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View Poll Results: Rate the Movie
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6 3 8.57%
5 1 2.86%
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Old 11-02-2013, 08:19 PM   #26
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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No reason? His mind was addled by Loki in the Avengers.


You guys are just trolls. DC fans trying to get a rise out of Marvel fans. Lame.
More proof that you don't read. I said I'm one of the few that fricking LOVED the first Thor. Captain America was amazing IMO. The Avengers, Iron Man 1, great movies. Batman Begins, great, TDK, great.TDKR, was alright. Man of Steel, I expected a lot better. Iron Man 3 was sh! T, 2 was better. Green Lantern, stupid.

Do Marvel fans lose all sense of objectivity ? When something is not to your liking can't you just say so without fearing the wrath of Marvel ?

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:20 PM   #27
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YES!! Except I don't think this is Loki's story. I think it's more of an ensemble if that makes sense.
It's the continuing push and pull of Loki and Thor's relationship. That's really the film.

 
Old 11-02-2013, 08:26 PM   #28
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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More proof that you don't read. I said I'm one of the few that fricking LOVED the first Thor. Captain America was amazing IMO. The Avengers, Iron Man 1, great movies. Batman Begins, great, TDK, great.TDKR, was alright. Man of Steel, I expected a lot better. Iron Man 3 was sh! T, 2 was better. Green Lantern, stupid.

Do Marvel fans lose all sense of objectivity ? When something is not to your liking can't you just say so without fearing the wrath of Marvel ?

Why do you need to justify that you loved some MCU films in order not be called a Dc troll? Just wondering..........

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:27 PM   #29
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

the interactions between thor and loki have been outstanding in the MCU thus far, and is something almost everyone appreciates, whether fan or not
cant fault marvel for making that the highlight of this movie

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:28 PM   #30
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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More proof that you don't read. I said I'm one of the few that fricking LOVED the first Thor. Captain America was amazing IMO. The Avengers, Iron Man 1, great movies. Batman Begins, great, TDK, great.TDKR, was alright. Man of Steel, I expected a lot better. Iron Man 3 was sh! T, 2 was better. Green Lantern, stupid.

Do Marvel fans lose all sense of objectivity ? When something is not to your liking can't you just say so without fearing the wrath of Marvel ?
Feel free to talk about something else. I have a feeling you're just going to fixate on the humor and spout off more of your superior attitude. Cool have fun with that.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:29 PM   #31
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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Anyway, since you don't want to talk about the humour in the film, I'll bring up something else from my review.

1) I knew that Loki's betrayal of Thor was an act on the spot, and I don't normally catch plot twists that well. Is that not bad?
2) How does crazy scientist streaking naked outside stonehenge advance the plot? Let's leave aside the question of whether or not it's funny.
3) At the end of the movie, we learn that Thor's father Odin is missing, and I have no idea what happened. It's effectively an after-the-credits scene done before the credits, for a total of three after-the-credits scene... can Marvel please take a break and focus on telling one story at a time? There was a huge focus on mythology building in this movie, to benefit other movies, but what about benefiting this movie? Why not have more dialogue among the dark elves?
1. It wasn't for me since I don't know if Loki betraying Thor is much of a plot twist. That's what Loki does. The thing is how and when is he going to do it, and what will come of it? I find it's about the journey, just as it is with that the hero generally always wins at the end.

2. It establishes that Selvig has gone crazy. I don't know if every scene has to advance the plot though. The funeral didn't further the plot, but it's a scene I definitely want to see because it of course brings a lot of other things.

3. I think the story of this movie was already over so it's just setting up a cliffhanger. I see nothing wrong with that as it doesn't break anything nor have any character act against who he is. As for the dark elves I certainly wouldn't have minded more with them. I'm very interested in seeing the cut scene where Bor kills Malekith's family, for example. I still think they worked though, kind of like Vader and the Empire in A New Hope, but more could have been even better.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:32 PM   #32
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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It's the continuing push and pull of Loki and Thor's relationship. That's really the film.
IDA with that. Yes, it's in there and is a factor towards the last part but until
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
the break in of Malekith, Thor didn't even think of Loki. He was going through the motions of securing the realm and moping about Jane. He and Loki hadn't even seen each other since he delivered him to Odin. Honestly, I don't know that there is a central "theme" to this movie which could be one of the problems. Once they left Asgard, they got their talk but to me it fell flat. Loki is jealous of Thor blah blah blah. We know that already. Even Loki's sacrifice wasn't deep. I knew before the movie got going he would do anything to keep Thor off the throne if given the opportunity.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:35 PM   #33
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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2) How does crazy scientist streaking naked outside stonehenge advance the plot? Let's leave aside the question of whether or not it's funny.
It doesn't, but it advances the character. It is called character progression. We know Selvig from 2 movies now, in the last one he was taken over by Loki against his will. Now we learn of the outcome of this, just like Tony's PTSD, Selvig is not untouched by the events of TA. He had a god in his head and has to deal with it. You can't do that with Thor really, showing how big an event TA for the characters was, because out of all Avengers, the alien invasion wasn't a big game changer for him. For Selvig it was. Thor has to deal with his brother and what Loki did, but for Selvig it was a bit more. Being possesed by a god should be adressed.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:35 PM   #34
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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1. It wasn't for me since I don't know if Loki betraying Thor is much of a plot twist. That's what Loki does. The thing is how and when is he going to do it, and what will come of it? I find it's about the journey, just as it is with that the hero generally always wins at the end.

