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Old 09-19-2013, 11:28 PM   #76
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Default Re: Established Catwoman in this movie ?

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Wow, no Alfred?
Like I said MAYBE one or two. Alfred is possible if there's gonna be any at all.

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Old 09-19-2013, 11:31 PM   #77
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The contrast between Madison and Lane would be interesting as well.

And it would be fitting to have both Clark and Bruce's initial love interests featured in the first Superman/Batman crossover film.
Interesting that Madison comes so close to rivaling Lane as a female love interest who appears at the beginning of a comic book, yet Madison was largely forgotten, with Madison being moved aside and replaced by others, while Lois is always there.

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Old 09-19-2013, 11:39 PM   #78
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I think on Earth 2 he was married to Selina and had a daughter with her there.
That was also where we first got Clark and Lois married, by about 17 years, right?

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Old 09-20-2013, 01:06 AM   #79
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I have long understood the "Appeal" of their relationship.

I still find it mind numbingly overrated and there are other Bat related relationships I find more interesting.

And as far as I'm concerned, the BR Bruce/Selina relationship worked mainly because of the actors playing them. From a story standpoint, Selina ended up being as wrong for Bruce as Vicki was. I'll just leave it at that because I really don't want to get into a long winded debate about it.
If you mean his relationships, in whatever forms, with other male characters? Sure. The bromance between Bruce and Alfred. The parentalistic relationships with the various Robins. His relationship with Alfred. And of course the ones he has with certain villains: namely Two-Face, Ra's Al Ghul and most especially the Joker.

However love interests? Only TAS did a good job with the (admittedly creepy concept) of Barbara Gordon being a different take. But Vicky Vale, Julie Madison, Rachel Dawes and Silver St. Cloud, among others, are as dull as wallpaper. That is why no one ever remembers their names like Lois Lane, Gwen Stacy, Mary Jane Watson, etc.

But Selina Kyle? That one sticks for a reason.

With that said, I agree the character should be given a rest before used again.

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Old 09-20-2013, 01:43 AM   #80
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Plus, if you want to help avoid confusing people that this is not the same batman from the Nolan series, then it'd be best to not bring in Catwoman considering that the last time we saw Nolan's Bruce, he was living happily ever after with her.

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Old 09-20-2013, 07:39 AM   #81
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It's not like if people will say "hey look who is that girl dressed as a cat" and she doesn't belong to anybody.

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Old 09-20-2013, 07:47 AM   #82
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Default Re: Established Catwoman in this movie ?

Alright.


Alice Eve as either Vicki Vale or Julie Madison?

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Old 09-20-2013, 08:54 AM   #83
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Default Re: Established Catwoman in this movie ?

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Plus, if you want to help avoid confusing people that this is not the same batman from the Nolan series, then it'd be best to not bring in Catwoman considering that the last time we saw Nolan's Bruce, he was living happily ever after with her.
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if they made it approximately consistent with TDKR, in the same way that SR is approximately consistent with SII.

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Old 09-20-2013, 09:00 AM   #84
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They want someone for action i think Catwoman fit the bill.

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Old 09-20-2013, 11:06 AM   #85
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The audience isn't stupid enough to make the leap from "Catwoman is in this movie" to "this is a sequel to TDKR." This is especially true if Hathaway doesn't play her.

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Old 09-20-2013, 11:07 AM   #86
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But Selina Kyle? That one sticks for a reason.
Yes, because above all else, she is one of Batman's most well known, enduring, and popular adversaries, a female empowerment icon as well as a sex icon.

Catwoman's popular because of factors independent of her romance with Batman, though that also plays a role in her appeal. All those girls you listed were simply love interests, nothing more. Catwoman has many facets to her that appeal to people. As a character in her own right, Selina Kyle is great. As Batman's Love interest? Overrated.

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Old 09-20-2013, 11:10 AM   #87
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No, it's really not.

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Old 09-20-2013, 11:18 AM   #88
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The audience isn't stupid enough to make the leap from "Catwoman is in this movie" to "this is a sequel to TDKR." This is especially true if Hathaway doesn't play her.
Exactly people are not dumb.

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Old 09-20-2013, 08:29 PM   #89
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Like I said MAYBE one or two. Alfred is possible if there's gonna be any at all.
Oh, okay.

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Old 09-20-2013, 10:44 PM   #90
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The audience isn't stupid enough to make the leap from "Catwoman is in this movie" to "this is a sequel to TDKR." This is especially true if Hathaway doesn't play her.
I remember one of the people I watched "Batman Begins" with was all like "wait, in the other Batman movie was' the girl he was interested named Vicki, how does this work as a prequel."

We could have Barbara Gordon as the Police Commissioner of Gotham City and very much Batman's love interest, go as far as to suggest he started as Batman to get closer to her, and people would still think this was a sequel to "The Dark Knight Rises".

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Old 09-20-2013, 10:47 PM   #91
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Yes, because above all else, she is one of Batman's most well known, enduring, and popular adversaries, a female empowerment icon as well as a sex icon.

Catwoman's popular because of factors independent of her romance with Batman, though that also plays a role in her appeal. All those girls you listed were simply love interests, nothing more. Catwoman has many facets to her that appeal to people. As a character in her own right, Selina Kyle is great. As Batman's Love interest? Overrated.
Actually, Vale at least originally was much more annoying reporter intent on exposing Batman than love interest. She mainly suffers because she is totally a rip-off of Lois.

