Anybody else miss Terrence Howard as Rhodey?

[Mr. Dent]

^ Exactly. RDJ and Howard just had a chemistry with each other that didn't show through Cheadle and RDJ in IM2. Hopefully it will be better in this film, but Howard just had a certain swagger that matched up perfectly with RDJ that Cheadle just doesn't seem apt to match.

[Mr. Stark]

I'm of the mindset that when the casting for IM1 was announced, I was really excited for Terrence Howard playing Rhodey, because to go with the great actors of RDJ, Gwyneth, and Bridges, Terrence is an incredible respected actor and deservedly so. His portrayal of Rhodey however for some reason left something to be desired in me. Maybe its because he wasnt War Machine in part 1, but then again I never expected him to be that early.

What it comes down to for me is the portrayal of the character. Terrence to me played Rhodey much more as a yes man to Tony, the best friend who wouldn't necessarily tell Tony that he was wrong. It may just be better writing for the character: which I can't believe I'm saying while referring to IM2, but Don Cheadle's Rhodey was more of what I wanted, Tony's backbone, the person that would steer him right when he wanders. In the comics Tony has often said he loves Rhodey so much because nothing he has impresses Rhodey to the point where he just kisses his ass.

And to be quite honest even before Don was cast, I could never really picture Terrence's face under the mask if you know what I mean.

[Mr. Dent]

I could see what you mean about him not necessarily looking the part with the War Machine suit on, but I wouldn't call him a yes man to Tony. He took quite a hard line with Tony when he announced that he would stop making weapons.

[Mr. Stark]

Originally Posted by Mr. Dent

I could see what you mean about him not necessarily looking the part with the War Machine suit on, but I wouldn't call him a yes man to Tony. He took quite a hard line with Tony when he announced that he would stop making weapons.

Yes but so did everyone else. Rhodey being Tony's best friend, and for the purpose of dramatic narrative, should put a different type of pressure on Tony then the other characters in the movie.

As far as the two having chemistry, I think it was harder to come across in IM2 because in IM1 the status quo of Tony and Rhodey's relationship never changed from being supportive buddies. In IM2 Rhodey was actively opposing Tony, there was never a real moment for the two to just sit back and have a laugh out loud moment, like on the airplane at the beginning of IM1.I do think they have chemistry together and the scene that proves it for me was the very end with the drone battles. The whole bells and whistle, being a badass dialogue was priceless to me. I love the suit envy that Tony and Rhodey have, and that is directly placed on Don's shoulders, he brought that to the film. I truly do expect to see their relationship grow and evolve in IM# and hopefully have some time for the laugh out loud moments that made Robert and Terrence so money together in IM1

[The Guard]

Howard looked more like Rhodey. Cheadle acts more like him. I think I prefer Cheadle overall.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by Mr. Dent

You guys really don't know a whole lot about real people in the military do you...or at least the Air Force. And he was hardly doing a Chris Tucker impersonation. Honestly some of this sounds borderline racist. Just because Howard isn't stiff doesn't mean he's trying to be the funny black guy or a "gangsta pimp". Seriously...

Well, duh, stupid lil ol' me don't know nothin' bout no real people in the military....

...except for my dad who retired from the USAF as a Staff Sergeant in '63, and who sat right there in the theater on IM's opening day with me and shook his head and said, "Who is this clown? He wouldn't have lasted one week in the Air Force."

And I'll ignore the race-baiting comment, too. Try to stick to intelligent debate instead of trying to dig for personal insults, mmkay? I'd hate to call in a mod on you, Dent, but you're seriously trying my patience with this particular post. I expect better of you.

[ctsketch]

Originally Posted by R_Hythlodeus

this exactly!
Howard should have played a highly skilled and trained jet pilot but instead gave his best Chris Tucker impression

Errr most air force officers I am friends with know how to have fun as well as do their duty. People in the military aren't always "on"

[ctsketch]

Originally Posted by cherokeesam

Well, duh, stupid lil ol' me don't know nothin' bout no real people in the military....

...except for my dad who retired from the USAF as a Staff Sergeant in '63, and who sat right there in the theater on IM's opening day with me and shook his head and said, "Who is this clown? He wouldn't have lasted one week in the Air Force."

