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Old 09-09-2013, 11:52 AM   #51
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

A draw

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Old 09-09-2013, 12:19 PM   #52
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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Originally Posted by Batmannerism View Post
Hi People,

time to address the elephant in the room.

Traditionally, one of the key plot devices in super-hero comics is that when two super-heroes meet for the first time, they try and kick the crap out of each other - you know, mistaken identity or conflicting agendas ("You can have him...when I'm done with him!") or whatever.

Apparently BM vs SM is going to draw from Miller's DKR, which I think
is a flawed premise.
Here's why: the final fight in DKR is about a philosophical difference that's been brewing for decades, that's what makes it work. You feel Batman's righteous fury at Superman's betrayal of their principles. He's pissed and
as much as we all love Supes, he kind of has it coming (also, it's very clear during the fight that Supes is holding back, a lot).

As such, it's not really appropriate material for a first meeting between the characters.

However, if it does influence the film, then we should expect the Dark Knight and the Man of Steel to engage in fisticuffs.



my opinion, a draw of sorts. Batman clearly out-thinks Clark, but has to
rely on a ****load of gadgets and tricky tactics just to keep Clark at bay.

And the winner is.....the audience. Well let's hope so.

Time for your opinions people. Throw down! Who should win, who will win, will it be a draw, who do you want to win, and most importantly, WHY ?

Peace.

It has to be a draw. Both will have their chance to shine, then they can combine to defeat the major villian.

Superman will beat up Batman using his physical force.

Batman Will trick/out guile Superman and get a leg up.

then they combine to beat luther

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Old 09-10-2013, 06:09 AM   #53
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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It has to be a draw. Both will have their chance to shine, then they can combine to defeat the major villian.

Superman will beat up Batman using his physical force.

Batman Will trick/out guile Superman and get a leg up.

then they combine to beat luther
Nice, with you on that !

I'm predicting a similar outcome.
I see Clark being just too powerful for Bats, but the Dark Knight
will certainly outwit him.

I also predict that Bats will end up saving Clark (probably
from Luthor) when he's been weakened by kryptonite (or whatever
passes for kryptonite in the movie). If anything that will
put Batman up by one, and the movie will end with
a team-up and some grudging respect.

Peace.

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Old 09-10-2013, 06:27 AM   #54
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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Watch this video from start to finish

VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:




Hmm yeah, something like that. In my mind, it would play out something like this, in TDKReturns, you have Superman who's on the omniscient higher authority antagonist's(US Government's) speed-dial and beck and call while old Batman is the upstart making a name for himself in Gotham and we know how that story goes. In my mind, for the movie it would still have something like that happening, but differently. Superman's the upstart making a name for himself in Metropolis doing the whole "Truth, Justice & The American Way" thing and just being Superman, stopping crime, left right and center and helping workers rebuild Metropolis, and just generally helping people, heck throw in a scene of saving a cat from a tree or helping an old woman cross the street haha. Of course people are somehow warming up to him(for argument's sake let's say the damage to Metropolis wasn't as bad as we thought it was and more people are actually left displaced rather than killed) and the Daily Planet writing glowing reports about Superman. Of course not everyone's happy about the alien, here we introduce Lex Luthor, who takes the place of the US Government as the omniscient higher authority from TDKReturns.

Luthor doesn't like what he sees and feels Superman upstages him at every corner(perhaps show him flipping through the latest issue of the Daily Planet where Superman is pages 1-5 while Luthor's page 10 lol). Luthor flips out and decides to concot his plan to take own the Man of Steel by first framing him for a crime he didn't commit, preferably murder(ala Public Enemies) and of course Superman goes on the run trying to prove his innocence as seen in the comic/animated movie, Lois could help here if she wants. Since no known police can actually take someone like Superman in, Lex uses his connections to a friend in Gotham City(Jim Gordon) who in turn calls in the people's superhero Batman, who supposedly handles an assortment of freaks like this on a daily basis.

