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Old 07-05-2016, 11:53 PM   #51
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

The issue with Olly was that they didn't play him sympathetically enough to really make his betrayal tragic. It might have overall worked better if we saw him act more earnestly and enthusiastically towards Jon, except whenever the Wildlings are mentioned, and even then play up that he thinks Jon's got a trick up his sleeve or something. Then have him just get this absolutely crushed face when he realizes that Jon really is going to rescue them, maybe even crying a bit.

Then when he does the hesitation before the stab, it may feel more tragic as opposed to predictable.

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Old 07-06-2016, 12:05 AM   #52
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

I wonder if they burned olly's body.. otherwise hes going to be the *****iest wight ever

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Old 07-06-2016, 12:12 AM   #53
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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The issue with Olly was that they didn't play him sympathetically enough to really make his betrayal tragic. It might have overall worked better if we saw him act more earnestly and enthusiastically towards Jon, except whenever the Wildlings are mentioned, and even then play up that he thinks Jon's got a trick up his sleeve or something. Then have him just get this absolutely crushed face when he realizes that Jon really is going to rescue them, maybe even crying a bit.

Then when he does the hesitation before the stab, it may feel more tragic as opposed to predictable.
I wished they had him try to ask for forgiveness before Jon cuts the rope. It would have played better into the tragedy of the moment; the fact that it is a terrible thing to kill a child regardless of the circumstance, even in this world. Because I agree that while it wasn't unjust, a lot of the viewers' bloodlust toward him was disconcerting and probably not what the show makers intended.

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Old 07-06-2016, 12:29 AM   #54
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

The kid saw his parents butchered in front of him. That's gotta be traumatic. It was enough for me to understand his hatred.

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Old 07-06-2016, 10:49 AM   #55
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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I wonder if they burned olly's body.. otherwise hes going to be the *****iest wight ever
Don't you have to die beyond the wall to become a wight?

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Old 07-06-2016, 02:15 PM   #56
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

Olly was a little **** but I understood his anger. He was easy pickings for Thorne to manipulate.

I didn't find his death tragic but I certainly found it uncomfortable viewing purely for the fact he was a kid. But I liked how Jon didn't let that sway him, as there have been brothers of the night's watch executed for a whole lot less than what Olly partook in.

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Old 07-06-2016, 02:34 PM   #57
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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Season 6 Deaths Classified

Very few that are actually sad lol.

Sad
Hodor
Tommen
Leaf
Wun Wun

Didn't want to die
Margaery
Summer & Shaggydog (would have been sad if not killed offscreen/in 0.5 seconds)
Blackfish
3 Eyed Raven
Osha
Doran Martell (& Trystane)
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Lady Crane

Great that they're dead!
Ramsay Bolton
Alliser Thorne & Olly
The Waif
High Sparrow/Lancel Lannister
Walder Frey & sons (in pie)
Balon Greyjoy
Pycelle

Good
Khals
Smalljon Umber
Kevan Lannister

Don't really care
Mace Tyrell
Areo Hotah
Lem Lemoncloak

Not nice
Walda Frey/Bolton and kid

Waste
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Where do you place Ser Loras?

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Old 07-06-2016, 03:19 PM   #58
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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Where do you place Ser Loras?
Oh yeah, knew I'd miss someone obvious lol. I liked him so would have been a bit sad. Was always a character who I thought would die at some point before the end game (not enough of a schemer to survive long term, although for that reason I thought Margaery would outlast him).

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Old 07-06-2016, 08:41 PM   #59
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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Don't you have to die beyond the wall to become a wight?
I don't know, i was just joking around.

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Old 07-07-2016, 09:09 AM   #60
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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Old 07-07-2016, 09:58 AM   #61
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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Lots of adults knew the context of Jon's actions, what was at stake, and what was coming yet participated in killing him anyway. Olly at least had a deeply personal reason for hating the Wildlings and probably thought they were safe as long as long as they stayed behind the Wall.
Yeah because they are selfish traitors. Hence why they deserved to die. Every one of those ****s that betrayed Jon deserved to hang.