And I'll ignore the race-baiting comment, too. Try to stick to intelligent debate instead of trying to dig for personal insults, mmkay? I'd hate to call in a mod on you, Dent, but you're seriously trying my patience with this particular post. I expect better of you.

Pshh Staff Sergeants are sticks in the mud, I've hung out in officer's clubs/bars. They know how to have fun!

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by cherokeesam

Don Cheadle as Rhodey ACTS like an Air Force colonel. He has a strong sense of duty, of patriotism and pride, and decorum and regulation.

Terence Howard as Rhodey acts like a gangsta pimp. His ass would've been dishonorably discharged long before he could've become an officer.

So do I miss Howard? Let's see: nope.

Nail on the head. Couldnt have said it better. Cheadle may lack the chemistry howard had, but word is that they great chemistry in ironman 3, ironman 2, there was never an oppritunity for chemistry.

Cheadle is much better

[StreetWarrior]

Originally Posted by Mr. Dent

Not knocking Don Cheadle or anything, he's okay, but to me Terrence Howard WAS Rhodey. His look, the way he carried himself, his chemistry with RDJ. Everything was spot on. Like I said, Cheadle is okay, not bad and definitely not the worst choice, but I just really miss Howard and what could have been.

I agree. Don Cheadle is good but I would have preferred Terrence Howard or even another actor all together.

[CastlesInTheAir]

Originally Posted by cherokeesam

Well, duh, stupid lil ol' me don't know nothin' bout no real people in the military....

...except for my dad who retired from the USAF as a Staff Sergeant in '63, and who sat right there in the theater on IM's opening day with me and shook his head and said, "Who is this clown? He wouldn't have lasted one week in the Air Force."

And I'll ignore the race-baiting comment, too. Try to stick to intelligent debate instead of trying to dig for personal insults, mmkay? I'd hate to call in a mod on you, Dent, but you're seriously trying my patience with this particular post. I expect better of you.

I agree with Mr. Dent.
Nothing in the movie that Howard did was any more extravagant than Tony Stark. Why haven't I heard anyone call Tony Stark a "gangsta pimp with a hip hop attitude"?

It does all sound borderline racist. A black man has to be completely straight edge with the charisma of a wet rag or else he's a "gangsta pimp wannabe".
I'm not bothered with people preferring Cheadle over Howard, its just all these "He's an Eddie Murphy wannabe/Chris Tucker impersonator/gangsta pimp/hip hop/jive turkey" posts you're using as your reasoning. It makes you sound like a racist dbag. And don't threaten to tell a mod on him because he called you on your *****.

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by Mr. Dent

Uh, maybe you need to rewatch the film but Tony roped Rhodey into drinking sake with him on the plane, he didn't just say "Yeah let's get wasted". Tony is the one who came up with the fun-vee. Only women blow on men's dice. And the rest of that is just him joking around.

None of that equates to "jivin" and definitely not being a "gangsta pimp". The hell is wrong with you. Being stiff and unfunny =/= being a colonel in the USAF. Quite the opposite, many colonel's have that type of sense of humor IN ADDITION to their sense of duty. Honestly, unless you're just a hard ass most people in the military only act upright or whatever in front of their superiors.

just because his view/opinion differs from yours? nice

[Mr. Dent]

Originally Posted by cherokeesam

Well, duh, stupid lil ol' me don't know nothin' bout no real people in the military....

...except for my dad who retired from the USAF as a Staff Sergeant in '63, and who sat right there in the theater on IM's opening day with me and shook his head and said, "Who is this clown? He wouldn't have lasted one week in the Air Force."

And I'll ignore the race-baiting comment, too. Try to stick to intelligent debate instead of trying to dig for personal insults, mmkay? I'd hate to call in a mod on you, Dent, but you're seriously trying my patience with this particular post. I expect better of you.

I am not race baiting, I'm stating how your comments come off objectively. It sounded borderline racist whether you realized it or not. You took an officer not being stuck up and turned it into him being a "gangsta pimp" and a shivin and jivin black guy...which you said yourself. How is that not borderline racist? You're taking the fact that he is black and putting a stereotype on him because he wasn't all orderly conduct the entire film as an Airmen, or in other words he because acted like a real person. I'm not saying you were overtly racist but it came off that way to an extent. Don't use terms like gangsta pimp and basically calling him a token 60s black guy when it is not remotely called for.

