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View Poll Results: I feel that the ACA is...
a positive thing for the country 8 12.12%
mostly positive 13 19.70%
I am indifferent/neutral to it. 3 4.55%
mostly negative 13 19.70%
terrible 23 34.85%
I need to wait and see. 6 9.09%
Voters: 66. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-30-2013, 09:01 AM   #476
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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I just don't understand how he did this with a D congress, he should have went balls out and made healthcare free just like Canada. I think he was still under the position that the R's were going to come around eventually but look where that got everybody
Actual socialist health care wasn't going to pass at all. He couldn't even get the public option enacted due to Democratic opposition, what makes you think that universal health care was going to pass?

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Old 10-30-2013, 09:11 AM   #477
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

Clinton tried to get the public option enacted and it failed miserably. Obama knew they would have to get the corporations involved or nothing would ever get done.

THAT IS WHY THE INSURANCE COMPANIES HAD FINAL SAY OVER THE BILL BEFORE IT BECAME LAW!

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Old 10-30-2013, 10:34 AM   #478
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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the problem is... they use the dumb excuse of TAXES to pay for everything. If we were like Canada or France etc. etc. There would be a 33% sales tax (it has been calculated) and higher income tax and the idea of "cheap goods" in America would be gone forever!
33% Sales Tax and higher Income Tax? Yeah...forget about "cheaper US goods" - people wouldn't even be able to afford wipe their asses.

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Old 10-30-2013, 11:18 AM   #479
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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33% Sales Tax and higher Income Tax? Yeah...forget about "cheaper US goods" - people wouldn't even be able to afford wipe their asses.
I know. Because of the cost, I heard a Yale economic panel claim that if we were to adopt Canada's plan, it would require a 33% NAtional sales tax and an average increase in income tax of 7%.

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Old 10-30-2013, 11:38 AM   #480
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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Actual socialist health care wasn't going to pass at all. He couldn't even get the public option enacted due to Democratic opposition, what makes you think that universal health care was going to pass?
Figured Obama would just twist their arm and get it done if he really wanted it

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Old 10-30-2013, 11:56 AM   #481
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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Figured Obama would just twist their arm and get it done if he really wanted it
Again... the Insurance companies wouldn't let him

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Old 10-30-2013, 12:52 PM   #482
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

I still don't understand how the White House could have let this happen.

This is Obama's (rather subpar, if you ask me) legacy. It's his one big accomplishment.

Why did they contract a company that was actually fired by Canada for its inability to make a website on time?

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Old 10-30-2013, 01:03 PM   #483
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

Insurance companies are the HUGE problem, but they aren't the only ones who want to fight it to the death.



And for no good reason. At least the insurance companies are doing it for greed.

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Old 10-30-2013, 01:37 PM   #484
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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I still don't understand how the White House could have let this happen.

This is Obama's (rather subpar, if you ask me) legacy. It's his one big accomplishment.

Why did they contract a company that was actually fired by Canada for its inability to make a website on time?
Because that's our government.

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Old 10-30-2013, 02:40 PM   #485
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

So, the company behind the Obamacare website Donated heavily to Republicans...

http://www.buzzfeed.com/stevefriess/...ted-heavily-to

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Old 10-30-2013, 03:03 PM   #486
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

I usually don't go for conspiracy theories, but given how crappy the web site is... you start to wonder...

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Old 10-30-2013, 05:35 PM   #487
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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I usually don't go for conspiracy theories, but given how crappy the web site is... you start to wonder...
Honestly, if there's any evidence of conspiracy, it points to slush funding and is NOT in Obama's favor.

CGI is rocked with scandals very similar to this one, and their track record doesn't make sense - for one, they've made exceptionally stable and powerful systems - the NSA's PRISM system (the one that tracks countless phone, data, and email info from all over the world), but they've also made exceptionally bad systems under questionable circumstances, yet inexplicably, still made them a hell of a lot of money.

Granted, CGI is not the only company that worked on the ACA site, but of the 47 that have, CGI is the 3rd highest paid - their contract started at $94 billion. And that's $26 billion more than the 4th highest paid contract.

Not only that, but CGI is tied to Obama in various ways, including the vice president of the company being a friend of Michelle's, and one of Obama's top advisers, Valerie Jarrett, has a daughter married to the son of a Canadian liberal who (along with his own personal connections to the Obama administration) has dealings with CGI, the Canadian healthcare system as well as his own slush fund scandals...he came clean in the early 2000s by placing all the blame on his and his colleagues' staff ("we political leaders didn't know!" sound familiar?); the outcome of which saw tax payers loose millions of dollars, no convictions for anyone and, with a little back dealing, a nice career boost in the following elections.