The movie becomes pretty much a cat and mouse game between Superman & Batman culminating in a fight in Gotham's Crime Alley ala TDKReturns. So Batman then uses an assortment of different gadgets and traps to stall Superman and then of course releases the Kryptonite(Here Batman would just call it "radioactive meteor rock which simulates your home turf". Batman, being smart could make some analogy to how we are different in other planets like how when Astronauts go to the moon they become weightless etc and reasoned that materials from your home world must soften you up or something). Then Batman grabs and throws Superman through an adjacent nearby building and then a section of it collapses and is about to fall on a mother, father and an 8 year old boy. Superman sees this and with a final burst of his heat vision destroys it into debris ala Superman Returns. Batman looks on and is stunned and horrified about what he nearly did and realises that Superman is not the bad guy. Then the sun comes up and shines on Superman.(Think of it as a form of symbolism, that the night had its fun and now is the light's turn to
take over). Superman uses a burst of speed and swoops down on Batman.(On a side note, the Kryptonite ran out and is out of Superman's system).

*Superman grabs Batman by the throat*

Superman: "Did you realise what you just nearly did?!"
Batman(gasps):"I needed to neutralize you. You scare people, you think you are high and mighty and above the law taking lives as you please, you are no God!"
Superman:"You're one to talk with what you nearly did there!"
Superman:"I want you to remember...Bruce Wayne"
*Batman's eyes widen in horror that Superman knew who he was this whole time*
Superman: "I want you to remember this symbol Bruce, it means hope. My father sent me here for a reason: to be a symbol of hope for tommorow and every day after that in all the years to come. I'm not here to rule over you or act as judge, jury, executioner. I know that now, from first hand, I want you to remember Bruce, I will never kneel before evil."
Superman: "My purpose in life is to protect life and fight for Truth, Justice and the Right Way. If lives are in danger, I want you to remember that I will always inspire hope."
Batman: "I know that now."
*Superman releases Batman*
Superman: "Fight's over"
Batman: "Luthor..."
Superman:"What?"
Batman:"It's Luthor, he did it"

Now Superman and Batman go and team up and defeat Lex Luthor, and then give the film a good closing point for Superman and Batman for them to create the JL.
Interesting ! I like your idea, although I'm not sure I can believe in Bats would end up doing Luthor's dirty work, but I definitely see the two of them in conflict before a team up to take on Lex.

Personally, I think that Supes will dominate Bats in a physical contest (which might play out a bit like DKR, although with a different ending, I agree that obviously Supes will refrain from killing Bats (who knows maybe you're right, Bats will get the upper hand with kryptonite, but then Supes will rally (that sunrise idea of yours could work there), and of course Bats will be expecting the Zod-treatment, and instead Supes will help him up, convincing Bats that he's not a threat after all.

However, I have a feeling that in the end Bats will end up saving Supes after Luthor or some other villain weakens him with Kryptonite ( or whatever they use for kryptonite in the film). So that would be a win for Bats , you know,
sort of like in Return of the Jedi, when Han says to Luke "Now I owe You one !" after he saves him from Jabba the Hutt.
I'm also hoping for Bizarro (as a failed Superman clone) maybe he'll get the upper hand on Supes, and Batman will take him down with kryptonite he'd developed to take down Supes (or that Luthor;s been using to control Bizarro) or something like that.
I don't know why, but I quite like the idea of a mere mortal saving an all-powerful being like Superman ( it was the one thing I liked about the James Marsden character in Superman returns, although I hated that Superman was such a dumbass to get himself into that situation in the first place).

I can certainly see a scene in which Supes is getting clobbered (maybe by Bats, who knows) and then the sun comes up and he rallies, totally with you on that one.