And finally, most people and officers in the AF just don't act like that, especially when they're not in front of their superiors. I don't know how it was back when your dad was in it, but I am actually in the Air Force right now, and I can tell you from first hand experience none of the offices I know act like they have a stick in their ass 100% of the time.

Originally Posted by jaqua99

just because his view/opinion differs from yours? nice

No, because he's calling the way Howard portrays Rhodey's character a "gangsta pimp" and 60s "jivin" black guy for no legitimate reason at all. Half the examples he used to support his claim didn't even come from Rhodey in context. Rhodey didn't come up with the hum-vee, Tony did. Rhodey did not want to drink on the plane, Tony did. Rhodey refused to blow on Tony's dice because that's what women do, which Tony asked him to do. Yes I asked what the hell was wrong with him because what he said was uncalled for.

[Brian Braddock]

Cheadle all the way for me. A better actor than Howard, in my opinion.

[Webfoot Hero]

Originally Posted by Brian Braddock

Cheadle all the way for me. A better actor than Howard, in my opinion.

Agreed. Plus, he's not so melodramatic in real life either. Howard has some sob stories that he tells on talk shows that make him seem like a bit of a drama queen.

[jaqua99]

Originally Posted by Mr. Dent

I am not race baiting, I'm stating how your comments come off objectively. It sounded borderline racist whether you realized it or not. You took an officer not being stuck up and turned it into him being a "gangsta pimp" and a shivin and jivin black guy...which you said yourself. How is that not borderline racist? You're taking the fact that he is black and putting a stereotype on him because he wasn't all orderly conduct the entire film as an Airmen, or in other words he because acted like a real person. I'm not saying you were overtly racist but it came off that way to an extent. Don't use terms like gangsta pimp and basically calling him a token 60s black guy when it is not remotely called for.

And finally, most people and officers in the AF just don't act like that, especially when they're not in front of their superiors. I don't know how it was back when your dad was in it, but I am actually in the Air Force right now, and I can tell you from first hand experience none of the offices I know act like they have a stick in their ass 100% of the time.


No, because he's calling the way Howard portrays Rhodey's character a "gangsta pimp" and 60s "jivin" black guy for no legitimate reason at all. Half the examples he used to support his claim didn't even come from Rhodey in context. Rhodey didn't come up with the hum-vee, Tony did. Rhodey did not want to drink on the plane, Tony did. Rhodey refused to blow on Tony's dice because that's what women do, which Tony asked him to do. Yes I asked what the hell was wrong with him because what he said was uncalled for.

He had his opinion. Probably remembered things a bit incorrectly, but seriously, regardless of opinions, lets keep away from pointing fingers and such.

As for the matter at hand. There was something about Howard's Rhodey that I didn't like either. he was too laid back. He was "cool". That's the issue I had as him. Personally, I saw him as an actor playing a colonel. I just couldn't see him in the airfoce.

Cheadle lacked the chemistry, but look at that movie, ya know? It's not like there was much of an oppritunity for them to have chemistry anyway. Cheadle I think was much more believable as an airforce colonel. And you could even see a tiny bit of friendship at the beginning when stark showed justin hammer failing on screen, Rhodey looked at tony and tried to cover a laugh

[CastlesInTheAir]

Originally Posted by jaqua99

As for the matter at hand. There was something about Howard's Rhodey that I didn't like either. he was too laid back. He was "cool". That's the issue I had as him. Personally, I saw him as an actor playing a colonel. I just couldn't see him in the airfoce.

Thats much better than "he was doing a chris tucker/eddie murphy gangsta pimp impersonation and token black character" that cherokee was giving.
I can see people preferring Cheadle over Howard for Cheadle being the straight man to RBJs eccentric Tony Stark. I personally disagree but thats a genuine critique. I don't even know why cherokee had to bring race into it at all.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by Mr. Dent

I am not race baiting, I'm stating how your comments come off objectively. It sounded borderline racist whether you realized it or not. You took an officer not being stuck up and turned it into him being a "gangsta pimp" and a shivin and jivin black guy...which you said yourself. How is that not borderline racist? You're taking the fact that he is black and putting a stereotype on him because he wasn't all orderly conduct the entire film as an Airmen, or in other words he because acted like a real person. I'm not saying you were overtly racist but it came off that way to an extent. Don't use terms like gangsta pimp and basically calling him a token 60s black guy when it is not remotely called for.

