All Things Superman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 27

[fanboiii]

Originally Posted by The Batman

In part cause they're the only two guys who dont bring up STM/SR every waking moment just to bash it.

How dare you lump STM with SR!

[ThePhantasm]

Originally Posted by The Batman

The last few pages remind me that showtime and jamie are the most logical guys on this board.

In part cause they're the only two guys who dont bring up STM/SR every waking moment just to bash it.

To this I have only a few things to say:

1. MOS is a new Superman movie. It will be obviously compared to what has come before, just like any reboot ever has. And its valid to make such comparisons.

2. I was pretty heavily involved in this discussion. And I love Superman Returns. I think I've praised the film on SHH more often than I've critiqued it. So just casting me as some hater who enjoys bashing the film at every opportunity is a quick way of straw manning one side without paying attention to any nuances in the discussion.

3. Showtime's most recent comment doesn't really reflect the course of the conversation at all. We weren't comparing MOS as a whole with SR as a whole. That's an over simplification of the comparison that was made.

[The Batman]

Originally Posted by fanboiii

How dare you lump STM with SR!

Why not? Everyone else does.

Originally Posted by ThePhantasm

To this I have only a few things to say:

1. MOS is a new Superman movie. It will be obviously compared to what has come before, just like any reboot ever has. And its valid to make such comparisons.

2. I was pretty heavily involved in this discussion. And I love Superman Returns. I think I've praised the film on SHH more often than I've critiqued it. So just casting me as some hater who enjoys bashing the film at every opportunity is a quick way of straw manning one side without paying attention to any nuances in the discussion.

3. Showtime's most recent comment doesn't really reflect the course of the conversation at all. We weren't comparing MOS as a whole with SR as a whole. That's an over simplification of the comparison that was made.

Sorry man, I'm not gonna pull out a magnifying glass to inspect the minutia of the 7 billionth time you guys have decided to bring up Superman Returns. Honestly, there may be some merit to what you're saying, but bringing up SR once again is just the continuation of what I feel is beating a dead horse.

I was here during the BB days, and I'm pretty sure we Batfans didnt constantly bring up B & R the way people bring up SR. I came here hoping for something new or at least an interesting convo, and there goes SR being brought up...again.

[hopefuldreamer]

Originally Posted by The Batman

The last few pages remind me that showtime and jamie are the most logical guys on this board.

In part cause they're the only two guys who dont bring up STM/SR every waking moment just to bash it.

Not seeing what bashing OR praising SR or STM has to do with logic...

It would be illogical to refrain from ever bringing them up. All interpretations get compared. STM, SR and MOS will be compared, just like Golden Age, Silver age and Post Crisis interpretations always are. And when you favour one over the other, it's not wrong to express that.

Yes, MOS is not out yet. But all people are discussing is their hopes, their feelings SO FAR, and the reasons why they have those feelings...

... and the majority of us are doing it in a completely logical way

[ThePhantasm]

Originally Posted by The Batman

Sorry man, I'm not gonna pull out a magnifying glass to inspect the minutia of the 7 billionth time you guys have decided to bring up Superman Returns. Honestly, there may be some merit to what you're saying, but bringing up SR once again is just the continuation of what I feel is beating a dead horse.

"You guys?" I can't remember the last time before this that I ever compared these two films. Thanks for lumping me in with whoever you have problems with though.

I'm tired of anytime I make any critique or comparison of any kind on these boards someone jumps all over me. Sheesh.

And if you aren't going to "inspect" the conversation before making sweeping statements about everyone involved, maybe you should just... I dunno... not comment on the conversation at all? Your critiques of the convo had little to do with its actual content and you justify that with "well its just the same conversation it always is so I don't have to read it closely."

[ConnorKon-El]

Originally Posted by ThePhantasm

"You guys?" I can't remember the last time before this that I ever compared these two films. Thanks for lumping me in with whoever you have problems with though.

I'm tired of anytime I make any critique or comparison of any kind on these boards someone jumps all over me. Sheesh.

And if you aren't going to "inspect" the conversation before making sweeping statements about everyone involved, maybe you should just... I dunno... not comment on the conversation at all? Your critiques of the convo had little to do with its actual content and you justify that with "well its just the same conversation it always is so I don't have to read it closely."

Welcome to any fan forum on the internet

[STARMAN]

I think there is alot of bitterness toward Superman Returns because some people waited 19 years for it. I didn't. I wasn't born yet. But there was a lot of built-up excitement which led to a huge disapointment to most.

