Tom Hiddleston: Loki Redux

[metaphysician]

See, I'm not asking "Would it be a good idea for Loki to achieve redemption", or "Should Loki achieve redemption." I'm asking "What would it take for him to achieve redemption?" which is its own question. You seem to be taking the view "once a villain, always a villain" and rejecting the very concept of redemption as a possibility.

[Iron-Fan]

Bassicly, we need this in Thor 3:

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by Iron-Fan

Bassicly, we need this in Thor 3:

all humor of this scan aside, seriously we do

[Oberon sexton]

Originally Posted by metaphysician

See, I'm not asking "Would it be a good idea for Loki to achieve redemption", or "Should Loki achieve redemption." I'm asking "What would it take for him to achieve redemption?" which is its own question. You seem to be taking the view "once a villain, always a villain" and rejecting the very concept of redemption as a possibility.

If he could undo what he did, and ressurect every single life he stole. Then he'd be in the clear but barring that, I think he'd need to die.

[Godzilla2000]

I think it's pretty apparent that Loki is simply not Good Guy type material. He's much to self absorbed and opportunistic to be as selfless as his brother.

[jaqua99]

Exactly.

[BigThor]

Originally Posted by Iron-Fan

Bassicly, we need this in Thor 3:

I sure hope Loki is able to do more than create duplicates and shoot blasts from a staff by the time they face Surtur.

Because current Loki just wouldn't cut it, nothing he did in THOR or The Avengers is capable of harming Surtur.

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by BigThor

I sure hope Loki is able to do more than create duplicates and shoot blasts from a staff by the time they face Surtur.

Because current Loki just wouldn't cut it, nothing he did in THOR or The Avengers is capable of harming Surtur.

Oh I agree. I really want him to show that he is a powerful being himself. Simply more magic use would be good.

[Godzilla2000]

You know, I have been watching some Loki tribute videos on Youtube and I did see that tear many have been talking about when Loki stabs Thor and it got me thinking a pretty gut wrenching thought. I was thinking how in Loki's lifetime no one except for maybe Thor, Odin and Frigga have shed a tear for him and his hidden pain. Hypothetically speaking to have most Asgardians he knows either despise him for his difference or be jealous of his stature or to constantly be reminded of mistakes he's made in the past that he's genuinely sorry for must be another source of immeasurably deep personal pain for him. With all those people around him just tolerating him at best because he's a prince of Asgard he must feel completely lonely not having anyone besides his adopted mother bothering to understand his uniqueness. It's almost like in the MCU Frigga has really been his only accepted true friend. To think of that aspect of the character, it brings a tear to my eye.

[Oberon sexton]

He IS sympathetic to an extent.

And yeah you can sympathize, you can understand. But you also have to judge.

[American Maid]

Originally Posted by Godzilla2000

You know, I have been watching some Loki tribute videos on Youtube and I did see that tear many have been talking about when Loki stabs Thor and it got me thinking a pretty gut wrenching thought. I was thinking how in Loki's lifetime no one except for maybe Thor, Odin and Frigga have shed a tear for him and his hidden pain. Hypothetically speaking to have most Asgardians he knows either despise him for his difference or be jealous of his stature or to constantly be reminded of mistakes he's made in the past that he's genuinely sorry for must be another source of immeasurably deep personal pain for him. With all those people around him just tolerating him at best because he's a prince of Asgard he must feel completely lonely not having anyone besides his adopted mother bothering to understand his uniqueness. It's almost like in the MCU Frigga has really been his only accepted true friend. To think of that aspect of the character, it brings a tear to my eye.

Yes, that's a good point.

Along the same lines: earlier in the film (going from memory, so this might be a little inacurate), Thor says something to the effect that Loki was believed to be dead. Loki says, "Did you mourn me, brother?" Thor replies, "We all did." A blogger observed, and I agree, that this is a bit of a dodge on Thor's part, though maybe he meant to convey a broader base of affection toward Loki. Thor doesn't answer Loki's question. With Loki in the frame of mind that Godzilla2000 describes, he would take that to be a "no".

BTW, Rene Russo has commented that Loki needs his mom, so she hoped they'll show that in the next film. So that would fit in with this element too.

[Anubis]

I think the mistake they made with Loki in the movies is that they kept his parentage a secret. Comic wise, (And I'm pretty sure Myth wise) He knew exactly who his real parents were, and he was reminded of it every day by every douche bag with an axe to grind, ESPECIALLY Odin. It makes his inevitable change from simple, Mischievous jerk to complete, murdering, A-hole more believable.

[Rock Sexton]

Originally Posted by American Maid

Yes, that's a good point.

Along the same lines: earlier in the film (going from memory, so this might be a little inacurate), Thor says something to the effect that Loki was believed to be dead. Loki says, "Did you mourn me, brother?" Thor replies, "We all did." A blogger observed, and I agree, that this is a bit of a dodge on Thor's part, though maybe he meant to convey a broader base of affection toward Loki. Thor doesn't answer Loki's question. With Loki in the frame of mind that Godzilla2000 describes, he would take that to be a "no".