Madison I think is the type of character who could be really well developed if they wanted to, but with Clark Kent/Lois Lane already slated to have a major role here, I am not sure they have space to go that route.

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Old 09-21-2013, 12:31 AM   #92
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The audience isn't stupid enough to make the leap from "Catwoman is in this movie" to "this is a sequel to TDKR." This is especially true if Hathaway doesn't play her.
I don't think its stupidity . Its just that the GA doesn't follow each press release and making of specials like the fanboys do.

Heck , even David Letterman asked Levitt why he wasn't playing Batman in the new movie and Levitt had to explain to him that the Nolan films were over and that this film is a new continuity. Most people are like David Letterman in that sense when it comes to films in general. They aren't as invested as the fans are at finding out every little detail in the development of a film. That said, I can agree that not everyone will make that leap and you'll odviously have those people who know this film is a new thing.

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Old 09-21-2013, 12:59 AM   #93
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Yes, because above all else, she is one of Batman's most well known, enduring, and popular adversaries, a female empowerment icon as well as a sex icon.

Catwoman's popular because of factors independent of her romance with Batman, though that also plays a role in her appeal. All those girls you listed were simply love interests, nothing more. Catwoman has many facets to her that appeal to people. As a character in her own right, Selina Kyle is great. As Batman's Love interest? Overrated.
Agreed that she is more interesting. But she is more interesting with Bruce, because he is not normal. He is rather unhinged. Thus his very "Double Indemnity" like attraction to a femme fatale makes sense its own whacky sort of way. Again, Lois Lane and Mary Jane are love interests. There is a reason they stick out in the mind, same with Selina Kyle. She is an icon, but she became it because of how she was introduced as neither real villain or damsel for Batman. She is something more off-center, much like the Bat. It is why she will always stand out above any other in any interpretation of the character. Be it Nolan, Burton, TAS, Arkham video games, or the like. It always goes back to that.

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Old 09-21-2013, 01:15 AM   #94
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I agree with The Batman that Catwoman is overrated as a love interest. Too many people treat her as if she is the end-all-be-all love interest to Batman in the same way Lois Lane is to Superman and Mary Jane is to Spider-Man. The reality is that Batman does not have a consistent love interest like most other major superheroes do and there are just as many love interests of his that are as interesting as Catwoman (or even more) that often get pushed to the side. In my personal opinion, Talia and Silver St. Cloud were both better love interests than her that don't get a chance to shine anywhere as much .

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Old 09-21-2013, 01:31 AM   #95
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I will agree that he isn't as inherently romantic a character as Peter Parker or Clark Kent. He is too driven and obsessed with his "career," shall we say. That is why someone who also is not quite ready to settle down fits his lifestyle.

As I said, his relationships with characters like Gordon, the Robins and even the Joker are perhaps stronger in their own varying ways. However, Kyle is far more interesting than the damsels in distress, which even Talia is in her own way (Bruce needs to "rescue" her from her father). Forget Nolan and Burton. Look at any variation on the character.

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Old 09-22-2013, 05:31 PM   #96
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I agree with The Batman that Catwoman is overrated as a love interest. Too many people treat her as if she is the end-all-be-all love interest to Batman in the same way Lois Lane is to Superman and Mary Jane is to Spider-Man. The reality is that Batman does not have a consistent love interest like most other major superheroes do and there are just as many love interests of his that are as interesting as Catwoman (or even more) that often get pushed to the side. In my personal opinion, Talia and Silver St. Cloud were both better love interests than her that don't get a chance to shine anywhere as much .
You summed up exactly why I find their relationship so overrated. People love overstating the romantic aspect of Selina and Bruce, when both characters have much better romantic relationships with others. I recently read the first two vols of Ed Brubaker's Catwoman run, and I find that Slam Bradley makes for a much interesting Selina love interest than Bruce does.

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Old 09-22-2013, 05:46 PM   #97
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Catwoman and Batman could've a love-hate relationship.

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Old 09-23-2013, 01:09 AM   #98
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I will agree that he isn't as inherently romantic a character as Peter Parker or Clark Kent. He is too driven and obsessed with his "career," shall we say. That is why someone who also is not quite ready to settle down fits his lifestyle.

As I said, his relationships with characters like Gordon, the Robins and even the Joker are perhaps stronger in their own varying ways. However, Kyle is far more interesting than the damsels in distress, which even Talia is in her own way (Bruce needs to "rescue" her from her father). Forget Nolan and Burton. Look at any variation on the character.
He's much closer to James Bond than Peter Parker and Clark imo. Even then, Bond has had two great loves , Tracy and Vesper. He also doesn't mind having a good time with the ladies, where as with Bruce, its used mainly as an act.

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Old 09-23-2013, 09:35 AM   #99
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True. But the ones he falls for, Tracy and especially Vesper, tend to be "broken" (at least for him) and have a dark edge to them. A straight up femme fatale in Vesper's case.

I do not think I am overstating it. Bruce Wayne will never settle down in his comic book form. His dysfunctional nature will always ensure that. That does not change that the only woman he has interesting chemistry with is Selina Kyle. The rest are just generic archetypes he kills time with.

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Old 09-23-2013, 09:45 AM   #100
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Bruce likes a woman that he can relate to, like Bond.

Messed up

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