In hindsight what changes would you do

[JackWhite]

Would you guys have preferred for Bruce's initial return scene to be as Batman, during the scene where he saves Gordon on the ice rather than him returning to Gotham during his meeting with Selina?

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

Originally Posted by JackWhite

Would you guys have preferred for Bruce's initial return scene to be as Batman, during the scene where he saves Gordon on the ice rather than him returning to Gotham during his meeting with Selina?

Selina is out in her gear for whatever reason; maybe trying to get Jen out of some trouble. She's in over her head; Batman appears and helps Selina get to Jen, only its too late for the girl.

[KillerKali]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

It can EASILY be explained that Bruce Wayne died the day before Batman(and the cops) vs Bane(and the LoS/mercenaries) happened since no one knows what happened to Bruce after some mercenaries and Selina brought Wayne and Fox "to Bane" except Lucius.

I never thought of it that way but if there is no record of Bruce's body being found then it seems really suspicious he just happened to die right after batman "Dies"

[KillerKali]

Originally Posted by FeedOnATreeFrog

The same reason why nobody links the return of Bruce Wayne (in Batman Begins) with the first appearance of the Batman -- it's a staple of the character that won't go away, no matter how ridiculous it is.

Same thing with Clark Kent's glasses.

Yeah but in theory, Wayne returns several months before Batman ever shoes up

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by JackWhite

Would you guys have preferred for Bruce's initial return scene to be as Batman, during the scene where he saves Gordon on the ice rather than him returning to Gotham during his meeting with Selina?

I was perfectly fine that Bruce came to Selina first, as it also adds to the point of Bruce trying to get to Fox first as well, although...

Originally Posted by Mr. Wooden Alligator

Selina is out in her gear for whatever reason; maybe trying to get Jen out of some trouble. She's in over her head; Batman appears and helps Selina get to Jen, only its too late for the girl.

...since I always wanted some resolution and closure to the character of Jen, I would not have mind this, but only after Bruce meets up with Fox; it would sorta parallel Batman taking care of his own situation early in TDKR then meeting with Selina to help her as he could've helped her after he saved Gordon and Blake.

Originally Posted by KillerKali

I never thought of it that way but if there is no record of Bruce's body being found then it seems really suspicious he just happened to die right after batman "Dies"

In theory, you could have a point of it being suspicious, but that would be over-thinking a tale that's always with CB characters in that no one suspects the person is the hero.

[starwolf_oakley]

I think TDKR needed more female characters in general and more focus on "family" in particular. Also, a few more references to "Bat Mythos" couldn't hurt.

1. Replace Foley with Sarah Essen. She and Gordon have belligerent tension throughout the movie, she pulls him into her apartment to avoid a patrol, and at the end of the movie she shows Gordon a positive pregnancy test on the roof of Gotham Police HQ.

2. John Blake replaced by Ellen Yin, an Asian-American female police officer. She claims to recognize Batman is Bruce Wayne based on body language. At the end of the movie, we find out her legal name is "Cassandra."

3. Carmine Falcone, now sane (or saner) since BB appears in Blackgate Prison protecting Selena before the breakout. We're not sure why until Selena calls Carmine "Daddy," and not sarcastically. This is a callback to DARK VICTORY and WHEN IN ROME.

4. Lucius Fox has two female assistants, Francine Langstrom (sonar expert) and Nora Fries (freezing technology). They get Bruce back into Gotham and prevent the ice from breaking when Batman rescues Gordon. Lucius trusts them since he introduced them to their husbands, Kirk and Victor.

5. More bomb info, so we understand Gotham isn't rendered radioactive when it goes off.

6. Talia is killed by a sniper who gets away... and is revealed to be Jen, who is working for an unseen "Uncle Oswald." Not really a sequel hook, just that Gotham will be Gotham.

7. Barsaad lives! He is seen clean-shaven in a three piece suit, talking to "Mr. Cobblepott" over the phone. Again, not really a sequel hook. It shows how some people can even get the League of Assassins to do their bidding.

[Anno_Domini]

Man...I really wish Coleman Reese was in TDKR.

[the last son]

Would have loved to see Bane break coleman for the identity of Batman

[Anno_Domini]

I'd rather see just Bane snap Reese's neck myself.

[the last son]

That's what I meant. Should not have used the word break. Now seeing where the story went I would have rather seen two face be the main villain in the movie..maybe with another side villain. Two face and catwoman would have worked better than bane and this movies talia version.

[Anno_Domini]

I'm fine with the villain choices and Two-Face was perfect in TDK, but I would have just added Reese as an ally for Bruce, but not trying to have him move on like Alfred was pushing him to do and getting him "back in the game" as Lucius was doing, but just someone there that tried to help him on the business side since Wayne Enterprises was losing money and Reese becomes defiant to Bane so Bane uses Reese as an example and snaps his neck. That, I would do differently than you as I wouldn't want it to be Bane trying to find out Batman's identity through Coleman Reese. Bane wanting to turn on the nuclear reactor and before Fredericks stands up to help, Reese tries to do the heroic thing since he was so cowardly in TDK and his "reward" is a snapped neck from Bane.

[the last son]

In hindsight I still would have used venom. I would have never had Talia stab Batman. Maybe reveal her as Talia some other way. Like hold Catwoman hostage or something. Keep everything else the same Batman beating up Bane and Talia goes over to Bane and fix his mask and then turns up his venom. We get an epic scene of Bane becoming juiced up Bane and then we get another epic fight between those two for about 5 minutes. Batman beats him somehow and catwoman escapes from Talia and then batman stops her and gets rid of the bomb. But venom should have been used

[BatLobsterRises]

I would have had no problem with Coleman Reese having a minor role in TDKR, but it'd make absolutely no sense for Bane to learn Bruce's identity from him when he has every reason to know it from being associated with the League of Shadows.