Something I liked about Cavill/Snyder's Superman is that he didn't talk much, he just got on with doing things, so I can't see him making any big speeches - but I thought that Superman expressed himself better with facial expressions and body language. Like when he's fighting Faora and the big dude, and they're beating on him and he gives them a blast of heat vision.
When he stands up he's got this look on his face like " How'd you like me now *****es !" like he's about to lay down some hurt.
So I think if they're going to have an exchange it'll probably be brief.

anyway, great post. Peace,

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Old 09-10-2013, 06:30 AM   #55
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Not really. I want Batman to pose a challenge to Supes due to his wit and strategy, but for Superman to ultimately overcome it. That's different than just saying, if Batman is a person, Superman will squash him.

But a draw is the optimal outcome.
The voice of reason ! Wonder if Goyer and Snyder are listening ?
Let's hope so.

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Old 09-10-2013, 06:43 AM   #56
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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Agreed. IF they fight at all, it will be a draw, despite Bat-fans and Super fans wanting their guy to come out on top. (which we are seeing a lot of in these discussions).
True. but it's kind of fun (pointless fun) but fun to argue about
these things, everyone wants to push for their favourite character
to come out on top - although I haven't seen many Bat-maniacs
pushing that hard for the caped crusader. Would love to read a
really well thought out, and cunning bat-plan that resulted in the
defeat of Superman......whether you choose to agree with it or
not is up to you.
If Angry Joe can make a 25 minute youtube video about why
Supes would splatter Batman over several continents, then why not
let people rant about who's going to win ?

I used to have similar arguments /discussions about who would win in a fight between Jason Bourne and .....(well pretty much any other fictional movie
or tv badass) pretty much only Chuck Norris could take him down.
They were great for a laugh.


Okay I'm off topic there, anyway having said all that, I'm with
everyone who's promoting the "draw theory"
it'll probably be a stalemate of some kind,
as in Superman has the opportunity to clearly squash Bats
but is distracted by having to save something/someone else

Actually, an interesting turn of events is if early in the film Supes
clearly overpowers Bats (but of course doesn't unmask or imprison
him) and then later, when tables are reversed (due to Kryptonite or
one of the equalizers, used by Luthor) Bats gets his hands on the
kryptonite and has the chance to take out a weakened
Superman but chooses not to, realizing that Supes really is
a good guy.

(yes, this is me flogging my "Bats ends up saving Supes" for the
climax of the film)

I wonder if they'll end it with Supes giving Bats the last bit of kryptonite
, I forget which comic that appeared in, but it's sort of the iconic,
" I trust you with my only vulnerability" scene, that demonstrates how
much respect the characters have, despite surface antagonism.

Does any of that qualify as a draw ?

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Old 09-10-2013, 06:56 AM   #57
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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Interesting ! I like your idea, although I'm not sure I can believe in Bats would end up doing Luthor's dirty work, but I definitely see the two of them in conflict before a team up to take on Lex.

Personally, I think that Supes will dominate Bats in a physical contest (which might play out a bit like DKR, although with a different ending, I agree that obviously Supes will refrain from killing Bats (who knows maybe you're right, Bats will get the upper hand with kryptonite, but then Supes will rally (that sunrise idea of yours could work there), and of course Bats will be expecting the Zod-treatment, and instead Supes will help him up, convincing Bats that he's not a threat after all.

However, I have a feeling that in the end Bats will end up saving Supes after Luthor or some other villain weakens him with Kryptonite ( or whatever they use for kryptonite in the film). So that would be a win for Bats , you know,
sort of like in Return of the Jedi, when Han says to Luke "Now I owe You one !" after he saves him from Jabba the Hutt.
I'm also hoping for Bizarro (as a failed Superman clone) maybe he'll get the upper hand on Supes, and Batman will take him down with kryptonite he'd developed to take down Supes (or that Luthor;s been using to control Bizarro) or something like that.
I don't know why, but I quite like the idea of a mere mortal saving an all-powerful being like Superman ( it was the one thing I liked about the James Marsden character in Superman returns, although I hated that Superman was such a dumbass to get himself into that situation in the first place).

