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Old 01-31-2013, 01:47 PM   #951
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

It takes a special person to stick to their guns... but geez, that just does not look good on that suit.

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Old 01-31-2013, 01:56 PM   #952
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

i disagree!

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:01 PM   #953
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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I don’t think it ever did. Not many complaints that mens’ business suits lack a splash of red contrast at the pelvis to “break up” the monochrome.

As you say, it’s what people are used to. And if they don’t like the change, fair enough. But a design/fashion principle isn’t being violated.
You can't compare Superman's suit to a business suit.

On the flip-side, if people didn't have such a hang-up about Superman wearing (what look like) trunks on the outside of his costume, maybe they would appreciate the more even distribution of red across the suit as opposed to having a big blue gap.

Considering the suit started out that way, and people didn't seem to mind it for 50 years, maybe that should lend that argument at least a little bit of weight.

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Batman is Batman because of his bat motif's. Take them away and he's just Manman.
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Old 01-31-2013, 02:06 PM   #954
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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personally, i still prefer a design that includes the trunks...

the trunks look absolutely ridiculous on this suit...and I'm pro-trunks

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:11 PM   #955
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

That's because you cant really have both like it is. Or the trunks need to be more discrete. Smaller somehow.

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:19 PM   #956
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

Trunks have never worked with a Superman suit of alien origin imo.

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:20 PM   #957
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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That's because you cant really have both like it is. Or the trunks need to be more discrete. Smaller somehow.
smaller as in...non-existent? ok!

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:21 PM   #958
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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Considering the suit started out that way, and people didn't seem to mind it for 50 years, maybe that should lend that argument at least a little bit of weight.
People didn't mind taking their dumps in the woods either, until Teddy Roosevelt invented indoor plumbing. Times change.

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:25 PM   #959
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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People didn't mind taking their dumps in the woods either, until Teddy Roosevelt invented indoor plumbing. Times change.

I don't wanna poo in the woods...

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:45 PM   #960
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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People didn't mind taking their dumps in the woods either, until Teddy Roosevelt invented indoor plumbing. Times change.
You can't compare Superman's suit to taking a dump!

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:50 PM   #961
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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People didn't mind taking their dumps in the woods either, until Teddy Roosevelt invented indoor plumbing. Times change.
By that logic, it would be okay for Batman to lose his ears and cape as well. The times change argument doesn't hold up to absolutes like mythological heroes such as Superman!

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:56 PM   #962
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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You can't compare Superman's suit to taking a dump!
It begs the question: Did he now start wearing the briefs inside after getting super turd on his suit all these years?

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Old 01-31-2013, 02:57 PM   #963
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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People didn't mind taking their dumps in the woods either, until Teddy Roosevelt invented indoor plumbing. Times change.
I think you may be missing the point...

I'm talking purely about seeing passed one's own biases and only factoring in distribution of color. Yes, Circuses were popular back in the day. So I'm speculating that S&S only chose red circus strong man trunks as a way of spreading the color more evenly over the suit. Forget for a second that trunks on the outside look silly and stupid today. If you judge the costume in terms of simple blocks of color, then just maybe a dash of red in the middle is more pleasing to the eye then a disproportion amount of blue between two areas of red.

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:01 PM   #964
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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The times change argument doesn't hold up to absolutes like mythological heroes such as Superman!
Apparently someone thinks it does, or they wouldn't have removed them for fear of it being ridiculed. Meanwhile I don't see anyone making jokes about Batman's cape.

All I'm saying is 'because that's the way they did it 50 years ago' isn't a very good excuse to not try and improve on something.

Whether it's an improvement or not is up for every individual to decide. Personally I think they made the right call. Don't agree? Sorry, it happens.

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:07 PM   #965
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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Originally Posted by StarvingArtist View Post
Trunks have never worked with a Superman suit of alien origin imo.
Very True! If you really think about it, the monochromatic jumpsuit/unitard has become synonymous with the depiction of futuristic or alien fashions in pop culture over the past few decades:







The trunks, as much as I love them, detract from the minimalistic sleekness and utilitarianism that we have come to associate with futuristic styling. They are more suggestive of circus strongmen and old school athletic apparel. Thus, in terms of conveying a sense of alienness and technological advancement through a Kryptonian supersuit, it makes more sense to ditch the trunks.


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Old 01-31-2013, 03:07 PM   #966
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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Apparently someone thinks it does, or they wouldn't have removed them for fear of it being ridiculed. Meanwhile I don't see anyone making jokes about Batman's cape.

All I'm saying is 'because that's the way they did it 50 years ago' isn't a very good excuse to not try and improve on something.

