The Captain America/Chris Evans Thread - Part 2

[JustSomeGuy]

Cap's stance on Banner is comparable to SHIELD, and everyone else. He thinks Banner is of use, and a good man, but is weary of him turning into the Hulk.

I never said Cap was the only one who does this. Everyone does. Like I said, it's meant to contrast personalities. Loki is the only one who makes fun of Banner because Loki is an actual jerk and everyone else isn't.

Absolutely and utterly false.

Tony definitely wanted the cube:

Cap: He's a friendly?
Doesn't matter, if he frees Loki or kills him the tesseract is lost.

And then when he is fighting Thor, who is going to take the tesseract away, Tony: He gives up the cube he's all yours; until then, stay out of the way.

And then when they do locate the cube right before everything hits the fan, he's the one who's eager to go get it. Stark wants it, Thor says it belongs on Asgard, Cap tells him not to go alone, and then Stark threatens him.

3 different times it is referenced that Stark wants the cube. He doesn't want to see it go back to Asgard.

Actually, no. Cap falls for it as much anyone, inspite of him thinking Loki is winding them up, he falls for it. He discovers the HYDRA weapons, learing that SHIELD is making WMDs, leading to schism among the Avengers and SHIELD. Which is what Loki wanted.

I will give you this. But it doesn't change the fact that Cap was on the money from the beginning.

Except that says more about Tony's growth as a person than it does about Steve.

The legend of Cap is that of a soldier. He didn't really live up to the legend until he was on the ground, directing the battle, AFTER Tony gave that little speech.

But my point is that this change in Tony had to come from something. He doesn't change for no reason. He changes because Cap was right, Tony f-ed up and Coulson died. Not only that, but like I said, he was the one jumping all around helping him fix the engine, and fought off multiple baddies.

And loosing.

I don't expect Cap to win, but he went in, expecting to be able to take Loki down, but got thrashed instead. You actually see him panicing the moment his first blow fails to have an effect. It didn't feel as brave is felt like Cap didn't really know what he was getting into.

It doesn't change the fact the he confronted him. The outcome doesn't matter. In fact I think you could argue it is more brave to confront someone you don't know anything about, rather than wait and learn about them. Stupid, maybe, but brave. But it didn't matter, because they didn't have time to do that. SHIELD needed someone to go take Loki in. Cap stepped up.

Cap wasn't the only one saying the cube doesn't belong on Earth. Thor said the same, and unlike Steve, he emphasized it. Steve mentions it once, and drops it.

There was no need to emphasize it. They didn't even have the cube. He already stated his position. If they had retrieved the cube, maybe he would have harped on it some more. But they had to find it before they could decide what to do with it.


Maybe I am reaching. But I was mighty impressed by the way Whedon wrote Cap into the movie. I would have liked more, but I am guessing he do something even more brilliant in the sequel.

[JustSomeGuy]

Originally Posted by mc7791

Also the part about Banner- can you please explain the AIDS victim parallel? I think I know what you are expressing just need a little clarification.

I mean...whenever there is an element in a story where a character has some sort of infliction, some condition which may endanger those who come into contact with him, it is done in way which parallels AIDS victims. Primarily, it is to compare how other characters treat them, because how people treat AIDS victims is very divisive. Should they be allowed to be apart of society? Does the infliction define who they are, or does the person define who they are? Lol, the only other example that comes to mind is how JK Rowling used werewolves in Harry Potter. It's a class thing. Is this person still of equal value in society? Are they of a lower class now? Should we treat them as such, or should we be compassionate to their plight?

This is definitely intentional on Whedon's part, not only because he is uber-progressive, but also to show the viewer that Loki actually is a huge jerk. Cap, Fury, Widow, Stark, Thor, they all treat Banner as the man he is. Loki laughs at his condition and totally dismisses him.

It's just one of the many things I love about this movie.