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Old 07-07-2016, 10:42 AM   #62
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

I think the issue was a little less one sided in the books. Jon was planning to go against his vows and join the fight against Ramsay so I sort of understood how that rubbed some of the NW the wrong way.

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Old 07-07-2016, 10:49 AM   #63
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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Waste
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Old 07-07-2016, 11:18 AM   #64
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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House Dudley would have cleaned up in Westeros.

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Old 07-13-2016, 03:45 PM   #65
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

Their YouTube channel released a Beginner's Guide narrated by Samuel L. Jackson.

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Old 07-13-2016, 09:34 PM   #66
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

What do yall think of the theory that Lighbringer is actually The Night's Watch and not an actual sword?


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One of the biggest guessing games for readers is trying to figure out what "weapon" will end up being Lightbringer. The Azor Ahai prophecy refers to Lightbringer as the "red sword of heroes." And we have no shortage of impressive/seemingly important swords, including Dawn, Longclaw and Oathkeeper.

But what if Lightbringer isn't a literal sword at all?

Depending on whether you believe AA is Jon or Dany, other parts of the prophecy haven't unfolded literally.

The red meteor isn't literally a "bleeding star," Dany wasn't literally "reborn" in Drogo's funeral pyre, Jon's wound wasn't literally smoking, etc.

Many of the prophecies, including Quaithe's and the Ghost of High Heart's, deal heavily with symbolism. The only prophecy I can think of that has unfolded more or less literally is Maggy's prophecy to Cersei. Given this, why should we assume that Lightbringer, if and when it appears, will be an actual sword? We already have one fake Lightbringer that's an actual sword. Might that be a cheeky way of showing that not only is Stannis not AA, but Melisandre (who's been wrong before) is also wrong to claim that it's a physical sword?

I'm starting to think of "sword" as an interchangeable term for a "weapon." A fighting force can be a weapon. A "red sword" need only mean a weapon/force that's seen and survived combat.

Look at the Night's Watch vow:


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Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crowns and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness. I am the watcher on the walls. I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realms of men. I pledge my life and honor to the Night's Watch, for this night and all nights to come.

Here we have an oath that uses a sword as the metaphor for the Night's Watch. Lightbringer is supposed to give off heat; the Night's Watch burns against the cold. It is the "light that brings the dawn." The original defeat of the Others is called the Battle for the Dawn. Could this mean that Lightbringer has been staring us in the face practically the entire time? I think it might.

The Azor Ahai legend and the origin of the Night's Watch are, we're led to believe, roughly contemporary. Azor Ahai's legend has to do with defeating the Others, which is also the Night's Watch's mission. As such, the AA legend and the Night's Watch are inexorably linked. The "wielder of Lightbringer" might simply mean the person who commands the Night's Watch. For all we know, AA might himself have been the founding Lord Commander.

It also occurred to me that AA's sacrifice of Nissa Nissa might somehow tie into the Night's Watch promise to not take wives. We understand that promise to simply be putting duty before familial loyalty, but what if there's more to it? If AA did sacrifice Nissa Nissa to "forge" Lightbringer, and the Night's Watch is itself Lightbringer, then the rule against taking wives literally goes back to the first days of the Watch and has a deep symbolic meaning beyond just utility.

So that's my idea. I've seen other people make the same point, and I've long suspected that the parade of awesome swords is really just a sleight of hand, getting people to look off in Direction A to find Lightbringer when it's been in Direction B all along.

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php...-nights-watch/


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Old 07-13-2016, 10:15 PM   #67
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

It's a very old theory, but one that has some weight to it.

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Old 07-13-2016, 10:27 PM   #68
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

I think that Dany and her dragons could be Lightbringer.