Whether it's an improvement or not is up for every individual to decide. Personally I think they made the right call. Don't agree? Sorry, it happens.
I think ridiculing and laughing about the trunks alone is not seeing the character or being concerned with Superman. I don't see it as an improvement, but rather as a style change.

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:07 PM   #967
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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You can't compare Superman's suit to a business suit.
But it’s sometimes alleged that the need to “break up” a solid block of color is some sort of universal design principle. So alluding to accepted fashion examples where this principle isn’t applied would seem to be valid.

Quote:
On the flip-side, if people didn't have such a hang-up about Superman wearing (what look like) trunks on the outside of his costume, maybe they would appreciate the more even distribution of red across the suit as opposed to having a big blue gap.

Considering the suit started out that way, and people didn't seem to mind it for 50 years, maybe that should lend that argument at least a little bit of weight.
Oh, it does. In my estimation, tradition is the best (and likely only) argument for retaining the trunks.

But the flip side of that is that what worked for the first 50 years may not have been working for the last 25. Times change, tastes change; and the trunks (through no fault of their own ) seem to have accumulated some negative associations.

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:23 PM   #968
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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But it’s sometimes alleged that the need to “break up” a solid block of color is some sort of universal design principle. So alluding to accepted fashion examples where this principle isn’t applied would seem to be valid.
I wouldn't say it's a universal design principle exactly. But I think it's a heck of a reach to compare two wholly different designs as evidence that what works for one will work for another.

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Oh, it does. In my estimation, tradition is the best (and likely only) argument for retaining the trunks.

But the flip side of that is that what worked for the first 50 years may not have been working for the last 25. Times change, tastes change; and the trunks (through no fault of their own ) seem to have accumulated some negative associations.
I agree. But I will post this again because it more succinctly summarizes my argument:

I'm talking purely about seeing passed one's own biases and only factoring in distribution of color. Yes, Circuses were popular back in the day. So I'm speculating that S&S only chose red circus strong man trunks as a way of spreading the color more evenly over the suit. Forget for a second that trunks on the outside look silly and stupid today. If you judge the costume in terms of simple blocks of color, then just maybe a dash of red in the middle is more pleasing to the eye then a disproportion amount of blue between two areas of red.

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Originally Posted by DKDetective View Post
Very True! If you really think about it, the monochromatic jumpsuit/unitard has become synonymous with the depiction of futuristic or alien fashions in pop culture over the past few decades:

The trunks, as much as I love them, detract from the minimalistic sleekness and utilitarianism that we have come to associate with futuristic styling. They are more suggestive of circus strongmen and old school athletic apparel. Thus, in terms of conveying a sense of alienness and technological advancement through a Kryptonian supersuit, it makes more sense to ditch the trunks.
I couldn't agree more.

But then again you're still left with a giant cape... a red S... and red boots.

The suit still strains credibility as a utilitarian alien garment to me. Ergo, I've always though the all out alien origin is stupid.

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:27 PM   #969
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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By that logic, it would be okay for Batman to lose his ears and cape as well. The times change argument doesn't hold up to absolutes like mythological heroes such as Superman!
no, because then Batman would cease to look like Batman...trunks don't make Superman look like Superman

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:33 PM   #970
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no, because then Batman would cease to look like Batman...trunks don't make Superman look like Superman
Yup, it was a silly comparison. Superman's suit is "Superman" because it is red, blue and yellow, with a big red \S/ blue suit and red cape.

Batman is Batman because of his bat motif's. Take them away and he's just Manman.

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:38 PM   #971
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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Batman is Batman because of his bat motif's. Take them away and he's just Manman.
HAHAHA, hello new signature

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:42 PM   #972
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Old 01-31-2013, 03:47 PM   #973
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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Yup, it was a silly comparison. Superman's suit is "Superman" because it is red, blue and yellow, with a big red \S/ blue suit and red cape.

Batman is Batman because of his bat motif's. Take them away and he's just Manman.
I agree 100%

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:49 PM   #974
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

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I wouldn't say it's a universal design principle exactly. But I think it's a heck of a reach to compare two wholly different designs as evidence that what works for one will work for another.
True. But if the “trunks are needed to break up the color” argument is complicated and nuanced and applies mostly to Superman (and not so much to, say, Flash or Captain Marvel) then this complexity and nuance should be acknowledged. The more general/categorical claim is what invites the counter examples (from trouble makers like me ).

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Old 01-31-2013, 03:56 PM   #975
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Default Re: It's a Bird, It's a Plane, It's the Superman Costume Thread! - Part 1

Flash don't need no stinkin trunks

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