[mc7791]

Originally Posted by JustSomeGuy

I mean...whenever there is an element in a story where a character has some sort of infliction, some condition which may endanger those who come into contact with him, it is done in way which parallels AIDS victims. Primarily, it is to compare how other characters treat them, because how people treat AIDS victims is very divisive. Should they be allowed to be apart of society? Does the infliction define who they are, or does the person define who they are? Lol, the only other example that comes to mind is how JK Rowling used werewolves in Harry Potter. It's a class thing. Is this person still of equal value in society? Are they of a lower class now? Should we treat them as such, or should we be compassionate to their plight?

This is definitely intentional on Whedon's part, not only because he is uber-progressive, but also to show the viewer that Loki actually is a huge jerk. Cap, Fury, Widow, Stark, Thor, they all treat Banner as the man he is. Loki laughs at his condition and totally dismisses him.

It's just one of the many things I love about this movie.

I thought that is what you meant. Thank you for the clarification. Yeah I really like that part of Cap where he lets someone actions now define the person. Whedon is amazing.

[Bruce_Begins]

I wonder how the Marvel (and Captain America fans would have reacted) for this hypothetical scenario -

Consider that Avengers movie begins with flashback showing SHIELD agents discovering Captain America's body frozen under ice, he is still alive but his pulse is very slow, they try to revive him and succeed, Captain America is awakened into 21 st century America, he wants to know more about what happened in the WW2, he asks about Bucky's family, he gets the information that Bucky's Grandson is living in NY, and that he has joined the armed forces.

Captain America (Steve Rogers) is a man who finds himself old fashioned, the world has changed, he feels alienated, he thinks - "this is not my time".

Captain America gives his blood sample to SHIELD agents, who hope that their team of scientists and researchers will somehow find the Super Solider serum again by the process or reverse engineering.

Captain meets Bucky's grandson who is named as James Buchanan Jr is delighted to see his idol and hero, Cap. is also impressed by him he learns that he has served the Army in many places throughout the world.

Steve Rogers meets Nick Fury and expresses that he is not interested to be Captain America again as the war has ended and he too wants to live in peace and he wants to retire, but that he will continue to work for the SHIELD till a suitable replacement is found.

Nick Fury tells Steve Rogers the good news that they have been successful in the efforts to re-engineer the Super Solider Serum, but there is problem, that it is need to be given to anyone willing within 20 minutes of its manufacture and that it could be successful or it may kill the recipient.

James Buchanan Jr (Bucky's grandson) volunteers himself, and Steve Rogers is not happy about it but then he too agrees. The super solider serum is injected successfully.

Steve Rogers decides to trains him, after completing his training, James Buchanan Jr becomes the new Captain America.

Soon Nick Fury declares forming a new team of Superheroes and the new Captain America is included in the team.

Steve Rogers spends his vacation in a cafe in Italy watching the new Avengers announcement.

I wrote this hypothetical scenario because I wanted to know how would Cap. America fans would have reacted if Marvel had gone this route.

Since many fans know that there is still a chance that new Batman in a Justice League movie may be portrayed by John Blake (Joseph Gordon Levitt ).

[The Caped Knight]

Deleted Cap scene from The Avengers

VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0G-mu3OH6M

This should've stayed in the final cut.

[herolee10]

Had most of his scenes not been cut from the film, namely the "Man out of time" and even the sequence posted above, he would have clearly had the bigger lead than he has now when it comes to having the most screen time in the entire film. I can see why, before the decision to cut some of his scenes were probably made, on why Whedon said that the film felt like it was being told from Cap's POV because we have a lot of scenes with Cap in it as opposed to the rest of the group members.

[Blake II]

Why didn't they keep the scene where he's reading reports of people he knew that were deceased and found peggy's portfolio and it said she's retired but still alive and gave a a phone number that made Cap stare at a phone for a bit? That should have made the final cut.

[Brian Braddock]

It's a neat little scene, but I think they said that the tone and pacing didnt fit with the rest of the movie.

[TheVileOne]

I hope there is a similar scene in this movie. Were very well written and quietly subtle scenes.