I can certainly see a scene in which Supes is getting clobbered (maybe by Bats, who knows) and then the sun comes up and he rallies, totally with you on that one.


Something I liked about Cavill/Snyder's Superman is that he didn't talk much, he just got on with doing things, so I can't see him making any big speeches - but I thought that Superman expressed himself better with facial expressions and body language. Like when he's fighting Faora and the big dude, and they're beating on him and he gives them a blast of heat vision.
When he stands up he's got this look on his face like " How'd you like me now *****es !" like he's about to lay down some hurt.
So I think if they're going to have an exchange it'll probably be brief.

anyway, great post. Peace,
Well in my idea, Bats isn't doing Lex's dirty work at all. In his mind he believes he's taking down a dangerous super-powered being who commited a heinous crime(when really Superman was framed by Lex Luthor just like in Public Enemies). As for the speeches thing, I'd like to see him slowly evolve into the Superman who likes making big inspirational speeches like in the Justice League cartoons.

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Old 09-10-2013, 09:32 AM   #58
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

If they do it right?
WE do.

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Old 09-10-2013, 11:52 AM   #59
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I want Superman beat up Batman.. but in the movie I think there's gonna be a draw...

REALLY?

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Old 09-10-2013, 03:58 PM   #60
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If they do it right?
WE do.
Totally with you on that one bro ! Good call.

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Old 09-10-2013, 04:10 PM   #61
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Well in my idea, Bats isn't doing Lex's dirty work at all. In his mind he believes he's taking down a dangerous super-powered being who commited a heinous crime(when really Superman was framed by Lex Luthor just like in Public Enemies). As for the speeches thing, I'd like to see him slowly evolve into the Superman who likes making big inspirational speeches like in the Justice League cartoons.
Fair enough ! Do you think the killing-when-absolutely-necessary vs no-killing-ever philosophies will be a big point of difference (that might lead to the conflict you've described) ? It would be odd if Goyer and crew avoid that issue, since Supes killing Zod caused such a stir, and anyone who knows anything about Batman knows he doesn't kill (which doesn't mean he doesn't indirectly cause people to die, but he doesn't generally kill them himself ).

As far as Superman's speeches go, I think "Grounded " would be great source material for Superman interacting with ordinary people. The people of Smallville probably already all know that it's just Clark kent wearing kryptonian spandex - be interesting to see if the writers run with that too.
I mean, Bruce Wayne could track him down to Smallville....

Bruce (speaking to local farmer): I'm looking for the Kent farm.
Farmer: Oh, that's 5 miles due east of town off the main road, but you want to watch your step if you go out there.
Bruce: Why's that ?
Farmer: because last time someone started some trouble out there with the Kent's boy Clark, they blew up all of downtown.
Bruce: You mean they did some damage.
Farmer: No, jus' what I said, they blew up all of downtown, took half the army with it. Ain't nobody eaten at the Ihop since.
Bruce; Thanks, I'll be careful.

Who knows ? I can see Bats turning up at the Kent farm as part of a psychological warfare tactic (which would probably backfire)

Bats : I know where you live. That makes you vulnerable.
Supes: I know what planet you live on. That makes YOU vulnerable.

Alright, I'm getting silly now.

Peace.

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Old 09-10-2013, 05:31 PM   #62
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Fair enough ! Do you think the killing-when-absolutely-necessary vs no-killing-ever philosophies will be a big point of difference (that might lead to the conflict you've described) ? It would be odd if Goyer and crew avoid that issue, since Supes killing Zod caused such a stir, and anyone who knows anything about Batman knows he doesn't kill (which doesn't mean he doesn't indirectly cause people to die, but he doesn't generally kill them himself ).
When I look at that killing scene, I gave my own interpretation for it.