[the last son]

Yea, but I was meaning he would have never been apart of the LOS. I didn't hate it but didn't love that idea .

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by the last son

In hindsight I still would have used venom. I would have never had Talia stab Batman. Maybe reveal her as Talia some other way. Like hold Catwoman hostage or something. Keep everything else the same Batman beating up Bane and Talia goes over to Bane and fix his mask and then turns up his venom. We get an epic scene of Bane becoming juiced up Bane and then we get another epic fight between those two for about 5 minutes. Batman beats him somehow and catwoman escapes from Talia and then batman stops her and gets rid of the bomb. But venom should have been used

Venom seems a bit too cartoony, even after seeing Dent being able to stay alive for half a day after half his face was burnt off or Bruce being able to walk after a couple of months after a vertebrae mishap. Venom itself is a point where you get too comic-booky when you'e dealing with some kind of liquid that enhances your physique/size/etc. I really loved the idea of the medicine that pushed his pain at bay, but I hope there was just more explanation on that, but for the most part, we are told enough.

And Talia stabbing Bruce, more than anything, is just a parallel to how Talia was stabbing someone with a knife inside the Pit who took her mother and then she ended up stabbing the man who killed her father with a knife as well.

Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises

I would have had no problem with Coleman Reese having a minor role in TDKR, but it'd make absolutely no sense for Bane to learn Bruce's identity from him when he has every reason to know it from being associated with the League of Shadows.

Agreed.

And with using Coleman Reese, it would have made the character come out to be someone that wasn't just a coward in TDK but someone that Bruce could rely on without someone knowing the secret just disappear and not show up in the third film.

[Llama_Shepherd]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

Venom seems a bit too cartoony, even after seeing Dent being able to stay alive for half a day after half his face was burnt off or Bruce being able to walk after a couple of months after a vertebrae mishap. Venom itself is a point where you get too comic-booky when you'e dealing with some kind of liquid that enhances your physique/size/etc. I really loved the idea of the medicine that pushed his pain at bay, but I hope there was just more explanation on that, but for the most part, we are told enough.

And Talia stabbing Bruce, more than anything, is just a parallel to how Talia was stabbing someone with a knife inside the Pit who took her mother and then she ended up stabbing the man who killed her father with a knife as well.

Venom never originally did anything to the users size except for covers. Plus it was basically used anyway, as a drug that keeps his pain at bay, making him nigh invulnerable, perhaps even benefit his strength. It just wasn't named.

[Anno_Domini]

After watching TDKR earlier(I tried to continue my CBM break, but I'm sick, so I needed to watch something uplifting), I really would only change these about TDKR(much shorter than my previous list):

- I would have a scene after Batman's return where the mayor is calming down the people of Gotham during a press conference where he promises the people that the GCPD will take down the murderous Batman, and while not showing the actual press conference, I think it would simply fit in with Gordon and Foley watching it on TV right before Blake comes in talking about finding Daggett's body in a dumpster. And it could be quick enough that it would still fit in the 165 minutes IMAX running time(since the film from beginning to very end, including credits, still had 33 seconds to spare).

- I would still bring back Coleman Reese, and an idea would be him being shown during the first Wayne Enterprises board meeting, and then he's shown again while Bane takes the board hostage and tries to be heroic but his reward is only a snapped neck and again, could fit within the 165 mins. run time.

And thinking about the trilogy overall, I now only think these two should be changed for BB/TDK:

- Have a different actress playing Rachel Dawes for both films. Imagine Kate Beckinsale in that role

- I would give Crane a different send-off in BB. A taser to the face...a taser being held by Katie Holmes...tragic.

[Polaris23]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

- Have a different actress playing Rachel Dawes for both films. Imagine Kate Beckinsale in that role

I adore Kate Beckinsale, but she's too sexy to play Rachel. However, I feel Nolan should've cast (for TDK) someone with the same look as Katie, because I don't believe Bale could love Maggie, she's weird looking and Katie just has the good girl next door type look. I don't believe Maggie that much in the role, even though I do believe her to be the better actress.

[Anno_Domini]

Too sexy to play Rachel? Rachel SHOULD be sexy for someone that Bruce Wayne would go after.

[BatLobsterRises]

I think Rachel having girl next door looks is sort of part of the character. Bruce Wayne is someone who can pretty much have his pick of any of the hottest supermodels in the world, but he longs for his childhood sweetheart probably because of the innocence and purity she represents to him (a time before his parents' murder). Maggie definitely didn't have the right look for that though.

I would have personally enjoyed Rachel McAdams in the role. And yeah, Kate Beckinsale is...yum. She's more Selina Kyle material IMO.

[Anno_Domini]

Rachel Dawes is meant to have the girl next door looks but in the end Bruce leaves with a smokin' hot Selina Kyle?

What's the point of the girl next door? Lol.

[Polaris23]

Because that's what he first fell for and what he believed he wanted all along. He never realized he could ever move on and possibly find someone that could suit his crazy lifestyle.

[Anno_Domini]

But then that makes me ask now...what crazy lifestyle that ended with Bruce and Selina moving on with new lives?

[Polaris23]

What? He changed.

[Anno_Domini]

But to say Bruce found someone to fit his lifestyle...and he changed as soon as he came out of the Pit, it doesn't really make sense that Bruce still went with Selina even when he changed. Are we saying Selina changed as well and that's what Bruce saw in her and that's why they are both seen together at the end?