And finally, most people and officers in the AF just don't act like that, especially when they're not in front of their superiors. I don't know how it was back when your dad was in it, but I am actually in the Air Force right now, and I can tell you from first hand experience none of the offices I know act like they have a stick in their ass 100% of the time.


No, because he's calling the way Howard portrays Rhodey's character a "gangsta pimp" and 60s "jivin" black guy for no legitimate reason at all. Half the examples he used to support his claim didn't even come from Rhodey in context. Rhodey didn't come up with the hum-vee, Tony did. Rhodey did not want to drink on the plane, Tony did. Rhodey refused to blow on Tony's dice because that's what women do, which Tony asked him to do. Yes I asked what the hell was wrong with him because what he said was uncalled for.

The *portrayal* is racist. Instead of letting Rhodey act like a dignified officer, like he was in the comics, like Cheadle portrays him in 2 & 3, the writers pulled up black buddy-cop sidekick. *Yes,* Eddie Murphy, Chris Tucker, Martin Lawrence, all that. *That's* what's "borderline racist," and I call Fav and/or the writers and/or Howard on that, because it made Rhodey look like a ****.

Cheadle doesn't act like "he's got a stick up his ass" --- he acts like he's got a sense of duty to his country, that he's disgusted with seeing his best friend become a degenerate. In IM2, Rhodey is the foil to Tony, and as Tony falls deeper and deeper into degeneracy, it's Rhodey that acts more and more like a true hero.

Howard & RDJ might have had more "chemistry," if you define "chemistry" as being your bro-man; but Cheadle & RDJ have "chemistry" in the sense that they act as foils to each other, while at the same time being friends. Their chemistry is based on being opposites; Howard's chemistry is based on being Tony's bud. Howard could *not* have pulled off the seriousness that Rhodey's role required in IM2. Instead of standing head and shoulders above a drunk Tony partying and pissing in his armor, Howard Rhodey would have just said "awww HAYLE no" and gone all Will Smith on him.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by CastlesInTheAir

Thats much better than "he was doing a chris tucker/eddie murphy gangsta pimp impersonation and token black character" that cherokee was giving.
I can see people preferring Cheadle over Howard for Cheadle being the straight man to RBJs eccentric Tony Stark. I personally disagree but thats a genuine critique. I don't even know why cherokee had to bring race into it at all.

Just....

[CastlesInTheAir]

Originally Posted by cherokeesam

The *portrayal* is racist. Instead of letting Rhodey act like a dignified officer, like he was in the comics, like Cheadle portrays him in 2 & 3, the writers pulled up black buddy-cop sidekick. *Yes,* Eddie Murphy, Chris Tucker, Martin Lawrence, all that. *That's* what's "borderline racist," and I call Fav and/or the writers and/or Howard on that, because it made Rhodey look like a ****.

Howard could *not* have pulled off the seriousness that Rhodey's role required in IM2. Instead of standing head and shoulders above a drunk Tony partying and pissing in his armor, Howard Rhodey would have just said "awww HAYLE no" and gone all Will Smith on him.

I don't even want to know what word got bleeped out.

[R_Hythlodeus]

wait. I'm racist right now because I preferred Cheadles very dry and straight performance of Rhodey to Howards walking stereotype? really?

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by CastlesInTheAir

...

[CastlesInTheAir]

No, but calling him "Chris Tucker, Eddie Murphy, Martin Lawrence, Will Smith, whatever black actor you can think" of as a criticism is.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by R_Hythlodeus

wait. I'm racist right now because I preferred Cheadles very dry and straight performance of Rhodey to Howards walking stereotype? really?

Of course we are. Obviously they found out about us burning crosses.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by CastlesInTheAir

No, but calling him "Chris Tucker, Eddie Murphy, Martin Lawrence, Will Smith, whatever black actor you can think" of as a criticism is.

Please do explain.
Can't wait to hear the "reasoning" behind this one.