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Old Today, 02:15 PM   #651
Matt
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Default Re: The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread

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It's really possible that only a team movie can reset the clock, but I have the feeling that this Doom movie will be indeed a masked FF movie that will include the four in some way, thus properly extend the right and trying to sell to the masses a new FF franchise they don't want to see...
Without seeing the contract it is impossible to say. I have a hunch that it is worded in such a way that Doom will extend it. That is to say, I, as an attorney, put myself in the shoes of both Marvel and Fox's attorneys. I think "what would each one be willing to sign, how would each party word it in their ideal world and what are some gives and takes that each would make?" I then also think that Fox, at the time this contract was entered into, would be negotiating from the position of power. At the time this contract was made, Marvel wasn't Disney's golden child. Marvel was selling properties left and right to keep their sinking house afloat. So Marvel would not have much wiggle room. As such, I have to think this contract is very friendly to Fox and as broadly written in their favor as possible.

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Old Today, 02:18 PM   #652
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Default Re: The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread

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Somehow I read this differently at first, like you saw something he uses for tweeting and you thought it was totally fine.
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Old Today, 02:22 PM   #653
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Default Re: The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread

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Honestly, guys. Them getting Hawley of all people for Doom says they're looking for quality on this property. They're not going to turn around and let it go. If there's another movie required in 7 years, we'll get another FF film before 2022. They've even got time to do another lead/up spinoff to build up perception of their FF film.

I wouldn't do a Thing/Torch solo though... I might do a Thing backstory bit, like a gritty action movie with him as a total badass. That'd be fun.
The thing is that whatever they do, they're still like someone who has already burned you romantically several times. Now whatever that person does for you in future, even to try to make it up to you, it's not going to win you back solely because it's from that person. They might come up with the most inventive ideas or romantic gestures, but it will just drive you further away, whereas from someone with whom you don't have that romantic history, the same action would work. So it's not about what they do but about who is doing it and how you feel towards them.

It's like the Dobler-Dahmer theory in HIMYM, except here it applies to movie studios, namely Fox here as opposed to Marvel:


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Old Today, 03:36 PM   #654
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Default Re: The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread

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The thing is that whatever they do, they're still like someone who has already burned you romantically several times. Now whatever that person does for you in future, even to try to make it up to you, it's not going to win you back solely because it's from that person. They might come up with the most inventive ideas or romantic gestures, but it will just drive you further away, whereas from someone with whom you don't have that romantic history, the same action would work. So it's not about what they do but about who is doing it and how you feel towards them.

It's like the Dobler-Dahmer theory in HIMYM, except here it applies to movie studios, namely Fox here as opposed to Marvel:

I think that's a great analogy for how personally some fans took Trank and Story's versions. It's important to remember, however, that the general audience wasn't burned, they're not holding out hate, because they were never emotionally invested in the first place. The assumption of the Dobler-Dahmer Theory is that something is happening "to you," but Fant4stic didn't happen "to" hardly anyone, and the Story films didn't happen to very many either, and it wasn't bad enough to even be memorable. This dramatic uphill battle that Fox has to fight with all five of the hardcore FF fans just doesn't apply to the rest of the world who likes superhero movies in general, and likes Noah Hawley's work, and would be thrilled if they got a glimpse of how awesome Doom is.

I mean, honestly, imagine if the FF wasn't something personal for you. Would you even think about boycotting a movie you know nothing about because they'll never meet the Avengers?

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Old Today, 03:38 PM   #655
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Default Re: The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread

Lol'd at romantically. Great comparison.

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Old Today, 04:01 PM   #656
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Default Re: The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread

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Lol'd at romantically. Great comparison.
It so is. And I get it. I would love for the DCEU to end tomorrow and get into someone's hands that I really believe in. But that feeling, as strong as it is, is just that. Dr. Cosmic's romanticized feelings.

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Old Today, 04:14 PM   #657
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Default Re: The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread

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Originally Posted by DrCosmic View Post
I think that's a great analogy for how personally some fans took Trank and Story's versions. It's important to remember, however, that the general audience wasn't burned, they're not holding out hate, because they were never emotionally invested in the first place. The assumption of the Dobler-Dahmer Theory is that something is happening "to you," but Fant4stic didn't happen "to" hardly anyone, and the Story films didn't happen to very many either, and it wasn't bad enough to even be memorable. This dramatic uphill battle that Fox has to fight with all five of the hardcore FF fans just doesn't apply to the rest of the world who likes superhero movies in general, and likes Noah Hawley's work, and would be thrilled if they got a glimpse of how awesome Doom is.

I mean, honestly, imagine if the FF wasn't something personal for you. Would you even think about boycotting a movie you know nothing about because they'll never meet the Avengers?
I don't think you have to be so emotionally invested in the first place. As per the Dobler-Dahmer analogy, it's not simply about whether you had very strong feelings one way or another to start with, but whether you fall more on the side of an attraction or aversion, however small. And it's not just about something that happens to you, but how people react to your actions.

So in the HIMYM example given where Marshall surprises Lily in her room to ask her out, she barely knows him, so she can't be that emotionally invested at all. But if she falls more on the side of attraction, she will respond positively to his romantic gesture of singing to her with a guitar in her room and will be prepared to overlook certain things (like him breaking into her room). But if she falls more on the side of aversion, then she will consider it creepy and stalkerish behaviour and things she might overlook if she had an attraction would instead emphasise the feeling of alarm.

Now in the case of Fantastic Four, you don't have to be a huge fan of it at all. The general audience have enough of an idea of whether this is something that appeals to them or not, and they can make a quick decision based on that. Since experience tells them (from three prior films) that these aren't good films, they are more likely to have an aversion by default rather than an attraction, especially if they know it's just more of the same kind of "gesture" from the same person.

But switch up the person (ie Marvel) and market it as being part of the MCU, and it's like it changes the whole perception. It could easily be a similar "romantic gesture" (to carry on this Dobler Dahmer metaphor) but because it's a different person, it is received differently.

That's how Spider-Man Homecoming seems to have been received. Had it been just another reboot from Sony, then it would seem more of the same. The fact that there's a new factor involved (ie Marvel) seems to have shifted perception somewhat, even to the point that where there are certain "gestures" that seem almost as bad as what Sony or even Fox could put out, it is still received differently solely because of who is making that "gesture".

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