Wonder Woman Thread Reborn! - Part 9

[DrCosmic]

Originally Posted by Zionite1

Exactly she had Spy adventures fighting Nazis.She also had war adventures with her fighting Nazis.If we were to modernise her war adventures wed probably have a Middle Eastern terrorist organisation to replace the Nazis though.

Which makes sense for someone who's main enemy is War himself.

Originally Posted by Deathstroke

It's not that they've forgotten who Wonder Woman is. It's that the studio wants to make money off this picture and have to tweak the character in a way that they think will accomplish that task.

When it comes down to it, WW's biggest challenge is the studio's lack of faith in a female superhero, and lack of understanding about how to present her.

I definitely understand why Steve Trevor would have to be a hero type. It seems logical to the studio that little boys won't be playing with Wonder Woman action figures. It's a challenging character to market.

Steve has always been a hero type, though, and I think that's kinda underlines how people have forgotten who Wonder Woman is. Every writer is trying to figure her out. That means the only thing most know to have faith in her about is that she is a female superhero, as though just being female will sell a movie, and we all know better, I think.

If people understood how strong the core concept of Wonder Woman was, about her themes and charm, I think studios would have something to put faith in other than action-boobs.

Anecdote: I remember one time I was watching TV and The Batchelorette came on. I *hate* shows like that with a passion, these guys kinda sizing each other up, waiting for her to show up to this outdoor activity, then, this girl, this woman comes sailing over the dunes on an ATV in a helmet, vest and bikini bottoms. She does a couple more jumps before she comes skidding to a halt in front of the guys takes off her helmet, flicks out her hair, smiles like a Cheshire cat and says "Are you guys coming or not?" I basically said "I'm in love" out loud, the other girls in the room just laughed. But that's really what Wonder Woman should capture, its what she was when she was *actually* as popular as Superman and Batman back in the Golden Age. She was basically 'I *am* the adventure, come with me.' That's engaging to everyone and it makes her the girl that everyone wants to be and every guy wants to be with - without her being a tramp or unfeminine.

[DrCosmic]

Originally Posted by TheComicbookKid

I think you're imaging some of that.

By the time WW came about, the war was mostly over. How many of her early Marston adventures even dealt with mass war or Nazis?

By my memory, her adventures were cosmic/sci-fi with her running into some weird woman hating group. She just bust in there and started busting skulls.


The mythological stuff took over cause people could be lazy and stop inventing villains for her. Everyone knows who Ares is and why he's a bad guy. Cheetah, Doctor Psycho,... not so much.

Perhaps some of the later golden age stories were that, I haven't read many of them, but her original appeal was definitely a spy dealing with Nazis or Nazi remnants.

But you're so right on the devolution of her rogues' gallery. Oy.

Originally Posted by Zionite1

Hmm I partially understand their worry on having a female Superhero.Partially.

To help with the odds Id probably heavily market the fact she has a badass MALE sidekick-Steve Trevor- in the trailers.That shld help with the Dont-wanna-see-chick-hero part of the audience.

Id market it the same way youd market a Batman and Robin movie with WW being "Batman",Steve being "Robin".The movie itself will focus more on Diana though.

I think Steve will end up pretty epic, like Splinter Cell black ops type suit and goggles dual wielding back to back with Wonder Woman. I don't think that'll bother me much as long as Diana saves him a couple times and
she ends up facing the final foe alone.

I think it's also important that the story start with Diana before we get to Steve Trevor crashing.

[terry78]

Trevor is basically her Lois Lane in a sense. Neither of them are really damsels per se, but because they like to go looking for trouble they gotta be saved all the time.

[Joeyjojo72]

So who would be the best director for this movie? I have absolutely no idea.

oh and i think if they're gonna look to the comics for inspiration, the director/writers should go with the latest reboot and ignore 90% of what came before. My two cents.

[Rodrigo90]

Well whenever anybody says they know and understand the characters, they fail. So somebody like Nolan...not in terms of style, but somebody who respects themselves enough to make the best movie they can, for their reputations sake.