2. It establishes that Selvig has gone crazy. I don't know if every scene has to advance the plot though. The funeral didn't further the plot, but it's a scene I definitely want to see because it of course brings a lot of other things.

3. I think the story of this movie was already over so it's just setting up a cliffhanger. I see nothing wrong with that as it doesn't break anything nor have any character act against who he is. As for the dark elves I certainly wouldn't have minded more with them. I'm very interested in seeing the cut scene where Bor kills Malekith's family, for example. I still think they worked though, kind of like Vader and the Empire in A New Hope, but more could have been even better.
I think Loki betraying then not betraying Thor was supposed to be a plot twist, maybe when you watch it again you can make a note of what sound effects they use, is it dark and ominous? If so it means we're supposed to believe that Loki is backstabbing Thor. Either way, my immediate reaction was "Loki's not really backstabbing Thor".

I thought the funeral scene advanced the plot very much. It set up that we had the death of a very important character (not just in the abstract as in "she's Thor's mother"), the other tombs demonstrated that there were a lot of casualties. It builds tension as now we know that war is coming, it's like when Achilles has a funeral for his cousin in Troy. The funeral scene built up the world of Asgaard, it set up their culture. It's world building. You need to build a sense of place, and the funeral scene did so. In contrast, whereas Asgaard is a primary setting, Selvig is a tertiary character. He doesn't need to be built up, I'm pretty sure that he, Darcy's graduate student, and Jane's failed love interest could all be removed from this film.

I agree I'd be interested in seeing a director's cut of Thor 2. It might be a much better movie.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:40 PM   #35
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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It doesn't, but it advances the character. It is called character progression. We know Selvig from 2 movies now, in the last one he was taken over by Loki against his will. Now we learn of the outcome of this, just like Tony's PTSD, Selvig is not untouched by the events of TA. He had a god in his head and has to deal with it. You can't do that with Thor really, showing how big an event TA for the characters was, because out of all Avengers, the alien invasion wasn't a big game changer for him. For Selvig it was. Thor has to deal with his brother and what Loki did, but for Selvig it was a bit more. Being possesed by a god should be adressed.

Selvig has no use in this film other than some scientific McGuffin at the end.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:41 PM   #36
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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Why do you need to justify that you loved some MCU films in order not be called a Dc troll? Just wondering..........
I'm not a troll of any kind. Why is anyone that has fair criticism of a work of fiction automatically a troll ? If a movie is good to me, it's good to me. Nothing more to it really.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:41 PM   #37
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

Regarding Selvig, has anyone thought

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
He was more affected by it than Clint because Loki was influencing him (end credits of Thor) way before he actually got control of them both with the Tesseract in TA? It gives Barton a pass for PTSD, that's for sure. I may be in the minority but I loved Selvig's nuttiness in this film.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:41 PM   #38
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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It doesn't, but it advances the character. It is called character progression. We know Selvig from 2 movies now, in the last one he was taken over by Loki against his will. Now we learn of the outcome of this, just like Tony's PTSD, Selvig is not untouched by the events of TA. He had a god in his head and has to deal with it. You can't do that with Thor really, showing how big an event TA for the characters was, because out of all Avengers, the alien invasion wasn't a big game changer for him. For Selvig it was. Thor has to deal with his brother and what Loki did, but for Selvig it was a bit more. Being possesed by a god should be adressed.
I saw The Avengers twice and I have no recollection of Selvig's involvement in that movie. I don't think it's a good idea to put aside the story of Thor 2 for several minutes to bring up a plot point involving a tertiary character from The Avengers. Ideally Thor 2 should be focused on the story of Thor 2.

