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Old 10-03-2013, 08:37 AM   #1
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Default What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Ok, so we know about that infamous quote and antagonistic encounter/fight between Superman and Batman etc

What other stuff could we see potentially carry over? Either thematically, plot-wise, symbolically etc etc

For example, could we see Batman drive a tank? Could we also see him in that armor? Could we see the media and news-people as seen in the animated movie/comic?

You get the idea.

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Old 10-03-2013, 08:44 AM   #2
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Well. There's a few key elements that I expect to be used:


1) Batman will be a veteran, having already been Batman for a some time.

2) Batman will be a wanted vigilante.

And

3) Superman will have aligned himself with the government.

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Old 10-03-2013, 09:33 AM   #3
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

David Endocrine

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In other news, Bryan Cranston is playing Lex Luthor, Emily Blunt is Wonder Woman, Benedict Cumberbatch is Martian Manhunter, and that guy from Teen Wolf is Batman.
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Old 10-03-2013, 10:23 AM   #4
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Superman's not going to be anything like Frank Miller's version. He wont be working with the government like that.

As for the tank? The tumbler was pretty much Nolan's nod to that tank. Ill say that Affleck's Batman will drive a more traditional batmobile.

I don't think anything will be carried over from TDKReturns other than Batman being older (in his 40s instead of his 50s though) and the potential fight with Superman.

Everything else will be a new story. A good chunk of Returns was used in The Dark Knight Rises so it wouldn't be wise to use too much other than the final act with Superman.

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Old 10-03-2013, 10:29 AM   #5
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Hopefully none as it is my most hated comic.

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Old 10-03-2013, 11:24 AM   #6
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Your most hated comic? It's controversial, especially if you're a Superman fan, but it's a great story.

I hope they take more inspiration from Hush and TLH for Batman

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Old 10-03-2013, 11:50 AM   #7
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Batman on a mother****in' horse.


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Old 10-03-2013, 12:01 PM   #8
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Old 10-03-2013, 12:11 PM   #9
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Hopefully none as it is my most hated comic.
I have to agree I am not a Miller fan sorry

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Your most hated comic? It's controversial, especially if you're a Superman fan, but it's a great story.

I hope they take more inspiration from Hush and TLH for Batman
THIS

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Old 10-03-2013, 12:45 PM   #10
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Batman on a mother****in' horse.

I always liked how Batman looked on a dark horse. A proper black knight.

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Old 10-03-2013, 01:36 PM   #11
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Your most hated comic? It's controversial, especially if you're a Superman fan, but it's a great story.

I hope they take more inspiration from Hush and TLH for Batman
Hush is overrated and Long Halloween has been done enough with TDK.

They need to look to the stories that Nolan didn't touch. I don't mind the last part of Returns as long as it's just the Superman stuff, but they really need to move away from the Nolanverse. That's the whole point of rebooting an entire franchise, so you do something drastically different from what came before. Even down to its influences.

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Old 10-03-2013, 01:47 PM   #12
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Hopefully none as it is my most hated comic.
There are some comics I hate more, but yeah I agree Dark Knight Returns is utter garbage. From art to story to everything else. Garbage.

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Old 10-03-2013, 01:55 PM   #13
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Frank Miller's art is not garbage. It's stylized and you may not like it, but his art is not garbage.

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Old 10-03-2013, 03:03 PM   #14
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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There are some comics I hate more, but yeah I agree Dark Knight Returns is utter garbage. From art to story to everything else. Garbage.
How could one of the most influential, if not THE most influential Batman story to emerge since the 80's, which paved the way to so much...be "utter garbage"???

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Old 10-03-2013, 04:57 PM   #15
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Hush is overrated and Long Halloween has been done enough with TDK.

