TDKR Oscar Chances? - Part 1

[JackWhite]

Originally Posted by Brain Damage

Batman punches Bane quite a few times in the face during their first fight, but anytime he's about to get in a good shot Bane stops him. A good example of this is when Batman's got Bane on the ground.

This!

During the first fight, Batman attacks Bane with a flurry of well placed shots, then goes to punch him in the face and Bane catches both punches, and tells him how victory has defeated him.

The same exchange happens during the middle of their second fight, except this time Batman actually over powers Bane when he catches his punch. He then breaks loose of Bane's grip and uppercuts him in the face, hitting the mask.

Come on guys, pay attention!

[Optimus_Prime_]

Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises

Okay, but that's just paying lip service to the idea. They blew up a planet in ANH, we never see any destruction on that scale in ROTJ. TDKR takes it further, brings the villain closer to victory, in fact the villain pretty much wins halfway through the movie.

They practically wipe out the Rebel forces in Jedi. It's basically the Ewoks that save them. You're just flat out wrong in your assertion that the Empire was weaker in Jedi than they were in a New Hope. The odds were far greater. That was the Rebelions last shot against the Empire. Had they failed in Jedi they're wouldn't be a second shot. It's plain about this throughout the whole film. They hardly just payed it lip service.

[JackWhite]

Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises

Okay, but that's just paying lip service to the idea. They blew up a planet in ANH, we never see any destruction on that scale in ROTJ. TDKR takes it further, brings the villain closer to victory, in fact the villain pretty much wins halfway through the movie.

TDKR is miles ahead of ROTJ when it comes to being a more solid and satisfying film, IMHO.

Sure, I didn't want LOS version 2.0, but I give Nolan props for differentiating Bane/Talia's League as a more extreme, gun touting, militant rag-tag group rather than Ra's' more refined, jujitsu-based Eco-terrorists.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_

The Dark Knight Rises reminds me a lot of Godfather 3 because Godfather 3 isn't really a bad movie, just clearly inferior to it's predecessors.

The Dark Knight Rises reminds me of Return of the King in that it's a brilliant ending to a magnificent trilogy

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by JackWhite

TDKR is miles ahead of ROTJ when it comes to being a more solid and satisfying film, IMHO.

Sure, I didn't want LOS version 2.0, but I give Nolan props for differentiating Bane/Talia's League as a more extreme, gun touting, militant rag-tag group rather than Ra's' more refined, jujitsu-based Eco-terrorists.

And that's the thing. Talia and Bane did NOT want to have the LoS version 2.0. Talia only wanted to do what her father couldn't and to destroy Gotham while Talia and Bane had much different ways of doing such without the same "morals" and "ideals" that Ra's al Ghul's League of Shadows had.

[Optimus_Prime_]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

The Dark Knight Rises reminds me of Return of the King in that it's a brilliant ending to a magnificent trilogy

No.

[BatLobsterRises]

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_

The practically wipe out the Rebel forces in Jedi. It's basically the Ewoks that save them. You're just flat out wrong in your assertion that the Empire was weaker in Jedi than they were in a New Hope. The odds were far greater. That was the Rebelions last shot against the Empire. Had they failed in Jedi they're wouldn't be a second shot. It's plain about this throughout the whole film. They hardly just payed it lip service.

Okay, I get all that. What I'm trying to say is this sense of danger wasn't conveyed other than through dialogue and exposition, to me. The Rebellion knew this was there big chance, because the Empire had a glaring weakness in that the rebels knew the Emperor was going to be aboard the Death Star. There's some hope there, so it feels more even keel. TDKR pummels you with hopelessness, and I think that's how it should be in an epic conclusion. It actually felt like evil was stronger than ever because you saw the bad guys accomplishing things the bad guys in the previous movies didn't even scratch the surface of. It was more visceral to me.

Anyway, that's not what we were arguing in the first place, we were talking about bringing back plot devices from movie 1. And to me TDKR beats ROTJ in that regard by more thoroughly differentiating itself than simply saying "this Death Star is stronger" but doing nothing cinematically to really make us believe that. We don't even know that it's operational until the end of the movie. TDKR has a whole character (Bane) to represent that this incarnation of the LOS is different, more brutal, more militant, more extreme.

Mind you, I'm still quite fond of ROTJ. I just like TDKR more.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_

No.

No it doesn't remind me of ROTK?

[Alexei Belyakov]

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_

The Dark Knight Rises reminds me a lot of Godfather 3 because Godfather 3 isn't really a bad movie, just clearly inferior to it's predecessors.

No.

[Tequilla]

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_

No.

I agree. Rotk is a snoozefest.

Rises is unprecedented . Much better than its predecessors

[regwec]

ROTK is a typical PJ movie: bloated in places, contracted in others, with a pace as satisfying as getting stuck behind the dinky village-to-village train when you caught the no-stops cross-country service.

[Spider-Fan]

Originally Posted by Dark Knight

That's your opinion buddy.

Yes it is

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_

The Dark Knight Rises reminds me a lot of Godfather 3 because Godfather 3 isn't really a bad movie, just clearly inferior to it's predecessors.

I agree with this, and another thing they have in common (for me_ I also believe that Godfather III didn't deserve a nomination. It only got that nomination because of the Godfather brand name. I don't thik TDKR will get that benefit since it didn't follow 2 BP winners.

[BatLobsterRises]

It'll be an interesting morning when the Oscar nominees are announced. I really have no idea if it'll get it or not. I'm leaning no, but then again I was leaning yes with TDK and then...the snub heard round the world.

