The Official "I Loved Raimi's Spider-Man' Thread - Part 1 of 99 Luft - Part 8

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Spider-Aziz

I hope for an extended cut of the Amazing Spider-Man

Sometimes I wonder if an extended cut would even help.

Originally Posted by The Joker

True, but that would be really silly if someone who is not an expert in the field they're messing with starts testing themselves with it.

Who knows, Sam Raimi could add this desperate side to Connors that would test with a field that he has no knowledge of.

[Spider-Aziz]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

Sometimes I wonder if an extended cut would even help.

Not thinking of score improvement, I want to see the full version

[The Joker]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

Who knows, Sam Raimi could add this desperate side to Connors that would test with a field that he has no knowledge of.

Yes, but Connors being so desperate to regrow his arm that he would do that doesn't ring true. He's been living with this condition for years. Why the sudden urgency now? At least in TASM he was a biologist and saw promising test results on the hamsters with missing limbs they were using as test subjects. He was also under pressure from Oscorp to get test results.

Same as how Norman was desperate to save his company that he tested the performance enhancers on himself so they would have a successful human trial for the board.

I don't want Connors to be portrayed as an idiot physicist who messes around in Scientific fields he's no expert in like Molecular Biology just because he wants his arm back.

[Anno_Domini]

Who's to say he has a sudden urgency? He could have been doing his research for years, finally having the serum made in the eventual film if he was in Raimi's series.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

I know we're throwing out inconsequential "could haves", but would it be odd for Connors to have started branching out into the field of biology in between 2 and 3? Or even prior to 2? If that were emphasized, I could have accepted him as The Lizard. If not, it would be hard fo not laugh at a scientist who goes all the way in an experiment whose field he doesn't know very well.

[The Joker]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

Who's to say he has a sudden urgency? He could have been doing his research for years, finally having the serum made in the eventual film if he was in Raimi's series.

"I'm a physicist not a biologist"

There's a difference between looking at some cells under a microscope ala the symbiote and manipulating DNA to make a regenerative serum that regrows human limbs. That's Nobel prize material.

Like I said Raimi shot himself in the foot there labeling Connors like that. The reason Osborn and Octavius worked as believable villains is because they were products of misguided work in their own scientific fields that they were passionate about. Connors is supposed to be of the same vein.

[Anno_Domini]

You continue to repeat yourself. I am fully aware of what Connors says, but that doesn't mean he can't branch off and ending up failing. Failing isn't Nobel Prize material.

[The Joker]

You continue to miss the point. It's not failing in the sense he created a serum that caused limb regeneration. Did he or did he not regrow his arm when he took the serum? The failure was it had side effects that turned him into a Lizard man.

[ThePhantasm]

I agree that the physicist angle screwed up that storyline. At the same time, I don't think I would have wanted to see a Raimi-verse Lizard. It would have simply been Norman / Otto's storyline on repeat.

[SpideyVille]

Originally Posted by ThePhantasm

I agree that the physicist angle screwed up that storyline. At the same time, I don't think I would have wanted to see a Raimi-verse Lizard. It would have simply been Norman / Otto's storyline on repeat.

That's why I always felt the Kraven pairing would have worked best, because it would have forced Peter to struggle between trying to protect his mentor, as well as fighting to destroy him or cure him.

[ThePhantasm]

That would be interesting, though to be honest I've never really liked Kraven as a villain.

[SpideyVille]

Neither have I, but I always felt if they wanted to do multiple villains, that would be the way t go without having it feel clustered. It would've also been something I would have liked to have seen done before something with Vulture, Rhino or Electro.

And I still want to see a Shocker cameo similar to Scarecrow in TDK.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by The Joker

You continue to miss the point. It's not failing in the sense he created a serum that caused limb regeneration. Did he or did he not regrow his arm when he took the serum? The failure was it had side effects that turned him into a Lizard man.

I do get the point you are making, but I just don't think it's the only way to think of it. It is failing when a man creates a serum, takes it, and the after effects are far worse than just a few minutes or moments of having a regrown human arm. If that is your criteria of being "Nobel Prize material" than that seems pretty low(no wonder Barack Obama won one ). If Raimi gave Curt a different field who instead worked on something that he wasn't knowledgable with, then it could work just as well with this desperate man thinking he can regrow his arm.

[ImAlwaysAngry]

Originally Posted by SpideyVille

That's why I always felt the Kraven pairing would have worked best, because it would have forced Peter to struggle between trying to protect his mentor, as well as fighting to destroy him or cure him.

This.

SM4 should've opened with Rhino tearing up the streets, shown Vulture stealing Oscorp glider-tech crafting wings from it, had Connors become the Lizard, and brought on Kraven the Hunter in the second act.

