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Old 08-20-2013, 11:08 AM   #101
marvelrobbins
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

People realize that be erasing the trilogy and both origins/The wolverine you are sticking X-Men In peroid pieces.That would kill expansion of universe.

Some want time travel to do to X-Men what J.J. abrams did to Star Trek.Now ignoring the fact that Last Stand,Origins,and the wolverine are all more sucess than all NG Trek films.You are left with even more blanet errors If you have characters who were teenagers In trilogy start showing up In series earlier than they could have been.That's
one of problems with Abrams Trek.Khan In Into darkness doesn't fit the backstory.Plus
you have chekov suddenly born earlier.Despite all the alternate timeline talk the result Is still the same as outright reboot.Nothing from any Trek show or first 10 films has any importance to Trek anymore.They are never going to be films or tv shows set In so called prime trek universe anymore.If they do as some advocate the trilogy,Origins,the wolverine,and future part of DOFP become ilrelvent

Cyclops was around 16 In Origins set around 1979.He couldn't be introduced till 6 years after past part of DOFP.

They already dropped most of first Class cast except for big 4and Havok.And Havok may only have a small role.The first class cast only has 1 more film on contract.After that they will be In same situation after the last stand,Having to reneograte deals.DOFP proved the OT cast was willing to return but will say Jennifer Lawrence be willing to continue after her contract Is fullfilled.

and some are fooling themselves If they think DOFP will be end of Wolverine In Series.If most other films were erased they could have Wolverine now a X-Man before cyclops,jean,and storm.

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Old 08-20-2013, 11:39 AM   #102
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

You know just as much as we do about the future of the franchise. Nothing. Nobody is fooling themselves.

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Old 08-20-2013, 11:45 AM   #103
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

I wouldn't be surprised if DOFP ends on 2 cliffhangers, one in past and one in future

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Old 08-20-2013, 11:58 AM   #104
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

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Two X-Men producers, Hutch Parker and Lauren S.Donner, have mentioned continuing with OT cast too.

So its kind of ironic that the ones not seeing it are the fans, lol.

Fox and producers now know perfectly the potential the fanchise has right now, with both casts. So no way they will get rid of any of the two casts. Not when Singer is back and all the OT actors are open to do more movies.

They have a goldmine, so they will exploit it more than ever.
Lauren Shuler Donner is the same one who wanted X-Men Origins: Magneto. We know that didn't happen. She's also the one who said that Gambit and Cyclops were too similar to introduce Gambit into the movies.

The producers also said that we were gonna have a run of spinoff films, and that X-Men: First Class was originally supposed to be a teen drama.

Just because a producer says it doesn't make it true.

And also, thank god all those bad ideas for movies didn't happen. She really wants this series to jump the shark doesn't she?

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Old 08-20-2013, 12:11 PM   #105
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

of course producers have had many ideas.

But when 8 original actors are returning, and two producers have adressed the possibility of doing another sequel with original cast, that means there have been discussions about it and they know they can do it.

So that alone, to me, means a lot.

Some fans dont care, but I care. Since OT has an amazing cast and I believe in the potential of a possible sequel.

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Old 08-20-2013, 12:22 PM   #106
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

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Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay View Post
Lauren Shuler Donner is the same one who wanted X-Men Origins: Magneto. We know that didn't happen. She's also the one who said that Gambit and Cyclops were too similar to introduce Gambit into the movies.

The producers also said that we were gonna have a run of spinoff films, and that X-Men: First Class was originally supposed to be a teen drama.

Just because a producer says it doesn't make it true.

And also, thank god all those bad ideas for movies didn't happen. She really wants this series to jump the shark doesn't she?
Thank you. Just because a producer said it doesn't make it 100% true. Plans change and this is a huge movie franchise; they're going to have to do what's best for it's longevity - not what some fanboys online want.

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Old 08-20-2013, 12:29 PM   #107
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

Lets just concentrate on DOFP right now rather then worry so much about what will come next

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Old 08-20-2013, 12:33 PM   #108
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

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People realize that be erasing the trilogy and both origins/The wolverine you are sticking X-Men In peroid pieces.That would kill expansion of universe.

Some want time travel to do to X-Men what J.J. abrams did to Star Trek.Now ignoring the fact that Last Stand,Origins,and the wolverine are all more sucess than all NG Trek films.You are left with even more blanet errors If you have characters who were teenagers In trilogy start showing up In series earlier than they could have been.That's
one of problems with Abrams Trek.Khan In Into darkness doesn't fit the backstory.Plus
you have chekov suddenly born earlier.Despite all the alternate timeline talk the result Is still the same as outright reboot.Nothing from any Trek show or first 10 films has any importance to Trek anymore.They are never going to be films or tv shows set In so called prime trek universe anymore.If they do as some advocate the trilogy,Origins,the wolverine,and future part of DOFP become ilrelvent

Cyclops was around 16 In Origins set around 1979.He couldn't be introduced till 6 years after past part of DOFP.