One of Superman's fatal flaws is that he leaps before he looks and that he's naive as seen in many instances in comics. This often makes him a victim of many things such as mind control as seen in the Batman comic Hush for example and in Injustice: Gods Among Us(comic). Of course as he gets older this lessens but since it's Day 1 Year 1, it's there. Zod used Superman's inherent love of Earth's people and fact that Clark thinks fast and doesn't look before he leaps against him and pushed and goaded Superman to give him a warrior's death seeing as everything Zod cares about is gone. Seeing as a good death is its own reward is the credo the Kryptonians live by, Zod's reward is that he gets to torment the "weak and unsure" Superman from the grave about how his abilities can make him a living tool for murder. That catalyzes growth in Superman and made him realize this isn't right and that sometimes he has to step back and preserve life at all costs and not become a tool for killing by the bad guys. If Superman really had the intent to kill from the get-go he would've killed Zod even before the fight began.

So in essence Zod really won there as he used Superman.


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Old 09-11-2013, 12:58 AM   #63
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When I look at that killing scene, I gave my own interpretation for it.

One of Superman's fatal flaws is that he leaps before he looks and that he's naive as seen in many instances in comics. This often makes him a victim of many things such as mind control as seen in the Batman comic Hush for example and in Injustice: Gods Among Us(comic). Of course as he gets older this lessens but since it's Day 1 Year 1, it's there. Zod used Superman's inherent love of Earth's people and fact that Clark thinks fast and doesn't look before he leaps against him and pushed and goaded Superman to give him a warrior's death seeing as everything Zod cares about is gone. Seeing as a good death is its own reward is the credo the Kryptonians live by, Zod's reward is that he gets to torment the "weak and unsure" Superman from the grave about how his abilities can make him a living tool for murder. That catalyzes growth in Superman and made him realize this isn't right and that sometimes he has to step back and preserve life at all costs and not become a tool for killing by the bad guys. If Superman really had the intent to kill from the get-go he would've killed Zod even before the fight began.

So in essence Zod really won there as he used Superman.

Dude, I've been suggesting that Zod had a death-wish, (Nolan, who helped write the story is famous for his not-so-subtle foreshadowing, you know "You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain.")

But, that's a great analysis you've done there. I confess I hadn't thought of it in those terms. I've been saying that Supes killed Zod, not to save the family, but to save humanity, from Zod's genocidal madness.
I like the warrior's death idea -that was certainly a great little touch in the Faora vs Col. Hardy scenes.

Anyway, so ......Superman's now evolved a bit, after experiencing the trauma of essentially putting the final nails in the coffin of his own race.
How is this gonna feature in the Bats vs Supes conflict.
(I actually think that's an extremely lame title, but there's a whole other thread for that, so no need to address it here).

Do you think that Superman's murder of Zod....scratch that, justifiable homicide (although technically it isn't homicide as the law defines homicide as humans killing humans), anyway plenty of people have suggested it will be a good plot device for Luthor to turn everyone against Supes. I predict it will be a significant, or at least discussed point of
difference between Batman and Supes.

Maybe at first Batman will be disdainful of Supes, from the POV that killing is never a solution. But, later on when Bats deals with threats on Superman's level (which is a few orders of magnitude up from Bats, it's not just Gotham, but usually the whole freaking world at stake when SM gets involved)....anyway, maybe that changes Bats mind a bit.

Fire away people !

peace.

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Old 09-11-2013, 03:39 AM   #64
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

Batman taking Superman on in a rigged arena, wearing an armoured suit ala TDK Returns.

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Old 09-11-2013, 10:11 PM   #65
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Batman taking Superman on in a rigged arena, wearing an armoured suit ala TDK Returns.

Maybe, but if Bats is going to have a chance at all, that armour better
be made out of bits salvaged from the Kryptonians' armour/weapons.
As MOS showed that Supes is going to deal with even heavy military firepower pretty easily.

The Bat-armour that is certainly one way it could play out, but without kryptonite (which was the ace up Batman's sleeve in DKR) can't see him
coming out on top.

