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Old 11-02-2013, 01:41 PM   #76
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

Maybe it's over the top, but I feel the same. After watching Iron Man 3, and reading that Thor 2 is basically the same, my interest for the rest of the Phase 2 Movies is waning fast. No one is asking for a Nolan treatment, just that the Movies get the balance right, just like the Phase 1 Movies did. Or like all the other Movies made by FOX and Sony at the moment. Wolverine seems to be the only Movie that got the balance right this year. It was character focused, but not void of humor. And the humor never went so far, that the Movie lost any dramatic weight.

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Old 11-02-2013, 01:45 PM   #77
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

I don't like that I still have 5 days to go until I get to see it.

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Old 11-02-2013, 01:48 PM   #78
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Originally Posted by Godzilla2000 View Post
This movie hasn't opened here in the U.S. yet but it seems the major complaint is the humor that is kind of flat. I was hoping for an epic experience but it seems like Disney/Marvel will be giving me another mediocre experience? I have to confess that what I'm reading in here does not instill me with confidence. I was a bit disappointed with Ironman 3 in that we did not see Ironman all that much in sort of the same way I was disappointed with Venom in Spidey 3. Would it really kill Disney/Marvel to make strictly serious, dramatic superhero movies that had a normal level of levity in them where you 100% believed everyone was in danger and that death of a character's physical body might be a permanent thing as well as not making characters out to be cheesy caricatures? It looks like I may be looking more forward to the second Hobbit movie and the powerful high stakes drama of the next X-Men movie. Disney/Marvel needs to stop smoking whatever happy weed they're smoking and get serious, start giving a picky moviegoer like me some high stakes drama or my interest will start waning for their product.
I wouldn't say the jokes themselves are flat, they're actually funny. The problem for me is that there is so much of it that it overshadows pretty much everything else.

I completely agree with your post though, especially the bolded part. There is no sense of things being at stake even though the villain wants to basically turn the whole universe dark. It's a huge danger, yet you never really feel that danger because everything is so "Disney-fied".

Regarding your worry about the hero not being there enough, I'd definitely say Thor has good screen time, no problem there.

It's still an enjoyable movie though, but that's pretty much it. I'll buy it whenever it comes out on Blu-Ray, and hopefully my mind will change. This film had so much potential.

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Old 11-02-2013, 01:49 PM   #79
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Maybe it's over the top, but I feel the same. After watching Iron Man 3, and reading that Thor 2 is basically the same, my interest for the rest of the Phase 2 Movies is waning fast. No one is asking for a Nolan treatment, just that the Movies get the balance right, just like the Phase 1 Movies did. Or like all the other Movies made by FOX and Sony at the moment. Wolverine seems to be the only Movie that got the balance right this year. It was character focused, but not void of humor. And the humor never went so far, that the Movie lost any dramatic weight.
Perfectly said!

Right now I'm extremely happy X-Men and Spider-Man aren't at Marvel Studios/Disney.

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Old 11-02-2013, 01:50 PM   #80
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Originally Posted by Nathan View Post
Maybe it's over the top, but I feel the same. After watching Iron Man 3, and reading that Thor 2 is basically the same, my interest for the rest of the Phase 2 Movies is waning fast. No one is asking for a Nolan treatment, just that the Movies get the balance right, just like the Phase 1 Movies did. Or like all the other Movies made by FOX and Sony at the moment. Wolverine seems to be the only Movie that got the balance right this year. It was character focused, but not void of humor. And the humor never went so far, that the Movie lost any dramatic weight.
We've been over this many times already on here. What you or I consider "balance" is extremely subjective.

Regardless Marvel's intentions CLEARLY are to have people walk in the theater, laugh and have some fun. That's their brand. It's obviously working. It just doesn't sit well with people who require more emotional weight to their films. That's a personal preference.


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Old 11-02-2013, 01:57 PM   #81
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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We've been over this many times already on here. What you or I consider "balance" is extremely objective.

Regardless Marvel's intentions CLEARLY are to have people walk in the theater, laugh and have some fun. That's their brand. It's obviously working. It just doesn't sit well with people who require more emotional weight to their films. That's a personal preference.
You mean subjective.

Yes, they've always had humour but the amount of it has increased since The Avengers and now seems to be the main focus. The only Phase I movie I see being similar in that regard is Iron Man 2, which is Marvel Studios' weakest film IMO. The other films had much more emotional weight to them than these Phase II films I think. So there's definitely been a noticeable change since The Avengers I'd say.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:03 PM   #82
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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You mean subjective.