[DrCosmic]

Originally Posted by Joeyjojo72

oh and i think if they're gonna look to the comics for inspiration, the director/writers should go with the latest reboot and ignore 90% of what came before. My two cents.

There are a lot of people who feel that way. It's weird, the new reboot does nothing for me. I don't recognize Diana as a character, nor do I find this girl compelling really. I may try to re-read with fresh eyes so I can get what everyone is liking about it.

So who would be the best director for this movie? I have absolutely no idea.

Originally Posted by Rodrigo90

Well whenever anybody says they know and understand the characters, they fail. So somebody like Nolan...not in terms of style, but somebody who respects themselves enough to make the best movie they can, for their reputations sake.

I think Joker's Lackey was really onto something with Alfonso Cuaron directing, but for someone reliable, I'd love to see Brad Bird put together the slickness and action of Ghost Protocol with the superhero sensibilities of Incredibles and the epicness and relationship building of Iron Giant. As far as I can tell, he only makes good films, if he picked up Wonder Woman, we'd have a winner, I think.

[TheComicbookKid]

Originally Posted by DrCosmic

There are a lot of people who feel that way. It's weird, the new reboot does nothing for me. I don't recognize Diana as a character, nor do I find this girl compelling really. I may try to re-read with fresh eyes so I can get what everyone is liking about it.

The book's visually exciting but hollow.

Nothing in the book doesn't have any sort of pulse about anything that's not connected to the Gods.

What's Diana's relationship to her Mother? Dunno
Who is Zola? The woman bearing Zeus' child
Why is Diana in London? Dunno
Why did Diana leave the island? She got tired of it and wanted to explore? Her sisters were mean?
What non-Gods does Diana fight? Dunno.
What did Hermes task WW to do? Protect the child.
what's the prophecy? A child of Zeus...

Those extra tidbits that help shape a character. Aren't there.

[Rodrigo90]

Cauron or Bird would be great.

But what with his direction for Harry Potter, I'd prefer Cauron myself.

[jaymes_e06]

They gave zola a lot of character development what you talkin bout tck?

[Joeyjojo72]

this is just my opinion. i know its probably blasphemy to hardcore Wondy fans, but I never read her books as a kid and Azzarello has really piqued my interest in the character for the first time. My understanding was that he really captured/distilled what made WW and her world special, while jetisoning (a word?) the cheesy and anachronistic elements. Not the case?

Anyway, thats my perspective on it.

edit: im a big fan of Cliff Chiang, so that has a lot to do with my johnny-come-lately affection for the new 52 WW.

[Deathstroke]

Originally Posted by terry78

Trevor is basically her Lois Lane in a sense. Neither of them are really damsels per se, but because they like to go looking for trouble they gotta be saved all the time.

Lois is a damsel in distress.

Steve Trevor is a war hero.

[flickchick85]

I'm loving Azzarello's run. At first the origin ret-con bugged me, but once I went with it, it became my favorite (or maybe tied with Morrison's Action Comics) of the New 52. But then, the Greek mythology aspect is the main reason WW holds so much appeal for me in the first place, so that run was pretty much made for my tastes. That said, I don't think a screen adaptation should ignore all that came before Azzarello's run, either. I'm far from a WW expert, but it seems like almost every era of the character has aspects worth drawing from.

[Zeerola]

Originally Posted by Deathstroke

Lois is a damsel in distress.

Steve Trevor is a war hero.

War hero in distress thought

[Rodrigo90]

America's finest

[J'adore]

Originally Posted by DrCosmic

Doesn't sound awful to me. Sounds a lot more empowered than Deja Thoris, that's for sure. It's a nice way to give her an arc without making the character look bad at all.

Well, I disagree. It basically just made her look like some dumb naive amazon woman who is taken pity upon by Steve Trevor - who then 'teaches her the ways of mankind'. Uh...Sure. As much as I admire some of Joss' work, that idea sounds crappy.