But who knows ? I think we'll have a better idea when Goyer/Snyder
make a few more revelations about the source material they're looking at
(besides DKR). Different writers handle those two characters very differently, we'll just have to wait and see.

But wait...you didn't answer the key question, who would win ?

or more to the point, who should win ? who will win (onscreen) ?

Peace.

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Old 09-11-2013, 10:26 PM   #66
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Maybe, but if Bats is going to have a chance at all, that armour better
be made out of bits salvaged from the Kryptonians' armour/weapons.

As MOS showed that Supes is going to deal with even heavy military firepower pretty easily.

The Bat-armour that is certainly one way it could play out, but without kryptonite (which was the ace up Batman's sleeve in DKR) can't see him
coming out on top.

But who knows ? I think we'll have a better idea when Goyer/Snyder
make a few more revelations about the source material they're looking at
(besides DKR). Different writers handle those two characters very differently, we'll just have to wait and see.

But wait...you didn't answer the key question, who would win ?

or more to the point, who should win ? who will win (onscreen) ?

Peace.
I think Zod's armor is on Lex hands by now

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Old 09-12-2013, 04:54 AM   #67
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I think Zod's armor is on Lex hands by now
Yeah, you're probably right. I predict some of the plot will revolve around
salvaged kryptonian tech.

That having said, who's going to come out on top Bats ? Supes ?

A draw ? or not fighting at all, and a bromance ? you be the judge !

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Old 09-12-2013, 06:53 AM   #68
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I want superman to beat his ass but it probably end in a draw. Though i keep imagining a scene where superman is chasing batman who is inside the bat in metropolis/gotham. He catches up, destroys it and yanks batman out of it and asks him while holding him by his throat,"thought you could run?"

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Old 09-12-2013, 07:05 AM   #69
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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Originally Posted by Batmannerism View Post
Maybe, but if Bats is going to have a chance at all, that armour better be made out of bits salvaged from the Kryptonians' armour/weapons.
Ideally for him, he'd have kryptonite to use.
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Originally Posted by Batmannerism View Post
But wait...you didn't answer the key question, who would win ? or more to the point, who should win ? who will win (onscreen) ?
I've posted before I'd like to see a draw where both character get 'hero moments'. Mano-a-mano with no backup it is obvious. Superman in a walkover. On Batman's terms in a rigged arena where the tricks keep coming, things are more interesting.

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Old 09-12-2013, 11:31 AM   #70
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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Originally Posted by Batmannerism View Post
Yeah, you're probably right. I predict some of the plot will revolve around
salvaged kryptonian tech.

That having said, who's going to come out on top Bats ? Supes ?

A draw ? or not fighting at all, and a bromance ? you be the judge !
I think maybe bats could saved pieces from the scout ship but to give the both sides of the audience I think Snyder will make a draw...

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Old 09-12-2013, 12:38 PM   #71
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