So basically, we have an administration that pays top dollar for a no-bid contract with an IT company that not only has a history of slush fund scandals (ie: getting huge paying contracts thanks to political back room dealings, not to mention and doing an abysmal job, forcing more time and work, and therefore more money) but also not only has personal connections to aforementioned administration, but is also part of a political love triangle with the administration and prominent pro-socialist healthcare political group with their own slush fund scandals to speak of?

...and giving 5 grand to Romney's campaign is worthy of conspiracy? lol

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Old 10-30-2013, 08:01 PM   #488
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

Well, I was being factitious. Really, looking at it now, this isn't too surprising - if nonetheless very disappointing. You have a president who seems incredibly unaware of things going on around him (Benghazi, NSA tapping world leaders, etc) and a company with a piss poor reputation for making healthcare related websites.

You know, cronyism is one thing, but at least make sure your friends (or in this case their companies) can do the damn job.

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Old 10-31-2013, 01:24 AM   #489
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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Well, I was being factitious. Really, looking at it now, this isn't too surprising - if nonetheless very disappointing. You have a president who seems incredibly unaware of things going on around him (Benghazi, NSA tapping world leaders, etc) and a company with a piss poor reputation for making healthcare related websites.

You know, cronyism is one thing, but at least make sure your friends (or in this case their companies) can do the damn job.
You really believe that this president has no idea what is going on around him? I'll say he makes Dubya look like Charles Darwin, but he does know!

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Old 10-31-2013, 07:58 AM   #490
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

Oh My, NY has me upset now. This is what happens under 2 party rule, a lousy health freak mayor, and of course, having Obamacare.

http://benswann.com/latest-attack-on...#ixzz2jIph7SfD

NYC set to raise Smoking age to 21, $10.50 a pack for smokes.

As ABC News points out...


Quote:
''ABC News points out that “cigarette manufacturers have suggested young adult smokers may just turn to black-market merchants. And some smokers say it’s unfair and patronizing to tell people considered mature enough to vote and serve in the military that they’re not old enough to decide whether to smoke.”''
Use that black market. Go ahead. Stupid as hell Politicians.

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Old 10-31-2013, 08:53 AM   #491
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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Well, I was being factitious. Really, looking at it now, this isn't too surprising - if nonetheless very disappointing. You have a president who seems incredibly unaware of things going on around him (Benghazi, NSA tapping world leaders, etc) and a company with a piss poor reputation for making healthcare related websites.

You know, cronyism is one thing, but at least make sure your friends (or in this case their companies) can do the damn job.
The way I see it...the President is either aware of all these things happening and is lying to the people (and if so he should be impeached) or he's so completely incompetent that he deserves to be impeached so someone more qualified can take over the role.

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Old 10-31-2013, 09:35 AM   #492
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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Oh My, NY has me upset now. This is what happens under 2 party rule, a lousy health freak mayor, and of course, having Obamacare.

http://benswann.com/latest-attack-on...#ixzz2jIph7SfD

NYC set to raise Smoking age to 21, $10.50 a pack for smokes.

As ABC News points out...




Use that black market. Go ahead. Stupid as hell Politicians.
Yeah, if people are stupid enough to poison themselves, we should let them. I'm being serious by the way. As long as you keep that **** away from me you can throw yourself off a bridge for all I care.

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Old 10-31-2013, 09:37 AM   #493
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

I seriously don't get how it's legal to sell things that we know cause cancer.

And to compound the nonsense, we sell cigarettes that kill people left and right, but throw people in prison for smoking marijuana.

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Old 10-31-2013, 10:31 AM   #494
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

IT ALL COMES DOWN TO $$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

The drug cartels and the government can't profit from tobacco being illegal AS MUCH as they can mary jane, crack, heroin, coke etc. etc. That is why it's legal.

They make a lot more dough on THE EVIL VILE DIRTY DRUG WAR and they would on taxation. When that changes, drugs will be legal.

The only reason prohibition of alcohol stopped was because the government was losing money to THE MOB!

Historical fact!

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Old 10-31-2013, 10:54 AM   #495
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IT ALL COMES DOWN TO $$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

The drug cartels and the government can't profit from tobacco being illegal AS MUCH as they can mary jane, crack, heroin, coke etc. etc. That is why it's legal.

They make a lot more dough on THE EVIL VILE DIRTY DRUG WAR and they would on taxation. When that changes, drugs will be legal.

The only reason prohibition of alcohol stopped was because the government was losing money to THE MOB!

Historical fact!
That's actually true!