They need to look to the stories that Nolan didn't touch. I don't mind the last part of Returns as long as it's just the Superman stuff, but they really need to move away from the Nolanverse. That's the whole point of rebooting an entire franchise, so you do something drastically different from what came before. Even down to its influences.
They took some story elements from TLH sure, but the portrayal of Batman was pretty different. The Nolan Batman was too realistic. If they're going for a more comics oriented and less realistic Batman, the perfect place to start looking is Hush and TLH, same with Court of Owls.

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Old 10-03-2013, 05:07 PM   #16
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Originally Posted by shauner111 View Post
How could one of the most influential, if not THE most influential Batman story to emerge since the 80's, which paved the way to so much...be "utter garbage"???

Just to jump on the bandwagon....DKR is probably THE ultimate Batman
story. That was an amazing time in the world of comics, Moore's Watchmen and Miracleman, Miller's DKR and Elektra Assassin, were pushing the boundaries of the genre, they weren't just edgy, they were the edge.

If you take DKR and Batman Year One together you have the perfect bookends to Batman's story.

Having said all that I would like to see.....NONE OF DKR in the movie.

If the film is really a BM vs SM story, then it needs different source
material.

The Superman/Batman relationship in DKR is not a "first-time" meeting.
It's a huge philosophical divide, caused by decades of conflict over their
methods. It's a friendship soured with age and bitterness. That's what makes the final fist-fight so powerful....for all the Batfans, sorry, but Superman was holding back - he wasn't trying to kill Batman, or even hurt him (which is why Batman got broken ribs rather than splattered all over the street, or incinerated with heat vision)
Batman overcomes him with cunning (Batman's greatest weapon, which , as Superman in Grant Morrisons' JLA story, said makes him the most dangerous man on earth). Bats knew Superman wasn't going to
let loose at full force, he's predictable, which is what allowed him to
lure him into position for the kryptonite arrow. Yes, Batman won that one
, go Batman.

Of course, Bats never planned to kill Superman either -because Batman,
whenever possible, does not kill.

Having said all that, the fight is brutal and visceral, and something we hadn't seen before, way back in 1986. But, it works, and it works because of the characters' shared history.

In a movie where they meet for the first time, that fight scene just wouldn't work -without some pretty major changes, so much that it would be a different scene altogether.

I think much more appropriate source material for Supes and Bats first meeting would be some of John Byrne's work from around the same time
(the late 80's, Superman reboot).

Okay, maybe some stylistic elements from DKR could work in the BM/SM film, but story-wise.......probably not so much.


(yes, we're all thinking it, Batfleck doesn't look anything like Miller's Batman)

So..... no DKR story elements in BM/SM, maybe some style but no story please.

peace.

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Old 10-03-2013, 05:11 PM   #17
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

I find TDKR haterz to be on this kind of plane.

*They don't like the Superman portrayal and his relationship to THIS Batman (understandable)
*They don't like its influence on later comics.
*They don't like the way Batman's portrayed (I like the book, and that's also understandable)
*They don't think it's well written (Okay, that I CAN'T understand)
*They don't like the art style or divergence from usual Batman incarnations (Frank draws in a blocky, but visually striking manner. The fight with the Mutants in the Tank stands out in my mind. As for the "it's different" thing, it was intended to be an Elseworlds.)

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Old 10-03-2013, 05:14 PM   #18
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

....and furthermore, DKR is Batman's story ! He owns it, and every panel he appears in. The book is worthy of a film all in its own right that only features a guest appearance by Superman (and like I went crazy on in the last post, is not appropriate for a first meeting film).

However, you might be on to something in terms of the gritty style that Miller used to portray Gotham - that could definitely work.

Miller's Batmobile: Batman needs a tank !

Miller's Batcopter: Batman needs a Russian gunship copter !

Miller's portrayal of Jim Gordon ......probably covered in the Nolanverse TDKR film. Sorry, but after Gary Oldman, there aren't many who could step into Gordon's shoes.

Miller's vision of a Gotham out of control, where crime is rampant.....could work.