They already dropped most of first Class cast except for big 4and Havok.And Havok may only have a small role.The first class cast only has 1 more film on contract.After that they will be In same situation after the last stand,Having to reneograte deals.DOFP proved the OT cast was willing to return but will say Jennifer Lawrence be willing to continue after her contract Is fullfilled.

and some are fooling themselves If they think DOFP will be end of Wolverine In Series.If most other films were erased they could have Wolverine now a X-Man before cyclops,jean,and storm.
You either have to make whole sale changes and essentially JJ Abrams it, or you have to barely tweak it. You can't have a tweener that basically contradicts major elements, like Jean survivng at the end of the trilogy. It would completely contradict the climax of the last OT movie and The Wolverine. If Fox wants certain characters back it, they will have to write them back in despite what transpired in the OT. It can be done, but it has to start with DoFP providing some of those answers.


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Old 08-20-2013, 01:13 PM   #109
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

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You either have to make whole sale changes and essentially JJ Abrams it, or you have to barely tweak it. You can't have a tweener that basically contradicts major elements, like Jean survivng at the end of the trilogy. It would completely contradict the climax of the last OT movie and The Wolverine. If Fox wants certain characters back it, they will have to write them back in despite what transpired in the OT. It can be done, but it has to start with DoFP providing some of those answers.
It doesn't have to contradict The Wolverine if Logan still remembers the OT timeline being the time traveler...he could be the only one

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Old 08-20-2013, 01:22 PM   #110
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It doesn't have to contradict The Wolverine if Logan still remembers the OT timeline being the time traveler...he could be the only one
So Wolverine's mind returns to the future. Everyone is in a brand new timeline that has no recollection of the battle at Alcatraz (a hypothetical), or the war in the OT which was now prevented back in 1973, but the OT is valid since Wolverine still remembers it?

Just seems like a gimmick. What's the point, so Famke and James show up for a one minute cameo and maybe another X-Men movie down the line? The latter being a huge IF.


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Old 08-20-2013, 02:51 PM   #111
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

I'd say a FC 3. I was thinking about opening up the film w/orgin scenes for Scott, Jean, and Storm w/new recruit Gambit fast forward severel years later and it's graduation time for them.

One of the plots would be life after the "Xavier institute", w/Scott dealing w/how he'll fit into society, because what job will hiring him wearing shades, Beast will eventually leave to get involved in politics, the start of Jean and Scott's blossoming romance, and we' see the connection between Storm and Gambit, both being theives, orhpans, wanting a better life. We would see Scott/Gambit struggling to get along and leading the team which we'll see Storm step up a little bit and focus on Jean's growing power a hint to Phoenix.

the main plot would Mr. Sinister and the mutant massacre, Friend's of Humanity causing trouble, Mystique has jumped shipped and is working for Sinister, since Magneto maybe imprisoned (we'll see after DOFP). Also Gambit is being mind controlled by Sinister to inflitrate the X-Men.

By the end of the film, Beast leaves, Gambit leaves feeling that he isn't a"team player" and will be a theif for hire thus leading to X1 w/a team of Scott,Jean and Storm.

Oh and a special end credit scene with Mystique, Toad, Sabretooth breaking Magento out of prison/confinement would be homeage to X1

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Old 08-20-2013, 03:02 PM   #112
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

still got months till DOFP is out, I say we just concentrate on that

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Old 08-20-2013, 03:23 PM   #113
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I'd say a FC 3. I was thinking about opening up the film w/orgin scenes for Scott, Jean, and Storm w/new recruit Gambit fast forward severel years later and it's graduation time for them.

One of the plots would be life after the "Xavier institute", w/Scott dealing w/how he'll fit into society, because what job will hiring him wearing shades, Beast will eventually leave to get involved in politics, the start of Jean and Scott's blossoming romance, and we' see the connection between Storm and Gambit, both being theives, orhpans, wanting a better life. We would see Scott/Gambit struggling to get along and leading the team which we'll see Storm step up a little bit and focus on Jean's growing power a hint to Phoenix.

the main plot would Mr. Sinister and the mutant massacre, Friend's of Humanity causing trouble, Mystique has jumped shipped and is working for Sinister, since Magneto maybe imprisoned (we'll see after DOFP). Also Gambit is being mind controlled by Sinister to inflitrate the X-Men.