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Old 10-31-2013, 11:02 AM   #496
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The way I see it...the President is either aware of all these things happening and is lying to the people (and if so he should be impeached) or he's so completely incompetent that he deserves to be impeached so someone more qualified can take over the role.
I don’t think Obama is an idiot – well, I DO, but not in the sense of low intelligence. His “I didn’t know” line for every issue that comes his way is 100% garbage.

As the head of the executive branch; the leader of the world’s most powerful military and intelligence agencies, there is absolutely NO way he was uninformed of Fast and Furious, the events leading up to and surrounding Benghazi, nor the NSA spying charges (both US civilian and European allies). The NSA doesn’t just decide to spend money and resources spying on world leaders (not to mention risk the political fallout) without presidential approval, and they certainly don’t do it without giving status reports to the president – otherwise, what’s the point of keeping tabs on world leaders if the president has no clue what’s going on?

The thing is, his campaign has always been about GOVERNMENT “accountability”, not HIS accountability, so he can pass blame all he wants (or allow others to sacrifice themselves for it), because as long as SOMEONE is given to the mob, his “promise” of accountability remains “intact”. Unfortunately this constant excuse of being unaware/uninformed is a child’s lie and like a child’s lie, those who want to believe it out of love for that child/their own ignorance will quickly accept it, not because they actually believe it, but because they desperately WANT to. The amount of vitriol coming from democrats (his staff literally called republicans the “enemy of the United States” recently) over the past few years proves this – it’s almost cliché in its aggressiveness (you’re questioning/pointing out issues with the administration I want to ignore/explain away, so I’m going call you a racist, sexist, etc – whatever I can to make people not listen to you”).

The Healthcare act is supposed to be the figurehead of Obama’s legacy. Why on earth would he not be vigilant in keeping up with the status of the system – the very backbone of the ACA?

Every single decision and statement is calculated, a strategic play. Its true for every president, every politician, even if it means risking your most important plan… In my mind, he was well aware of the issues and new that it wasn’t going to work, but the drama of the government shutdown, coupled with utterly dropping the ball with the Syria debacle needed to be forgotten. Looking at his options, he knew that letting the healthcare site open with such glitches was the way to move people’s attention from those larger issues. This wasn’t him throwing his ACA under the bus, however, as he could (try to) twist the situation in a number of ways to save face:

1) “The site is unstable because SO MANY PEOPLE LOVE IT AND ARE TRYING TO GET ON” – this is marketing 101: tell people that your product is so great that its popularity will hinder your ability to get said product (selling out, site crashes, limited time offers, etc) is crude psychological marketing tactic to make people think it’s better than it is.
2) “This is just a minor problem, the republicans are just blowing it out of proportion to continue their insane crusade” – classic move: twist the story and point the finger at someone else.
3) “It’s someone else’s fault, and I will make sure it’s fixed, because I am the leader” – refusing to accept responsibility so that he can come across as the hero who saved the site

Obamacare is not going away and is an immensely hot topic, so he can use it however he wants to distract from other issues with his administration.

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Old 10-31-2013, 11:16 AM   #497
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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I seriously don't get how it's legal to sell things that we know cause cancer.

And to compound the nonsense, we sell cigarettes that kill people left and right, but throw people in prison for smoking marijuana.
Well, to be fair, there are SO many things that cause cancer and other illness that are still legal, criminalizing cigarettes would be a massive snow ball that I don't think anyone is fully prepared to handle. Where do you draw the line? Alcohol causes plenty of deadly diseases, and is a key factor in countless ruined lives with alcoholism, drunken rages, rape, drunk driving and other abhorrent crimes. While cigarettes may claim more lives directly (ie: user death), alcoholism affects far more lives in far more ways. How exactly could we say smoking is illegal because of cancer, but completely ignore the death and horrors brought about with alcohol?

There's also the personal freedoms aspect of it all as well.

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Old 10-31-2013, 11:33 AM   #498
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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Oh My, NY has me upset now. This is what happens under 2 party rule, a lousy health freak mayor, and of course, having Obamacare.

http://benswann.com/latest-attack-on...#ixzz2jIph7SfD

NYC set to raise Smoking age to 21, $10.50 a pack for smokes.

As ABC News points out...




Use that black market. Go ahead. Stupid as hell Politicians.
I have yet to see black market cigarettes. Probably just easier to buy the tobacco and roll your own.

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Old 10-31-2013, 02:18 PM   #499
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

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The way I see it...the President is either aware of all these things happening and is lying to the people (and if so he should be impeached) or he's so completely incompetent that he deserves to be impeached so someone more qualified can take over the role.
Unfortunately incompetence isn't grounds for impeachment.

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Old 10-31-2013, 02:19 PM   #500
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Default Re: Affordable Care Act: Real Reform or More Bureaucracy?

One can argue incompetence is a job requirement these days.

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