But most likely the Dayne sword Dawn could find it's way into Jon's hands.
What if Ned returned it but they told him to keep it.
So he brings it back with him and puts it in Lyanna's crypt

Also what if they melted down the Iron Throne with dragonfire?
Would that make a lot of Valyrian steel swords?

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Old 07-13-2016, 10:46 PM   #69
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

House Dayne was more or less built around the legend of Dawn and it's the most precious thing the family has. They wouldn't just hand it off to some northerner because he killed the current Sword of the Morning, not while the Dayne bloodline is still around.

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Old 07-13-2016, 10:48 PM   #70
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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What do yall think of the theory that Lighbringer is actually The Night's Watch and not an actual sword?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roose Bolton View Post
It's a very old theory, but one that has some weight to it.
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Originally Posted by Charlatan View Post
I think that Dany and her dragons could be Lightbringer.

But most likely the Dayne sword Dawn could find it's way into Jon's hands.
What if Ned returned it but they told him to keep it.
So he brings it back with him and puts it in Lyanna's crypt

Also what if they melted down the Iron Throne with dragonfire?
Would that make a lot of Valyrian steel swords?
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House Dayne was more or less built around the legend of Dawn and it's the most precious thing the family has. They wouldn't just hand it off to some northerner because he killed the current Sword of the Morning, not while the Dayne bloodline is still around.
Interesting timing for Marv to bring it up cause i just stumbled on this video that was uploaded today lol


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Old 07-13-2016, 11:13 PM   #71
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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House Dayne was more or less built around the legend of Dawn and it's the most precious thing the family has. They wouldn't just hand it off to some northerner because he killed the current Sword of the Morning, not while the Dayne bloodline is still around.
but the sword doesn't just fall to the Lord of the house. It has to be earned. Killing the "Sword of Morning" might be enough to qualify. Even though it wasn't Ned but Howland Reed who killed him.

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Old 07-13-2016, 11:31 PM   #72
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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but the sword doesn't just fall to the Lord of the house. It has to be earned. Killing the "Sword of Morning" might be enough to qualify. Even though it wasn't Ned but Howland Reed who killed him.
People have killed Swords of the Morning before, and House Dayne didn't just pawn it off then. They take the sword back to Starfall until someone worthy of wielding can emerge from the family. Arthur had an older brother (who fathered Arya's pal Edric Dayne) and two younger sisters in the form of Ashara and Allyria, all of whom could possibly have children or grandchildren worthy of carrying the weapon. They wouldn't just hand away the very object that has defined their family since time immemorial.

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Old 07-13-2016, 11:36 PM   #73
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

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Interesting timing for Marv to bring it up cause i just stumbled on this video that was uploaded today lol

Huffington Post actually posted an article about the theory today. That was the first Id heard the theory. I think. If Id heard about it I must have forgotten about it. But its a theory that I like. Tho Im not entirely sure how important the Night's Watch will be in the rest of the show considering that the Night's Watch is in shambles. Unless... Jon just declares that the entire North and all its Lords and soldiers are to be the "new" Night's Watch that will stand against the Darkness. I mean, that is essentially what the North will be from here on out. The sword in the dark. The Watchers.

Think of it like when Balian knighted all the men at the end of Kingdom of Heaven, but on a much larger scale.

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Old 08-01-2016, 11:13 AM   #74
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

I found a theory on reddit that Euron is working for Bloodraven. They pointed out that Bloodraven's got a red eye/is called the Three-Eyed Crow, and Euron's flag has a single red eye beneath an iron crown supported by crows.

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Old 08-01-2016, 06:32 PM   #75
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Default Re: Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - - Part 25

The red eye thing definitely factors into being a Greenseer, as Leaf tells Bran in ADWD, and Euron tells his brother that he used to have dreams that he could fly as a child. But I think more than likely Euron is a fallen protege of Bloodraven rather than still in his employ. He got to close to the heart of winter and the Night's Queen got into his head, so Bloodraven had to go with plan B and use Bran.

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