilogy after all he's done. It has to have more resolution. A really fitting and satisfying end.

I agree, jail would be anticlimactic for Luthor. I don't know, maybe a death by Darkseid's Omega Beams? Just brainstorming here.

[Oberon sexton]

The redemptive ending of All-Star Superman would be my favorite end for Lex.

[Rust]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

I agree, jail would be anticlimactic for Luthor. I don't know, maybe a death by Darkseid's Omega Beams? Just brainstorming here.

Maybe. If he doesnt die his penalty should be sort of a curse, that'll remain with him for the rest of his days. Side-effects from Brainiac posessing him or being banished to the Phantom Zone.

I wouldnt be opposed to a redemption, though he still has to face a penalty.

[Rodrigo90]

We don't know if Brainiac will show up with Lex, and banishing him to the Phantom Zone doesn't sound PC if you ask me.

Lex should have his company and his honor ripped entirely away from him, that would be the ultimate defeat for him in my eyes. Put in jail seems fitting. But I would love to see another movie have him break free in the effort to destroy Superman once again...then he should DIE!!!

[ElDuderino]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

So... a Lex that isn't a billionaire or charming to the public eye, then ends up killing himself to avoid being caught by Superman?

That's not a Lex I want to see.

No, the killing himself had nothing to do with it. The idea was more of having a "genius criminal mastermind" that was actually a genius criminal mastermind. The BBC Sherlock version of Moriarty is about the best I've ever seen that role done.

A billionaire that just happens to hate Superman is boring. He needs to have motivation. And a genius like Moriarty who is psychotically and deleteriously bent on proving his brains over Superman's brawn would be very intriguing.

[ThePowerCosmic]

Originally Posted by ElDuderino

No, the killing himself had nothing to do with it. The idea was more of having a "genius criminal mastermind" that was actually a genius criminal mastermind. The BBC Sherlock version of Moriarty is about the best I've ever seen that role done.

A billionaire that just happens to hate Superman is boring. He needs to have motivation. And a genius like Moriarty who is psychotically and deleteriously bent on proving his brains over Superman's brawn would be very intriguing.

Yeah, and a Luthor who could've been humanity's savior if he wasn't so wrapped up in his own hatred for Superman is interesting as well. I'd like a Lex that's a hybrid.

[ElDuderino]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

Yeah, and a Luthor who could've been humanity's savior if he wasn't so wrapped up in his own hatred for Superman is interesting as well. I'd like a Lex that's a hybrid.

His motivation for hating Superman is that he could have been humanity's savior? How so? What does Superman do that prevents him from doing whatever good thing he would otherwise do?

[ThePowerCosmic]

Originally Posted by ElDuderino

His motivation for hating Superman is that he could have been humanity's savior? How so? What does Superman do that prevents him from doing whatever good thing he would otherwise do?

If he wasn't busy obsessing over coming up with ways to stop Superman, he could be doing other things to benefit mankind. For example, developing a cure for Cancer. I suppose it's a form of jealousy and the fact that Luthor had to work for what he had, whereas with Superman his power comes naturally... And he's loved by a planet that he doesn't even belong on, in Luthor's eyes.

[ElDuderino]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

If he wasn't busy obsessing over coming up with ways to stop Superman, he could be doing other things to benefit mankind. For example, developing a cure for Cancer.

Okay, so he doesn't have any particular reason to hate Superman? He just does?

The cool thing about a Moriarty-like Luthor is that he doesn't actually hate Superman. He just wants to prove he's better. The problem with hate is that for it to be believable, the writers have to come up with some kind of motivation.

Edit: I'll respond to your edit:

I suppose it's a form of jealousy and the fact that Luthor had to work for what he had, whereas with Superman his power comes naturally... And he's loved by a planet that he doesn't even belong on, in Luthor's eyes.

So he hates Superman because he's jealous? Eh...I don't want him to feel inferior. I'd rather him feel superior to Superman and simply want to prove it.

[Oberon sexton]

It's one of his main goals in the comics, he insists that if Superman weren't around saving everyone and doing everything for everyone that he could actually help humanity's problems with his genius intellect and that Superman sets an impossible standard and things like that.

A hypothetical ending would have Supes calling him out on it:
"You could have saved the world years ago if it really meant something to you."

"...you're right."

[ThePowerCosmic]

Originally Posted by ElDuderino

Okay, so he doesn't have any particular reason to hate Superman? He just does?

The cool thing about a Moriarty-like Luthor is that he doesn't actually hate Superman. He just wants to prove he's better. The problem with hate is that for it to be believable, the writers have to come up with some kind of motivation.

I edited my post and included the reasons why he'd hate Superman. Also, this vid sums it up as well. A mixture of Moriarty and that version of Lex would be ideal imo. Oberon Sexton has the right idea.

VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:

[ElDuderino]

See my edit above. I just don't want him to ever display hatred. That's derived from weakness in my opinion. I want him to have that unwavering confidence that Moriarty has. That final scene of the last episode of Sherlock where Moriarty gets upset when he thinks Sherlock is "ordinary" is fantastic. He's disappointed that he's that much superior and it makes his life boring again.

This would serve both to give Superman a formidable opponent and to humanize Superman.

[ThePowerCosmic]

Originally Posted by ElDuderino

Okay, so he doesn't have any particular reason to hate Superman? He just does?

The cool thing about a Moriarty-like Luthor is that he doesn't actually hate Superman. He just wants to prove he's better. The problem with hate is that for it to be believable, the writers have to come up with some kind of motivation.

Edit: I'll respond to your edit:

So he hates Superman because he's jealous? Eh...I don't want him to feel inferior. I'd rather him feel superior to Superman and simply want to prove it.

He doesn't feel inferior. He feels that he is superior to Superman, and he wants to entire world to know it. That's why he goes out of his way doing what he does. Lex has always hated Superman, I can't recall a version that didn't. His hatred for the MoS is in his character... He really wants to kill this guy, and he'll go all out to do it.

[ElDuderino]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

He doesn't feel inferior. He feels that he is superior to Superman, and he wants to entire world to know it. That's why he goes out of his way doing what he does.

Well, that's exactly what I was talking about.

[ThePowerCosmic]

Originally Posted by ElDuderino

Well, that's exactly what I was talking about.

Lex has always seemed like a Moriarty type to me. Always having to be a step ahead of Superman.

[ElDuderino]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

Lex has always seemed like a Moriarty type to me. Always having to be a step ahead of Superman.

It's just never been executed well.

[DrCosmic]

Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic

Lex has always seemed like a Moriarty type to me. Always having to be a step ahead of Superman.

I've never seen Lex impress me with his intelligence really. People say he's very intelligent all the time, and he's definitely done science-y things, going back to his mad science roots, but it never seemed to me like he was any smarter than the average mad scientist, if that means anything. A "modern" lex twenty years ago was an evil businessman, one step ahead. A modern lex now should be ten to twenty steps ahead.

[Oberon sexton]

There's this great idea, again from All-Star Superman, (are people seeing a pattern here? ) that Superman and Lois could never have children together because of their biological differences. But Lex, whilst on Death Row realizes just how wrong he was and basically comes up with a theorem that allows Human/Kryptonian DNA to be combined.