Yes, they've always had humour but the amount of it has increased since The Avengers and now seems to be the main focus. The only Phase I movie I see being similar in that regard is Iron Man 2, which is Marvel Studios' weakest film IMO. The other films had much more emotional weight to them than these Phase II films I think. So there's definitely been a noticeable change since The Avengers I'd say.
Whoops ya .... subjective. LOL

Whedon's formula clearly has had an effect, it's just not your cup of tea. That's ok, it's not for everyone. However the proof is in the Box Office. That's all Marvel cares about. If there was backlash and people stopped going, demanding something different they would change ......... but that's not the case. The ones who want that are in the clear minority.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:05 PM   #83
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Originally Posted by Nathan View Post
Maybe it's over the top, but I feel the same. After watching Iron Man 3, and reading that Thor 2 is basically the same, my interest for the rest of the Phase 2 Movies is waning fast. No one is asking for a Nolan treatment, just that the Movies get the balance right, just like the Phase 1 Movies did. Or like all the other Movies made by FOX and Sony at the moment. Wolverine seems to be the only Movie that got the balance right this year. It was character focused, but not void of humor. And the humor never went so far, that the Movie lost any dramatic weight.
When will people start grasping the fundamental concepts of subjectivity and objectivity?

Even looking at majorities most people have liked it this far. You can hear both fans here say that they felt the balance was right, as has some professional reviewers stated just that. And on the other hand, you still had some people complaining about all the movies in phase one that they were too humorous (well, not TIH).

But no, I guess the people making movies that don't cater to your personal taste just does things wrong.


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Old 11-02-2013, 02:07 PM   #84
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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When will people start grasping the fundamental concepts of subjectivity and objectivity?
It'll never happen.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:07 PM   #85
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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When will people start grasping the fundamental concepts of subjectivity and objectivity?
What is wrong about that post in that regard?

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:09 PM   #86
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Whoops ya .... subjective. LOL

Whedon's formula clearly has had an effect, it's just not your cup of tea. That's ok, it's not for everyone. However the proof is in the Box Office. That's all Marvel cares about. If there was backlash and people stopped going, demanding something different they would change ......... but that's not the case. The ones who want that are in the clear minority.
Yeah, their films are definitely becoming more popular and I can see why, it's just like you said that it's really not the route I hoped they would take. I'd have preferred them to be more like the Phase I films, but bigger in scale. So it's not that I wanted something different than what they had before. But yeah, I know that I'm in the minority regarding that, so I guess I'll just drop my expectations for the MS films and look more forward to some X-Men and Spidey goodness.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:12 PM   #87
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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What is wrong about that post in that regard?
It, and the post it praises, talks about doing something "right" as if it was an objective truth. What's right is by definition subjective unless you start a discussion with exact parameters.

If someone would counter with the same attitude they would say that they watched the film wrong.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:15 PM   #88
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

For me, the balance of humour and seriousness in TDW was okay. Felt just right.

But nonetheless, I can understand what some of you mean. For example, Thor 1 was full of jokes, but there wasn't a single joke in Thor's final battle with Loki. It was meant to be dramatic and touching.

Yes, it would be nice to see such a thing again. But on the other hand, what they did in Avengers also works for me - big, spectacular final battle with a little bit of silliness.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:21 PM   #89
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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It, and the post it praises, talks about doing something "right" as if it was an objective truth. What's right is by definition subjective unless you start a discussion with exact parameters.

If someone would counter with the same attitude they would say that they watched the film wrong.
The post starts out talking about the poster's feelings. Is that not subjective?

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:23 PM   #90
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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The post starts out talking about the poster's feelings. Is that not subjective?
He says that he's losing interest because Marvel doesn't balance things right.

I guess this comes from me being mildly irritated quite often by people trying to justify their opinions that way. That's not the thing that should be discussed in this thread though so I'll leave it at what I've said. It covers everything anyway.


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Old 11-02-2013, 02:28 PM   #91
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Originally Posted by Mjölnir View Post
He says that he's losing interest because Marvel doesn't balance things right.

I guess this comes from me being mildly irritated quite often by people trying to justify their opinions that way. That's not the thing that should be discussed in this thread though so I'll leave it at what I've said. It covers everything anyway.
Which is Nathan's opinion on the subject imo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan View Post
Maybe it's over the top, but I feel the same. After watching Iron Man 3, and reading that Thor 2 is basically the same, my interest for the rest of the Phase 2 Movies is waning fast. No one is asking for a Nolan treatment, just that the Movies get the balance right, just like the Phase 1 Movies did. Or like all the other Movies made by FOX and Sony at the moment. Wolverine seems to be the only Movie that got the balance right this year. It was character focused, but not void of humor. And the humor never went so far, that the Movie lost any dramatic weight.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:33 PM   #92
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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He says that he's losing interest because Marvel doesn't balance things right.