By the end of the film, Beast leaves, Gambit leaves feeling that he isn't a"team player" and will be a theif for hire thus leading to X1 w/a team of Scott,Jean and Storm.

Oh and a special end credit scene with Mystique, Toad, Sabretooth breaking Magento out of prison/confinement would be homeage to X1
Fascinating, but a snooze fest as far as general audiences are concerned. The key is, how do you make that Gambit/Sinister/X-Men relationship interesting. The elements are there, but once again, the focus is not on the X-Men. In this type of story, I think Gambit moves front and center here (replacing Cyke yet again), and maybe focus on Jean if they want to hint at the beginnings of the Phoenix. It just can't be the focus of a Gambit/Sinister movie because of time constraints, and it was already explained in X3. We got the gist of that story already and it would be repetitive.

Should Magneto be jailed, you probably have to retcon the beginning of TLS, with Prof X and Eric recruiting her. A lot of elements working and none too particularly interesting from a casual audience point of view. Breaking Magneto out of jail would also be cliche.


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Old 08-20-2013, 06:56 PM   #114
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

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One of the plots would be life after the "Xavier institute", w/Scott dealing w/how he'll fit into society, because what job will hiring him wearing shades, Beast will eventually leave to get involved in politics, the start of Jean and Scott's blossoming romance, and we' see the connection between Storm and Gambit, both being theives, orhpans, wanting a better life. We would see Scott/Gambit struggling to get along and leading the team which we'll see Storm step up a little bit and focus on Jean's growing power a hint to Phoenix.
I like it for the most part. I thought of a similar path. I'd have Havok still in there though. Want to see him and Scott brawl it out. Cyclops, Jean, Storm, Beast , Havok, Gambit and maybe add Dazzler in there to get some more X chicks and that's a pretty sick line up. Theres a very strong X-Men movie in there.


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Old 08-20-2013, 09:07 PM   #115
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They are setting up possible X-Force links. It's that simple. Plus most of the new mutants are plot devices for time travel and not major characters in the story it would appear.

I think this is Stewart and McKellan's last go around. The other OT actors have supporting roles and were on the set for a few weeks tops. Who doesn't need the exposure in Hollywood these days? Not like this project was beneath the likes of Anna and Halle. They need exposure and this is arguably the biggest film of the summer next year.

I'm 80% sure it's done after this. FC3 will be the stepping stone for the future.
If you're 80%. Then I'm 100% sure that we will see more from the OT cast.

You are underestimating their chance to return, a big part of the film's hype right now is because of them.

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Emma Frost wasnt coming back once January Jones had her little affair with Matthew Vaughn, that was clear from the start, also the likes of Azazel and Angel arent exactly fan favourites, they could be dumped with no consequences. I think any FC sequel wouldnt have had these characters personally.
You could say the same thing to Storm and Rogue. FOX brought back the whole gang except for Rebecca/Kelsey (though their younger version are in the movie) and James/Famke/Aaron (their characters died in X3). And what's your reason for them not to bring back Banshee?

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Old 08-20-2013, 09:12 PM   #116
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No... they have a goldmine if this does 8-900 million at the box office. Until a film in this franchise does those kinds of numbers, this is a fallacy. It very well could, in which case I'd expect both FC3 and X5.

TLS did not break even at the box office. You have to triple your budget WW to do that. TLS cost well north of 200 million and only netter 450ish, with only half of that coming domestically. That is not the numbers Fox was looking for and it basically snared the franchise for a while. That's why they had to start scaling things down with spinoffs.
The plans for spin-offs started even before X3 was released. Its not like they canceled a X-Men 4 movie in 2006/2007.
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Thank you. Just because a producer said it doesn't make it 100% true. Plans change and this is a huge movie franchise; they're going to have to do what's best for it's longevity - not what some fanboys online want.
Yeah like dumping the OT cast for FC cast and pulling a Star Trek to the modern-day films.

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Old 08-20-2013, 09:20 PM   #117
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:10 AM   #118
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You could say the same thing to Storm and Rogue. FOX brought back the whole gang except for Rebecca/Kelsey (though their younger version are in the movie) and James/Famke/Aaron (their characters died in X3). And what's your reason for them not to bring back Banshee?
I think you answered your own question their, Hoult and Lawrence are bigger names now than Rebecca and Kelsey, plus in the future SOME X-Men have to be dead to show the threat of the sentinels, it wouldnt surprise me if we see a few of the OT cast die on screen in a battle with them either.