BTW, Rene Russo has commented that Loki needs his mom, so she hoped they'll show that in the next film. So that would fit in with this element too.

It was no "dodge" ..... Thor was conveying the entire family's feelings and that Loki's importance was more than just to himself.

I'm sure in some part of Loki's mind it irritates him because after all, they are not his true parentage.

[Godzilla2000]

Originally Posted by American Maid

BTW, Rene Russo has commented that Loki needs his mom, so she hoped they'll show that in the next film. So that would fit in with this element too.

I have to confess that I loved her tough female character in the Lethal Weapon movies she was in. It was a real treat for me to see Rene Russo in Thor. I hope that they have Frigga more involved with Loki's plot arc not just because of the character but I really enjoyed her performance in Thor. I think dramatically speaking the conversation she has with Odin that was a deleted scene in Thor would work on a more dramatic level if they reworked it to fit Loki's predicament. I daresay such a passionate argument from Frigga would suit the misunderstood, beleaguered Loki better.

Of course between Frigga and Odin I can see both sides of their argument. I could understand Frigga's indignation on how Odin mishandled raising Loki, the bastard Prince of the Frost Giants, from the start. I can also understand that Odin had to make a hard decision to punish Loki for all the suffering he himself had caused both in Thor and in the Avengers. With Loki answers on how to handle him are never an easy thing because it seems punishments will only make him worse mentally but yet his actions cannot go unpunished.

[American Maid]

Originally Posted by Godzilla2000

I have to confess that I loved her tough female character in the Lethal Weapon movies she was in. It was a real treat for me to see Rene Russo in Thor. I hope that they have Frigga more involved with Loki's plot arc not just because of the character but I really enjoyed her performance in Thor. I think dramatically speaking the conversation she has with Odin that was a deleted scene in Thor would work on a more dramatic level if they reworked it to fit Loki's predicament. I daresay such a passionate argument from Frigga would suit the misunderstood, beleaguered Loki better.

Of course between Frigga and Odin I can see both sides of their argument. I could understand Frigga's indignation on how Odin mishandled raising Loki, the bastard Prince of the Frost Giants, from the start. I can also understand that Odin had to make a hard decision to punish Loki for all the suffering he himself had caused both in Thor and in the Avengers. With Loki answers on how to handle him are never an easy thing because it seems punishments will only make him worse mentally but yet his actions cannot go unpunished.

I agree. It will be very interesting to see how it plays out! I hope she gets to have some of those scenes.

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by American Maid

Yes, that's a good point.

Along the same lines: earlier in the film (going from memory, so this might be a little inacurate), Thor says something to the effect that Loki was believed to be dead. Loki says, "Did you mourn me, brother?" Thor replies, "We all did." A blogger observed, and I agree, that this is a bit of a dodge on Thor's part, though maybe he meant to convey a broader base of affection toward Loki. Thor doesn't answer Loki's question. With Loki in the frame of mind that Godzilla2000 describes, he would take that to be a "no".

BTW, Rene Russo has commented that Loki needs his mom, so she hoped they'll show that in the next film. So that would fit in with this element too.

Disagree. i think he was just saying everyone mourned. You saw at the end of Thor. He was sadden, and they said he mourns for his brother

[American Maid]

Originally Posted by jaqua99

Disagree. i think he was just saying everyone mourned. You saw at the end of Thor. He was sadden, and they said he mourns for his brother

I think Thor genuinely mourned the loss of his brother. (And I think he sincerely meant to convey that there was broad grief over Loki's loss). But I think his reply would tend not to reassure his brother because it sounds like a dodge.

Now, I read that blog entry more recently than I have seen the movie. Once the film becomes available via Netflix, I intend to watch it again. So maybe on a second viewing I will see it differently.

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by American Maid

Yes, that's a good point.

Along the same lines: earlier in the film (going from memory, so this might be a little inacurate), Thor says something to the effect that Loki was believed to be dead. Loki says, "Did you mourn me, brother?" Thor replies, "We all did." A blogger observed, and I agree, that this is a bit of a dodge on Thor's part, though maybe he meant to convey a broader base of affection toward Loki. Thor doesn't answer Loki's question. With Loki in the frame of mind that Godzilla2000 describes, he would take that to be a "no".

BTW, Rene Russo has commented that Loki needs his mom, so she hoped they'll show that in the next film. So that would fit in with this element too.

Originally Posted by American Maid

I think Thor genuinely mourned the loss of his brother. (And I think he sincerely meant to convey that there was broad grief over Loki's loss). But I think his reply would tend not to reassure his brother because it sounds like a dodge.

Now, I read that blog entry more recently than I have seen the movie. Once the film becomes available via Netflix, I intend to watch it again. So maybe on a second viewing I will see it differently.

Second? Well I have seen the film over 9 times, I have it. I don't think it was a dodge. Unless, you mean Loki took the intention of it wrong? If that is what you mean, then I agree with you. Thor meant that there was a larger mourning than just himself, but Loki may have taken it as a dodge, because he thought Thor didn't want to tell him he didn't mourn?