For this scene to work, you're expecting people to remember the fine details of a movie that came out over two years ago, and even then it's not a good idea as it builds up The Avengers movie and not Thor 2. Contrast this to TDKR when they talk about the effects of The Dent Act. It does build up TDK, but it is explicitly relevant to the plot of TDKR.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:43 PM   #39
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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I'm not a troll of any kind. Why is anyone that has fair criticism of a work of fiction automatically a troll ? If a movie is good to me, it's good to me. Nothing more to it really.
I never said you were.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:46 PM   #40
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I saw The Avengers twice and I have no recollection of Selvig's involvement in that movie. I don't think it's a good idea to put aside the story of Thor 2 for several minutes to bring up a plot point involving a tertiary character from The Avengers. Ideally Thor 2 should be focused on the story of Thor 2.

For this scene to work, you're expecting people to remember the fine details of a movie that came out over two years ago, and even then it's not a good idea as it builds up The Avengers movie and not Thor 2. Contrast this to TDKR when they talk about the effects of The Dent Act. It does build up TDK, but it is explicitly relevant to the plot of TDKR.
Are you for real? He was a huge part in getting done what Loki needed to get the portal open. Seriously? There is no fine details needing to be remembered. Selvig was working with SHIELD and Loki took his and Clint Barton's minds at the same time. That was pretty damn important to the story in TA.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:47 PM   #41
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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I saw The Avengers twice and I have no recollection of Selvig's involvement in that movie.
What?? He was one of Loki's henchmen. He built the machine that allowed the Tesseract to open the portal. Were you drunk when you watched it?

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:48 PM   #42
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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Are you for real? He was a huge part in getting done what Loki needed to get the portal open. Seriously? There is no fine details needing to be remembered. Selvig was working with SHIELD and Loki took his and Clint Barton's minds at the same time. That was pretty damn important to the story in TA.
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What?? He was one of Loki's henchmen. He built the machine that allowed the Tesseract to open the portal. Were you drunk when you watched it?
I have only watched the avengers twice, and I was not overly captivated by it the second time (first time was good) so it's normal I forget minor plot details.

I remember that Loki took control of Hawkguy's mind and two other characters. I might have remembered Selvig being there if I had recognised Selvig, but I didn't since I saw Thor 1 after watching the avengers, several months later, so he was just another extra to me.

If you need fine memory of the plot of the avengers to get a scene in Thor 2, then that's really bad.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:48 PM   #43
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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I never said you were.
I said he was a troll because he was fixated on one thing and was insulting anyone who argued with him.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:49 PM   #44
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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I think Loki betraying then not betraying Thor was supposed to be a plot twist, maybe when you watch it again you can make a note of what sound effects they use, is it dark and ominous? If so it means we're supposed to believe that Loki is backstabbing Thor. Either way, my immediate reaction was "Loki's not really backstabbing Thor".

I thought the funeral scene advanced the plot very much. It set up that we had the death of a very important character (not just in the abstract as in "she's Thor's mother"), the other tombs demonstrated that there were a lot of casualties. It builds tension as now we know that war is coming, it's like when Achilles has a funeral for his cousin in Troy. The funeral scene built up the world of Asgaard, it set up their culture. It's world building. You need to build a sense of place, and the funeral scene did so. In contrast, whereas Asgaard is a primary setting, Selvig is a tertiary character. He doesn't need to be built up, I'm pretty sure that he, Darcy's graduate student, and Jane's failed love interest could all be removed from this film.

I agree I'd be interested in seeing a director's cut of Thor 2. It might be a much better movie.
I was thinking about other stuff while writing so I kind if answered something else than you asked about, sorry about that. I also felt that it was clear that he wasn't actually betraying Thor. For my part I guess the movie didn't even have a chance since people have discussed what might happen ever since some shots from that were released in promos. I didn't find the scene bad for it, but if there was a way to fool me first that's of course optimal. I don't know how that would be done as it's obvious that Loki truly wants revenge, but there might be some way.

I don't think it advances the plot (it's in the same place before and after) but the rest we agree on as that's what I was referring to. It enhances many themes and emotions, and it shows that Asgard was really hurt by the attack. That's why I said that I don't feel a scene needs to advance the plot as there's more things that needs to be done in a movie. As for Selvig he's been a larger character than Frigga in the MCU. He's been in three movies. I'd remove Darcy before him.