[J'adore]

Also I still like the idea of Nicholas Winding Refn directing it. He says he will only do it if Christina Hendricks is Wonder Woman (which is such a WRONG choice), but we'll see.

[flickchick85]

Originally Posted by J'adore

Well, I disagree. It basically just made her look like some dumb naive amazon woman who is taken pity upon by Steve Trevor - who then 'teaches her the ways of mankind'. Uh...Sure. As much as I admire some of Joss' work, that idea sounds crappy.

I dunno, I read that description completely differently. It sounded like he could have just as easily been describing the '09 animated movie (minus the "traveling the world" part) to me. Or a Thor-esque Wonder Woman tale. Doesn't sound so bad to me.

[J'adore]

Originally Posted by flickchick85

Yeah...I read that description completely differently. It sounded like he could have just as easily been describing the '09 animated movie (minus the "traveling the world" part) to me. Or a Thor-esque Wonder Woman tale. Doesn't sound so bad to me.

Well at first I was kinda on board with it but the Steve Trevor part bugged me. And the 'naive' part...Diana is far from naive. She's smart and capable. She will be fine working out the ways of human life by herself. No one ever says that Lois is there to guide the naive Superman. It just kinda irks me.

[flickchick85]

Originally Posted by J'adore

Well at first I was kinda on board with it but the Steve Trevor part bugged me. And the 'naive' part...Diana is far from naive. She's smart and capable. She will be fine working out the ways of human life by herself. No one ever says that Lois is there to guide the naive Superman. It just kinda irks me.

It sounds to me like she works out the ways of humanity on her own and makes a judgement about them (which is easy to do since humans tend to suck), and Steve just shows her another point of view. And I'm sure the "naive" part just comes from the fact that she's new to man's world. Lois doesn't have to show Supes anything because he was raised here.

[J'adore]

Originally Posted by flickchick85

It sounds to me like she works out the ways of humanity on her own and makes a judgement about them (which is easy to do since humans tend to suck), and Steve just shows her another point of view. And I'm sure the "naive" part just comes from the fact that she's new to man's world. Lois doesn't have to show Supes anything because he was raised here.

Yes but the Amazons are just one step higher from humans. That's what I don't get. They aren't aliens, or gods. They are an army of 'previously human' women re-born in to quasi demi-god warriors. Diana's path to graduating the island was learning how to live in human society. I didn't like Joss' direction. I'm sure he could come up with something better.

[jaymes_e06]

Originally Posted by flickchick85

I dunno, I read that description completely differently. It sounded like he could have just as easily been describing the '09 animated movie (minus the "traveling the world" part) to me. Or a Thor-esque Wonder Woman tale. Doesn't sound so bad to me.

I agree. And i think the animated film did a good job of adapting the cm but yeah

[flickchick85]

Originally Posted by J'adore

Yes but the Amazons are just one step higher from humans. That's what I don't get. They aren't aliens, or gods. They are an army of 'previously human' women re-born in to quasi demi-god warriors. Diana's path to graduating the island was learning how to live in human society. I didn't like Joss' direction. I'm sure he could come up with something better.

I feel like being taught the ways of Man by Amazons and actually experiencing it would be two very different things. She's from a completely different society that does now see itself as being "above" the world of mankind (for centuries at this point), so the culture shock of that should be a HUGE part of her origin story, imo. But you didn't like it, fair enough.

As I said, it reminds me of the '09 animated movie (with added world-traveling) and I've mentioned before in this thread that I think that movie could make for a great starting-point for a big-screen WW adaptation, so it sounded fine by me.

[jaymes_e06]

We must be on the same wavelength because i agree with everything youve been saying today fc

[flickchick85]

Originally Posted by jaymes_e06

We must be on the same wavelength because i agree with everything youve been saying today fc

I knew I liked you.

[NigelHalsey]

Originally Posted by Rodrigo90

Cauron or Bird would be great.

But what with his direction for Harry Potter, I'd prefer Cauron myself.

What about the other Potter alumn David Yates?