[American Maid]

Originally Posted by jaqua99

Second? Well I have seen the film over 9 times, I have it. I don't think it was a dodge. Unless, you mean Loki took the intention of it wrong? If that is what you mean, then I agree with you. Thor meant that there was a larger mourning than just himself, but Loki may have taken it as a dodge, because he thought Thor didn't want to tell him he didn't mourn?

Yes. I think there's an element of insecurity to Loki's motivation. So when he asks a direct question, did you, Thor, mourn me, and gets an answer that talks more about what people other than Thor did, he's liable to take that as a dodge. (And if one were to want to dodge such a question, avoid giving an an unpopular answer, giving a broad, general response is one way to do it.)

I've run across page scans from various Thor books from different years where Thor says, "I miss my brother." So I think he genuinely loves his brother and misses him, and mourned him when he thought he was gone. It will be quite interesting to see in the next film how Thor struggles to reconcile his love for his brother, his commitment to justice, and coming to terms with how his brother really is.

The decision of punishment of course resides with Odin. But suppose Odin asks Thor, "If you were king, what punishment would you give?" I think it would be hard for Thor to answer. But someday such a question will surely fall to him.

Wish the film were coming out sooner!

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by American Maid

Yes. I think there's an element of insecurity to Loki's motivation. So when he asks a direct question, did you, Thor, mourn me, and gets an answer that talks more about what people other than Thor did, he's liable to take that as a dodge. (And if one were to want to dodge such a question, avoid giving an an unpopular answer, giving a broad, general response is one way to do it.)

I've run across page scans from various Thor books from different years where Thor says, "I miss my brother." So I think he genuinely loves his brother and misses him, and mourned him when he thought he was gone. It will be quite interesting to see in the next film how Thor struggles to reconcile his love for his brother, his commitment to justice, and coming to terms with how his brother really is.

The decision of punishment of course resides with Odin. But suppose Odin asks Thor, "If you were king, what punishment would you give?" I think it would be hard for Thor to answer. But someday such a question will surely fall to him.

Wish the film were coming out sooner!

I remember reading that

[ironmaidenrules]

Do you think anyone is Asgard is loyal to Loki? Like some guards actually think he was right and that Odin was too weak. I mean people liked Thor and he initially felt that way about Odin. Would be interesting to have spies feeding Loki info.

Loki: having trouble mighty Prince?
Thor: what does thou know of my troubles
Loki: walls have eyes and Lord Loki sees all

[American Maid]

Originally Posted by ironmaidenrules

Do you think anyone is Asgard is loyal to Loki? Like some guards actually think he was right and that Odin was too weak. I mean people liked Thor and he initially felt that way about Odin. Would be interesting to have spies feeding Loki info.

Loki: having trouble mighty Prince?
Thor: what does thou know of my troubles
Loki: walls have eyes and Lord Loki sees all

Ooo, yes, palace intrigue would be interesting!

[metaphysician]

The trouble with palace intrigue like that is the big Heimdall-shaped obstacle in the way. Sure, he's not watching and listening all the time, but often enough that people actively worry about being heard. And given what he said in Thor, Loki seems to be the first person to figure out a way to conceal themselves from his senses; unless he can teach that to others, it won't help any. Especially since if Loki's prison is not extremely secure and always monitored, Odin is an idiot.

[Godzilla2000]

Originally Posted by metaphysician

The trouble with palace intrigue like that is the big Heimdall-shaped obstacle in the way. Sure, he's not watching and listening all the time, but often enough that people actively worry about being heard. And given what he said in Thor, Loki seems to be the first person to figure out a way to conceal themselves from his senses; unless he can teach that to others, it won't help any. Especially since if Loki's prison is not extremely secure and always monitored, Odin is an idiot.

Plus let's not forget in the MCU only a handful of people know that Loki is actually a Frost Giant. Imagine what would happen if it was let out that one of their Asgardian princes was actually the son of the enemy? Sure you'll have a few open minded Asgardians but i think the majority of them would be in a state of uproar over that.

[Silvermoon]

Posting a bit of Hiddleston silliness, hope no one minds that it's not necessarily Loki related. If anyone remembers Hiddleston did an appearance a couple months ago on MTV's After Hours where he "Loki'd" host Josh Horowitz and took on the persona of "Steve" who had a mustache that he named Wendy. Well today Hiddleston's army decided bring forth "Project Wendy" to show appreciation for Tom and took to twitter/tumblr. Ultimately trending for a bit in both the UK and US (at least), they gained the notice of MTV & Tom:

http://splashpage.mtv.com/2012/09/07...endy-avengers/

Tom Hiddleston @twhiddleston
#ProjectWendy is hilarious and insane and foolish and wonderful. You guys. Way to make a man feel great. http://say.ly/VsU47NJ

I've seen some speculate that Tom may have swiped that mustache from Zach Levi as it seems that could pass for Fandral's mustache.

Edit: And just to bring something Loki related in (albeit, still silly), stumbled across this on tumblr:

http://starkimageries.tumblr.com/post/31083751905