I know that sounds like overload, but the first act could be nothing but Spidey dealing with one threat after another - Kraven could even show up and capture Vulture and Rhino fairly quickly to neutralize them. With the emergence of Lizard, he sees his greatest challenge and boom- we're into the story you're talking about.

You can argue that's too many villains, but only if you think every villain deserves a laborious pseudo-emotional backstory (which they don't).

I just hope to eventually see a Spidey movie where he has to stop off and neutralize Shocker like it's just part of his regular day. "Can't get a break" is one of the best things about the Spidey character.

But yeah, even without the stuff I mentioned - Kraven/Lizard would've been fantastic.

[SpideyVille]

I think that could've worked if they had filmed 4 and 5 together and made it one long movie.

The thing I hated about Raimi though, was how he had o have every villain have some connection to Peter. It worked pretty well with all of them except Sandman, but I can't really imagine what his version of SM3 would have been had it had Vulture in it, or his ideas with Felicia Hardy being the Vultress.

[webhead731]

That Vultress stuff was never confirmed. Plus Sam wasn't writing the movie so they probably weren't even his ideas if true. Plus he was wanting more time to change the script.

[Spider-Aziz]

Originally Posted by SpideyVille

That's why I always felt the Kraven pairing would have worked best, because it would have forced Peter to struggle between trying to protect his mentor, as well as fighting to destroy him or cure him.

My problem with the story is both Kraven and Lizard will know Spider-Man is Peter Parker and kidnap or hurt Mary Jane
Somehow, every villain -except Sandman- in Raimi's world does that

[Venom75]

I've always wanted to see Black Cat in a part 4. I think that after the events of part 3,Peter and MJ would take a bit of a break from each other and spilt up. Peter could run into Black Cat and have a bit of fun running around NY with her,and help get MJ off his mind for a bit.

[Spider-Aziz]

Originally Posted by Venom75

I've always wanted to see Black Cat in a part 4. I think that after the events of part 3,Peter and MJ would take a bit of a break from each other and spilt up. Peter could run into Black Cat and have a bit of fun running around NY with her,and help get MJ off his mind for a bit.

I wanted to know how they'd handle it for the game sequels
Even more with Beenox holding the torch

[henzINNIT]

Originally Posted by SpideyVille

That's why I always felt the Kraven pairing would have worked best, because it would have forced Peter to struggle between trying to protect his mentor, as well as fighting to destroy him or cure him.

+ Kraven can logically be brought in as some eccentric game hunter and TV personality who is attracted to hunting the giant Lizard and has eyes on the Spider too.

Both villains could easily be intergrated into Peter's personal life too. Connors would obviously be a collegue/mentor to Parker in a scientific experiment, and Kraven's celebrity status could force him into contact with Parker through the press.

Pretty much writes itself.

[Dragon]

Originally Posted by The Joker

True, but that would be really silly if someone who is not an expert in the field they're messing with starts testing themselves with it.

At least Norman was a Doctor of what he was doing with the performance enhancers, and Octavius was a Doctor of Physics. They at least thought they knew what they were doing in a field they were experts in. If a physicist starts messing with Lizard DNA and using themselves as a test subject, then it's sheer stupidity lol.

Yeah, but its a bit worse when an "expert" in the field has a total crash and burn as does movie Norman, Ock and Connors. They're failures in their life's work ended up costing more lives than their own.

Connors merely being out of his field, but suffering from the same hubris and even desperation to be whole again isn't quite as far-fectched. And it could even be explained that Connors doesn't actually test himself on purpose. He could merely be exposed accidentally.

[The Joker]

Originally Posted by Dragon

And it could even be explained that Connors doesn't actually test himself on purpose. He could merely be exposed accidentally.

Now that would be better and more plausible.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by webhead731

That Vultress stuff was never confirmed. Plus Sam wasn't writing the movie so they probably weren't even his ideas if true. Plus he was wanting more time to change the script.

Sam went through the drafts with the many screenwriters though that Sony brought in(Vanderbilt, Koepp, David Lindsay-Abaire, Gary Ross). He of course wasn't ready to hand out a final draft, but you'd think The Vulturess was a solid idea(and was confirmed, unless you don't believe Malkovich was confirmed or was going to play Vulture either since he was announced the same time as Hathaway) if she was really never taken out as Vulture was for Spider-Man 3.

Originally Posted by Dragon

Connors merely being out of his field, but suffering from the same hubris and even desperation to be whole again isn't quite as far-fectched. And it could even be explained that Connors doesn't actually test himself on purpose. He could merely be exposed accidentally.

Agreed; I could definitely see Raimi using the idea of Connors being out of his range of knowledge that ended up messing him up in the long run of things.

[SpideyVille]

I still find it so crazy that Anne Hathaway was at one point cast to play Felicia Hardy (who most would know as the Black Cat), to being cast as Selina Kyle (who most know as Catwoman).

[Anno_Domini]

Boy, that was a close call for her! Lol.