Miller's Batman.....not sure if Batfleck could carry off the menace, the obsession, the physicality of the role (certainly not the physique, you'd
need Schwarzenegger for that !)

hey, but great idea for a thread. Peace.

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Old 10-03-2013, 07:00 PM   #19
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Originally Posted by shauner111 View Post
Hush is overrated and Long Halloween has been done enough with TDK.

They need to look to the stories that Nolan didn't touch. I don't mind the last part of Returns as long as it's just the Superman stuff, but they really need to move away from the Nolanverse. That's the whole point of rebooting an entire franchise, so you do something drastically different from what came before. Even down to its influences.
Absolutely. Batman has a plethora of stories under his belt that they could use.

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Frank Miller's art is not garbage. It's stylized and you may not like it, but his art is not garbage.
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Old 10-03-2013, 07:04 PM   #20
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Even his art in DKSA is a deliberate stylistic choice, I'll take it any day over the thousands of Jim Lee imitators.

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Old 10-03-2013, 07:47 PM   #21
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Old 10-03-2013, 08:33 PM   #22
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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....and furthermore, DKR is Batman's story ! He owns it, and every panel he appears in. The book is worthy of a film all in its own right that only features a guest appearance by Superman (and like I went crazy on in the last post, is not appropriate for a first meeting film).

However, you might be on to something in terms of the gritty style that Miller used to portray Gotham - that could definitely work.

Miller's Batmobile: Batman needs a tank !

Miller's Batcopter: Batman needs a Russian gunship copter !

Miller's portrayal of Jim Gordon ......probably covered in the Nolanverse TDKR film. Sorry, but after Gary Oldman, there aren't many who could step into Gordon's shoes.

Miller's vision of a Gotham out of control, where crime is rampant.....could work.

Miller's Batman.....not sure if Batfleck could carry off the menace, the obsession, the physicality of the role (certainly not the physique, you'd
need Schwarzenegger for that !)

hey, but great idea for a thread. Peace.
Miller's Gordon is next to nothing like Oldman's. This isn't a slight on Miller OR Oldman. Jim is generally depicted as a sympathetic and likeable ally to Batman, and not as much as the hard-boiled cynic from the Miller books.

I think Oldman NAILED the traditional versions of Modern Era Gordon. His version is completely different from Miller's, and I'm more then ok with that.

I think if he has a good voice and a nice costume, he COULD pull of Frank Miller's menace. But Frank's Batman is so scary and borderline psychotic that I think it's not the best route to go. Maybe leaning towards Miller, but not a complete TDKR envisioning, and TDKSA/AllStar should NOT be an influence at all.

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Old 10-03-2013, 08:58 PM   #23
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

Oldman in Batman Begins is the Gordon straight out of Year One.

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Old 10-03-2013, 08:59 PM   #24
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Superman's not going to be anything like Frank Miller's version. He wont be working with the government like that.
Now I'm not saying he'll be a complete government puppet like he was in that book (MOS proved that; "You're scared of me because you can't control me. You can't and you never will".), but after the events of MOS, and Supes's statement to Swanwick about getting Washington on his side (and the likelihood of public distrust in him after he leveled a city), I think he'll be doing all he can to earn good will.

A better example of how his relationship will be with the government is that in The New Frontier.

He's firmly on their side and helps how he can, but is in no way controlled by them.

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Yeah, I'm just worried that if Pan of Steel isn't widely accepted by the audience and critics, they might try to shoehorn Pinocchio into the sequel, and we all know how long Hollywood has been trying to do a 'Pan vs Pinocchio' team up movie.
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Old 10-03-2013, 09:29 PM   #25
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Default Re: What OTHER elements from The Dark Knight Returns could we see?

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Oldman in Batman Begins is the Gordon straight out of Year One.
He looks the part. I have both a copy of Begins and Year One at home, and I can tell you, they have different personalities.

BUT, I think Oldman's gonna be really tough to MATCH.

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