I think the fight or confrontation will happen around the halfway mark of the movie or a little later. What if this Bruce Wayne is the paranoid philanthropist type and well involved in his cities progress which would warrant Lex reaching out to him or him offering his help to rebuild Metropolis. They would play it cool enough in public and not out-rightly condemn superman but secretly they will combine their resources and genius to protect the city of metropolis from superman and all other alien-like forms like him by implementing a building plan that will see kryptonite (this will be the name given to whatever they find that will defeat him) being inbuilt in its infrastructure. It would really be interesting if Lex and Bruce (Lex doesn't know he is batman) are the only ones to actually make the only form of radioactive kryptonite rock as we know it. The only way they will know if it works while reverse engineering different configurations of kryptonian tech with other elements is to test it on him unknowingly in public while monitoring him closely for any sign of decreased strength or other weaknesses. They set up elaborate traps that he feels are just unfortunate accidents and doesn't have a clue until the big confrontation. It doesn't take long for the kryptonite to be discovered and Lex/Bruce stash a large amount around the still rebuilding city and prepare to take Superman down. Lex wants to kill Superman but Bruce as we all know doesn't kill. Bruce's starts to become suspicious of Luthor but goes on with the plan anyways because the alien threat needs to be neutralized etc. Lex secretly develops a kryptonite suite to kill Supes for he personally wants Supes to feel the horror he feels of being a human among a God (of course Lex has other plans also...he built a small army of krptonite robots to further his secret agenda of world domination etc.) while Bruce secretly develops a bat-version as a backup plan in case they miscalculated and he doesn't go down like they plan (no-killing on batman's part). Lex and Bruce (Lex has alot of man power and resources) stir up a ruckus down town in the kryptonite prone area that Superman can't ignore and will have to be around for a long time to settle. Superman notices the effects to himself and he then remembers that he felt it on a minor level before over the past months (Lex and Bruce tests which he foolishly overlooked and blamed on his efforts to save lives in the accidents) but by now it is too late and he collapses on the streets after a while with the help of a small kryptonite missile. Lex and Bruce agreed that after he weakens, they will lock him up but Lex seeing his chance then puts on his suit and reveals to Wayne his own agenda. To protect his secret identity Bruce doesn't stop Luthor. With Lex already on his way to Superman, Bruce suites up (kryptonite suite) and kicks Luthor's a** with a weakening Superman watching from a distance. He then confronts Superman and we then have the clash of ideals with Superman trying to convince this paranoid Batman that they fight for the same things despite their differences and methods. Of course things become heated and they go at it. Even in his weakening state Supes is more than a match for Bats and kicks his a** (while telling him that he can crush him but he doesn't believe in killing etc.) until a frightened Bats stabs him with a sharpened Kryptonite rock. Bats then gets the upper hand and delivers a little pay back but surprisingly stops fighting and they continue to dialogue and argue verbally about other differences while moving out of the kryptonite area. Supes destroys all the remaining kryptonite and tells Batman to keep the one he stabbed him with as a sign that he can be trusted to cool his paranoia. Of course Bats heads back to meet Luthor to question him about the kryptonite suite and what else he planned to do but Luthor has already headed back to his secret Lexcorp base. The third act will then involve Lex summoning his army to take out Batman and Superman

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Old 09-12-2013, 11:32 PM   #72
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

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Originally Posted by Isearch4dope View Post
I think the fight or confrontation will happen around the halfway mark of the movie or a little later. What if this Bruce Wayne is the paranoid philanthropist type and well involved in his cities progress which would warrant Lex reaching out to him or him offering his help to rebuild Metropolis. They would play it cool enough in public and not out-rightly condemn superman but secretly they will combine their resources and genius to protect the city of metropolis from superman and all other alien-like forms like him by implementing a building plan that will see kryptonite (this will be the name given to whatever they find that will defeat him) being inbuilt in its infrastructure. It would really be interesting if Lex and Bruce (Lex doesn't know he is batman) are the only ones to actually make the only form of radioactive kryptonite rock as we know it. The only way they will know if it works while reverse engineering different configurations of kryptonian tech with other elements is to test it on him unknowingly in public while monitoring him closely for any sign of decreased strength or other weaknesses. They set up elaborate traps that he feels are just unfortunate accidents and doesn't have a clue until the big confrontation. It doesn't take long for the kryptonite to be discovered and Lex/Bruce stash a large amount around the still rebuilding city and prepare to take Superman down. Lex wants to kill Superman but Bruce as we all know doesn't kill. Bruce's starts to become suspicious of Luthor but goes on with the plan anyways because the alien threat needs to be neutralized etc. Lex secretly develops a kryptonite suite to kill Supes for he personally wants Supes to feel the horror he feels of being a human among a God (of course Lex has other plans also...he built a small army of krptonite robots to further his secret agenda of world domination etc.) while Bruce secretly develops a bat-version as a backup plan in case they miscalculated and he doesn't go down like they plan (no-killing on batman's part). Lex and Bruce (Lex has alot of man power and resources) stir up a ruckus down town in the kryptonite prone area that Superman can't ignore and will have to be around for a long time to settle. Superman notices the effects to himself and he then remembers that he felt it on a minor level before over the past months (Lex and Bruce tests which he foolishly overlooked and blamed on his efforts to save lives in the accidents) but by now it is too late and he collapses on the streets after a while with the help of a small kryptonite missile. Lex and Bruce agreed that after he weakens, they will lock him up but Lex seeing his chance then puts on his suit and reveals to Wayne his own agenda. To protect his secret identity Bruce doesn't stop Luthor. With Lex already on his way to Superman, Bruce suites up (kryptonite suite) and kicks Luthor's a** with a weakening Superman watching from a distance. He then confronts Superman and we then have the clash of ideals with Superman trying to convince this paranoid Batman that they fight for the same things despite their differences and methods. Of course things become heated and they go at it. Even in his weakening state Supes is more than a match for Bats and kicks his a** (while telling him that he can crush him but he doesn't believe in killing etc.) until a frightened Bats stabs him with a sharpened Kryptonite rock. Bats then gets the upper hand and delivers a little pay back but surprisingly stops fighting and they continue to dialogue and argue verbally about other differences while moving out of the kryptonite area. Supes destroys all the remaining kryptonite and tells Batman to keep the one he stabbed him with as a sign that he can be trusted to cool his paranoia. Of course Bats heads back to meet Luthor to question him about the kryptonite suite and what else he planned to do but Luthor has already headed back to his secret Lexcorp base. The third act will then involve Lex summoning his army to take out Batman and Superman