I guess this comes from me being mildly irritated quite often by people trying to justify their opinions that way. That's not the thing that should be discussed in this thread though so I'll leave it at what I've said. It covers everything anyway.
I always assume that people speak of their opinion only, except when people actually call their own opinion fact, for example "This film is for fact a very bad one", or when someone says "No you're wrong, it is bad/good".

The absence of an "IMO" doesn't really mean much.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:53 PM   #93
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Which is Nathan's opinion on the subject imo.
I can't make that interpretation when I read the post he's referring to, but that's just how I see it.

I read the one again and I now feel that I was unfair to chose to quote Nathan as the example for what I wrote. The other post is much worse.

And now I went back on what I said I was going to do. Shame on me.

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:57 PM   #94
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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I can't make that interpretation when I read the post he's referring to, but that's just how I see it.

I read the one again and I now feel that I was unfair to chose to quote Nathan as the example for what I wrote. The other post is much worse.

And now I went back on what I said I was going to do. Shame on me.
That isn't objective!!

Just kidding with you!

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Yeah they should just cancel the films and not even bother and spend the budget on building a giant statue of toby macguire instead!
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:03 PM   #95
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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That isn't objective!!

Just kidding with you!

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Old 11-02-2013, 03:21 PM   #96
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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Disney/Marvel needs to stop smoking whatever happy weed they're smoking and get serious, start giving a picky moviegoer like me some high stakes drama or my interest will start waning for their product.
Thing is, that "happy weed" has brought them success on a level other studios are just dreaming of at the moment. When you are getting their critic scores and box office what would be the point in completely changing their films with heavier dramatic tones? The goal is to have that audience, critic and box office success. They got all that. Stakes are still there but maybe just not to everyones liking. Theres still plenty to dig. I like that all these films feel different yet we can buy they all take place in th same universe. Thats a huge accomplishment that only MS has done. Cap and Guardians really look and feel so different from eachother. I still can't believe we are even getting a GOTG movie, none the less a big budget one that is taking a risk on embracing the weird. I don't want that flick feeling like X-Men or ASM. The overly serious moments in those films have had there misses as well.

I think its awesome that all these studio films are giving us something different. If they all felt the same in tone people would be complaining even more. We got the variety to choose on our own preference now. Can't beat that. Honestly I think we are getting spoiled haha.


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Old 11-02-2013, 09:26 PM   #97
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

You know, when people complained about the marketing for IM 3, I defended it. However, TDW has made me reconsider. Marvel, if you want to make you're movies highly comedic (whether the Phase Two films are TOO comedic is open for debate), fine. However, if you're going to do that, then stop advertising your films in trailers/interviews/etc as being more epic and serious, it's getting annoying. The uber-serious trailers are not at all what these movies turn out to be. They've done it for BOTH IM 3 and TDW. If it happens again with TWS, its REALLY going to get old.

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Old 11-02-2013, 09:53 PM   #98
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

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You know, when people complained about the marketing for IM 3, I defended it. However, TDW has made me reconsider. Marvel, if you want to make you're movies highly comedic (whether the Phase Two films are TOO comedic is open for debate), fine. However, if you're going to do that, then stop advertising your films in trailers/interviews/etc as being more epic and serious, it's getting annoying. The uber-serious trailers are not at all what these movies turn out to be. They've done it for BOTH IM 3 and TDW. If it happens again with TWS, its REALLY going to get old.
Uber serious? What trailers and featurettes have you been watching for T:TDW?

- The "anyone else?" line he gives the stone guy from Saturn
- Darcy's "Look at you, still all muscley and everything"
- Jane slapping Loki for New York
- Loki and Thor bickering while Thor flies one of the Dark Elves' ships

There has definitely been comedic splices. What's really naive is that you're expecting Marvel to deviate from their brand, no matter what the trailer's tone is.

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Old 11-02-2013, 10:35 PM   #99
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

I'm sure no one expected Marvel to deviate from their brand. After the Phase 1 Movies, everyone had a good idea what the tone of their Movies was like. But with Phase 2, they clearly shifted towards even more humor.

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Old 11-02-2013, 11:12 PM   #100
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Default Re: What didn't you like about T:TDW?

Lets see, the creepy narration from both Malekith and Odin, all the freaky imagery, the epic yet ominous music, etc. Yeah, this movie wasn't that. I have no problem with comedy, they struck a great balance in their Phase One movies. In Phase Two, they're starting to overuse the comedy and it's intruding on the narrative and killing tension in scenes that should be serious.

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