[CapedCrusader14]

Originally Posted by regwec

ROTK is a typical PJ movie: bloated in places, contracted in others, with a pace as satisfying as getting stuck behind the dinky village-to-village train when you caught the no-stops cross-country service.

[Spider-Fan]

Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises

It'll be an interesting morning when the Oscar nominees are announced. I really have no idea if it'll get it or not. I'm leaning no, but then again I was leaning yes with TDK and then...the snub heard round the world.

Though TDK got snubbed big time, I do hate the 10 BP Noms format they adopted. For me, it makes a BP nomination less valuable. Especially when most of those are appeasement spots.

I am leaning toward no with TDKR for a BP nom as well. So far, I don't think the buzz is there, and I feel with more buzz, it prob would have gotten a nomination since they expanded to 10 films, so it would have an easier time doing it than TDK did with only 5 nominations available to compete with. But, that buzz just doesn't seem to be there.

[TheBat812]

What's stupid to me is that it's 'up to ten' films. As if those top choices are universally better than every other piece of cinema around the world... If you're going to do that, at least include foreigns in there or something.

[jmc]

Originally Posted by Spider-Fan

Though TDK got snubbed big time, I do hate the 10 BP Noms format they adopted. For me, it makes a BP nomination less valuable. Especially when most of those are appeasement spots.

I am leaning toward no with TDKR for a BP nom as well. So far, I don't think the buzz is there, and I feel with more buzz, it prob would have gotten a nomination since they expanded to 10 films, so it would have an easier time doing it than TDK did with only 5 nominations available to compete with. But, that buzz just doesn't seem to be there.

It isn't there. And even if it does crack a nomination for Best Picture what exactly does that mean? Some fans are going to rejoice because they will see it repayment for TDK getting overlooked. But it's a hollow victory. What's the use of celebrating such a hollow victory? That's like being proud of beating a one legged man in a foot race. I also dislike the 10 nominations thing, it was a knee jerk reaction to TDK getting snubbed. The problem wasn't there weren't enough BP spots, the problem was the Academy members were only voting for certain types of films. I can still remember the look on the Academy President's face as the nomination where being read out, through a forced smile the look was that of a man who knew a **** storm that was about to comes their way. lol

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Tequilla

I agree. Rotk is a snoozefest.

No..no it wasn't.

[The Joker]

Originally Posted by jmc

Funny how that video mentioned Godfather 3 and Jedi - now what do those films have in common again? Oh that's right, they are considered inferior to the first two films in the series. Clearly the results from these so called trilogy 'rules' speak for themselves.

Exactly.

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_

The Dark Knight Rises reminds me a lot of Godfather 3 because Godfather 3 isn't really a bad movie, just clearly inferior to it's predecessors.

Perfect analogy

[BatLobsterRises]

The difference between Godfather 3 and The Dark Knight Rises is that virtually nobody would argue that Godfather 3 is the best of that trilogy.

With The Dark Knight Rises, you get a lot of everything. Some think it's the weakest, for others its equal with TDK, I think for most people it's the second best, and then there's still a plenty who consider it the best or their personal favorite. I think this definitely a "marathon" worthy trilogy.

[Anno_Domini]

40% on the TDKR boards is saying it's a 10/10 on that one poll and there's another poll somewhere that even has TDKR as the better film of the trilogy. I highly doubt the same would be said if there was a poll on giving Godfather 3 a rating or if it was the best.

Like I said, TDKR is a polarizing film even with Batman fans, but a rather large chunk loves the film and would regard TDKR as the best of the three.

[Fudgie]

Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises

The difference between Godfather 3 and The Dark Knight Rises is that virtually nobody would argue that Godfather 3 is the best of that trilogy.

With The Dark Knight Rises, you get a lot of everything. Some think it's the weakest, for others its equal with TDK, I think for most people it's the second best, and then there's still a plenty who consider it the best or their personal favorite. I think this definitely a "marathon" worthy trilogy.

Give it time. Rises ain't even out on DVD yet and it's already got Batman fans divided up. Time is not going to be kind to it me thinks.

In fact I bet by this time next year when people own it and have more time to watch it it will be universally seen as the worst one.

Yup, I think that's how it's gonna go down.

[jmc]

Originally Posted by Fudgie

Give it time. Rises ain't even out on DVD yet and it's already got Batman fans divided up. Time is not going to be kind to it me thinks.

In fact I bet by this time next year when people own it and have more time to watch it it will be universally seen as the worst one.

Yup, I think that's how it's gonna go down.

That would not surprise me in the least.

[CapedCrusader14]

It's such a shame to me cause I feel it's the weakest but it has some of my favourite scenes in the trilogy.

[The Chris]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

40% on the TDKR boards is saying it's a 10/10 on that one poll and there's another poll somewhere that even has TDKR as the better film of the trilogy. I highly doubt the same would be said if there was a poll on giving Godfather 3 a rating or if it was the best.

Like I said, TDKR is a polarizing film even with Batman fans, but a rather large chunk loves the film and would regard TDKR as the best of the three.

yeah and I dont think time will hurt tdkr. if anything time will help it and really outside of the internet tdkr isnt even all that polarizing. it still has people watching it at my job. plus most people would say godfather part 3 is by far the worst, while most people ive met and asked have said tdkr is at least their second best. in fact id say this trilogy is more evened out than most when it comes to that. a lot have said bb is their fave, a lot have said tdk and a lot have said tdkr, and thats fantastic. if I was forced to id probably say tdk is the best one, but tdkr is my favorite one, with bb being the best origin that ever lived!