Yes, it's a shame that Marvel doesn't do extended cuts. Even if movies work as they are you can be sure that the fans would love to see a longer cut as well. It would basically be free money for them, and the fans might be happier. I guess it might be seen as lacking confidence in the original cut though.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:52 PM   #45
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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It doesn't, but it advances the character. It is called character progression. We know Selvig from 2 movies now, in the last one he was taken over by Loki against his will. Now we learn of the outcome of this, just like Tony's PTSD, Selvig is not untouched by the events of TA. He had a god in his head and has to deal with it. You can't do that with Thor really, showing how big an event TA for the characters was, because out of all Avengers, the alien invasion wasn't a big game changer for him. For Selvig it was. Thor has to deal with his brother and what Loki did, but for Selvig it was a bit more. Being possesed by a god should be adressed.
Yeah, and SHIELD should be the ones to adress it. After working wih them on the tesseract and losing his mind while on the clock they now just let him go crazy and naked at Stonehenge ?

That's how I want these things adressed, not played for laughs.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:54 PM   #46
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I have only watched the avengers twice, and I was not overly captivated by it the second time (first time was good) so it's normal I forget minor plot details.

I remember that Loki took control of Hawkguy's mind and two other characters. I might have remembered Selvig being there if I had recognised Selvig, but I didn't since I saw Thor 1 after watching the avengers, several months later, so he was just another extra to me.

If you need fine memory of the plot of the avengers to get a scene in Thor 2, then that's really bad.
But DA he was even in the finale with Natasha stopping the portal and in the end when Thor and Loki were leaving. Honestly I could forgive not knowing like...the waitress scene or even some details of the movie but Selvig wasn't a minor plot point in TA. He wasn't major but he wasn't in passing either. I can now see why his role is an issue for you but in all honestly that is your fault, not the average viewer. They'll remember his love for Thor and how Loki mind effed him.

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Old 11-02-2013, 08:56 PM   #47
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I was thinking about other stuff while writing so I kind if answered something else than you asked about, sorry about that. I also felt that it was clear that he wasn't actually betraying Thor. For my part I guess the movie didn't even have a chance since people have discussed what might happen ever since some shots from that were released in promos. I didn't find the scene bad for it, but if there was a way to fool me first that's of course optimal. I don't know how that would be done as it's obvious that Loki truly wants revenge, but there might be some way.
I made a conscious effort to avoid the spoilers and previews for this movie. As a general point I think the previews for some comic book movies are too spoilery, I can't speak for the thor 2 previews since I deliberately avoided most of them :-)

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I don't think it advances the plot (it's in the same place before and after) but the rest we agree on as that's what I was referring to. It enhances many themes and emotions, and it shows that Asgard was really hurt by the attack. That's why I said that I don't feel a scene needs to advance the plot as there's more things that needs to be done in a movie. As for Selvig he's been a larger character than Frigga in the MCU. He's been in three movies. I'd remove Darcy before him.
I think building up Asgard as a society and building a sense of place advances the plot. It helps immerse me (presumably others too) in the movie, in the world. Maybe I'm not using the word plot correctly, but for me proper world building is advancing the plot.

We can argue that maybe Selvig advances the plot of the MCU as a whole, but he doesn't advance the plot of Thor 2. IMO, the latter is more important.

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Old 11-02-2013, 09:00 PM   #48
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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But DA he was even in the finale with Natasha stopping the portal and in the end when Thor and Loki were leaving. Honestly I could forgive not knowing like...the waitress scene or even some details of the movie but Selvig wasn't a minor plot point in TA. He wasn't major but he wasn't in passing either. I can now see why his role is an issue for you but in all honestly that is your fault, not the average viewer. They'll remember his love for Thor and how Loki mind effed him.
I've seen Thor once, I've seen The Avengers twice, I have an above-average long-term memory, and I sporadically discuss these movies on forums, so I probably remember more plot details than the median viewer.

If the movie doesn't work for people who have not seen an MCU movie before never mind all the relevant MCU movies multiple times, then the movie doesn't work in my opinion. There are plenty of sequels out there that can be appreciated by someone who didn't see the original.

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Old 11-02-2013, 09:02 PM   #49
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Default Re: Fan Review Thread SPOILERS INSIDE - Part 1

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I've seen Thor once, I've seen The Avengers twice, I have an above-average long-term memory, and I sporadically discuss these movies on forums, so I probably remember more plot details than the median viewer.

If the movie doesn't work for people who have not seen an MCU movie before never mind all the relevant MCU movies multiple times, then the movie doesn't work in my opinion. There are plenty of sequels out there that can be appreciated by someone who didn't see the original.
Above average long term memory? You couldn't remember Selvig from the Avengers movie and he was a huge part of it.

The Dark Knight trilogy works better if you watch them all. There are things that happen (Rachel breaking up with Bruce and her death) that deeply affect the following movie.


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Old 11-02-2013, 09:03 PM   #50
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I dunno what the heck some people are on about the Eric naked scene. I thought it was hilarious.

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