That would work, it's sort of a draw. I like the idea about kryptonite being manufactured from salvaged kryptonian tech - but I reckon it will be by accident, rather than design.
I sort of see Luthor reverse-engineering some of the blasters or other weapons the kryptonians had (remember that shuttle is still there in the Arctic) and maybe he calls his new creation "kryptonite" like a brand name ( you know, like a .357 handgun is a "Magnum" or a .50 cal is a "desert eagle") sort of thing.
Either way, without an equalizer I can't see Supes and Bats going toe to toe being too much of a contest.

As far as folks who have suggested that kryptonite is some earth that was terraformed by the world engine.....maybe, but it would have to be a radioactive byproduct (which would make it harmful to humans too), because if you think about it for a minute, Zod was terraforming earth to make it more like Krypton, so he could re-establish his people. He wouldn't turn the world into something that would poison kryptonians (and Dr. Hamilton said that the new environment would pretty much wipe out humans). The reason the world engine was so dangerous to Supes was his difficulty dealing with krypton's atmosphere (having grown up on earth)
but I suppose eventually he would have got used to it.

So, all in all, if kryptonite was terraformed earth, it would have to be something that was made by accident, maybe when the world engine exploded, as Zod clearly wouldn't change regular earth into something that would make our planet more difficult for him to colonize.

Anyway, I'm with you on Luthor creating kryptonite, but the buildings laced with kryptonite reminds me a bit of the kryptonite continent in Superman returns.....ugh ! least favourite Superman film (yes, I said it,
I'd rather watch Superman IV: the quest for peace).

So again, your conflict sort of has Supes come out on top, then Batman, then a team up. Works for me ! Did I get that right ? Cool.

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Old 09-13-2013, 06:53 AM   #73
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Default Re: Win, Lose or Draw ! If BM vs SM involves a smackdown, who comes out on top ?

I can't believe no one has posted this yet, so I better

This is for all those bat-maniacs out there, who despite Angry Joe and
all the Super-fans, insist that Batman would come out on top,
especially those that predict Batman winning a non-physical confrontation
where he overcomes Supes with his wits.......

Sorry, I should have said SPOILER ALERT. Anyway, have a laugh people !


VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B96ctffVp8">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B96ctffVp8" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="425" height="350">

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