I, myself, don't like Superman Returns but I have no problem with people that do.

[Mysteryman]

Originally Posted by hopefuldreamer

There are plenty of things we know of in MOS that we've never seen in a Superman film before:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

- Robot army
- Big spaceships in the sky (including the Phantom Zone being replaced by a spaceship called the 'Black Zone')
- Tornado
- Clark with a beard
- Clark having a human life in an alaskan fishing village
- Jor-el and Zod fight scene
- Suit without trunks
- The military fighting against Superman
- Black Perry White
- Young Clark first being told he is an alien
- Dr Hamilton
- The FOS as a spaceship rather than an ice castle that rises from a crystal
- ... and i'd say it's a pretty safe bet that JK doesn't die of just a natural random heart attack. It's bound to go down in a much bigger way.

No one is saying there are going to be absolutely no similarities whatsoever. But there are certainly a number of very different elements in play in this film than any previous film representation... and those are the things that make this a lot more exciting than SR for me.

Not everything on that list is guaranteed to be in the film.

[Mysteryman]

Originally Posted by STARMAN

I think there is alot of bitterness toward Superman Returns because some people waited 19 years for it. I didn't. I wasn't born yet. But there was a lot of built-up excitement which led to a huge disapointment to most.

I, myself, don't like Superman Returns but I have no problem with people that do.

Agreed.

[ThePhantasm]

So I was rewatching the MOS trailer just now, and I'm wondering... who all will know about Clark's powers? We hear in a voiceover someone telling the Kent's "my son was in the bus... he saw what Clark did." I wonder what effect that will have on the story? Will these people simply be silent out of gratitude for Clark rescuing them?

[hopefuldreamer]

Originally Posted by Mysteryman

Not everything on that list is guaranteed to be in the film.

Which parts?

[Dragon_316ca]

https://twitter.com/Poni_Boy/status/303644476516208641

Hearing a good variety of reactions to Man of Steel. Lots of praise for Micheal Shannon & Russell Crowe. Action is plentiful.

On Cavill:

Seems many found Cavill's performance lacking. CG was a bit overused but no complaints about the slow motion. And no Justice League tie-in.

Varying opinions. One said he was fine but "easily replaceable" another that he was painful to watch. Others said he did ok.

[Mysteryman]

Originally Posted by hopefuldreamer

Which parts?

I dont know,
but it is an unreleased film.
Nobody here has seen a Final Cut .

[The Batman]

Originally Posted by ThePhantasm

Thanks for lumping me in with whoever you have problems with though.

You're quite welcome, buddy.

[AntMan]

Ouch. Those comments on Cavill don't exactly fill me with confidence.

[Tacit Ronin]

Originally Posted by Dragon_316ca

https://twitter.com/Poni_Boy/status/303644476516208641
On Cavill:

Yikes, I do not want him to be another Bale, where the films are praised but the central performance is not.

[LibidoLoca]

Sounds like Cavill is going to give the decent to bad for some performance some of us expected.

[hopefuldreamer]

Originally Posted by Mysteryman

I dont know,
but it is an unreleased film.
Nobody here has seen a Final Cut .

No... but we've had information confirming everything on that list. Interviews, footage, pictures etc...

[Torrente]

Since I was the one with the whole "romance" comment I do want to say I meant more in regards to

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

the kiss between supes and Lois in the comic con trailer, looks VERY passionate

[STARMAN]

Who is this Pietro guy?

He says it seems many found Cavill's performance lacking.

[ConnorKon-El]

Originally Posted by Dragon_316ca

https://twitter.com/Poni_Boy/status/303644476516208641
On Cavill:

NO NO NO

[The Batman]

Originally Posted by Excelsior.

Yikes, I do not want him to be another Bale, where the films are praised but the central performance is not.

At least in Bale's case, he was getting props for Batman Begins.

If this is to be believed, Both daddy and the villain are gonna steal the show.

This is an example of how SR overbashing on every level is silly before watching MOS. For all we know, Cavill could be on the same level as Routh, just in a (hopefully) more successful film.

[hopefuldreamer]

[LibidoLoca]

As long as the film's successful.

[ConnorKon-El]

‏@ConnorFilm @Poni_Boy Alright, and i read the cavill comments. Overall as a film, did most people in the screening enjoy it ?
‏
@Poni_Boy @ConnorFilm From what I gather yes very much

Alright. That's good to know.