Rebecca also has a new series on the go doesnt she? Maybe the filming conflicted with that, not to mention she got to cameo in FC. And she was never a big fan of the make-up process either, maybe she didnt want to return, same with Kelsey who isnt getting any younger, if you remember Alan Cumming didnt want to come back as NC because of the make-up process, which is still a damn shame as his NC was perfect.

As far as Banshee, I am a little disappointed he isnt returning, as I liked the character in FC and the actor playing him. But there could be a number reasons not to bring him back, budget is one, maybe they couldnt afford another cast member? Maybe Caleb had a scheduling conflict, maybe he didnt want to come back, it could be anything, and we will probably never know.

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Old 08-21-2013, 12:18 AM   #119
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

I would agree that at this point in time, the First Class versions of Beast and Mystique are going to be more relevant than the main trilogy versions.

For one, Mystique was cured and Beast left the X-Men. For 2, they were most recently portrayed by Lawrence and Hoult, and it could be argued that Beast was more relevant / developed than Grammar's version.

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Old 08-21-2013, 12:30 AM   #120
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I think you answered your own question their, Hoult and Lawrence are bigger names now than Rebecca and Kelsey, plus in the future SOME X-Men have to be dead to show the threat of the sentinels, it wouldnt surprise me if we see a few of the OT cast die on screen in a battle with them either.

As far as Banshee, I am a little disappointed he isnt returning, as I liked the character in FC and the actor playing him. But there could be a number reasons not to bring him back, budget is one, maybe they couldnt afford another cast member? Maybe Caleb had a scheduling conflict, maybe he didnt want to come back, it could be anything, and we will probably never know.
Since the younger version of Mystique and Beast are already in the movie, their older version aren't really needed. And of course the younger version of those two should comeback to tie them to the Mystique/beast that appeared in the OT. And if there is a X-Men 4 movie that will just the feature the OT cast, I doubt they would bring back Rebecca/Kelsey. Mystique and Magneto are no longer together and Beast moved to D.C. to work for United Nations. If those two had a different ending in X3, we would probably see them back along with their younger version.

And if they could bring back Colossus, they could definitely bring back Banshee and the actor that played him.

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Rebecca also has a new series on the go doesnt she? Maybe the filming conflicted with that, not to mention she got to cameo in FC. And she was never a big fan of the make-up process either, maybe she didnt want to return, same with Kelsey who isnt getting any younger, if you remember Alan Cumming didnt want to come back as NC because of the make-up process, which is still a damn shame as his NC was perfect.
All wrong. They removed Nightcrawler from X3's script because he doesn't have much role in the film. I doubt Rebecca Romijn/Kelsey Grammar would turn down the offer to return. Kelsey Grammar attended Origins' premiere night and Rebecca Romijn had a cameo in First Class. And there's no report that those two were asked to appear in DOFP.

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Old 08-21-2013, 12:39 AM   #121
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Not all wrong. Alan Cummings didn't want to come back and endure the Nightcrawler makeup process. He would have, but he didn't want to.

And you are also right, they cut him because they didn't have a big enough role to justify the costs.

Both are right.

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Old 08-21-2013, 12:42 AM   #122
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Not all wrong. Alan Cummings didn't want to come back and endure the Nightcrawler makeup process. He would have, but he didn't want to.

And you are also right, they cut him because they didn't have a big enough role to justify the costs.

Both are right.
If Alan Cumming was offered to comeback in X3 and he turned down the role, they could have replaced him.

His unwillingness to return didn't really play a role why Nightcrawler didn't appear in X3.

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Old 08-21-2013, 10:34 AM   #123
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

Alan Cumming WAS offered a role as NC in X3 but didnt want to come back as he hated the make-up process. This was well documented at the time and even stated by Simon Kinberg when he was answering fan questions on another forum I was part of, cant remember the name of the web-site but plenty on here were on it as well.

They wrote him out of the movie once they knew he wasnt returning as the role wasnt very big and they didnt want to re-cast. Also, they stated there would have been too many blue people in the movie.

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Old 08-21-2013, 11:32 AM   #124
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

Yeah he hated the makeup but It wasn't his decsion not to return.He was willing to come back and some forget every actor usually signs a deal for 1 sequel.Sometimes the actors aren't used again.Nightcrawler didn't have a big role in script so they dropped him because
they didn't want to spend money on makeup for a small role.

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Old 08-21-2013, 11:37 AM   #125
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Default Re: First Class 3 or X-Men 5?

Alan said around X3 release that they he would have returned, but they didnt ask him.

He didnt like X2 make-up hours, we all know that, but that doesnt prove he said "no" to Fox.

So until I dont read an old interview of Brett, Kimberg or anyone involved, I wont believe he didnt want to return.

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