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Old 03-06-2018, 04:17 PM   #1
blackdragon6
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Default dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

I feel that DCEU does needs to be streamlined and more consistent, But i fear the top brass would just think that means copying Marvel's tone and style. DC still HAS to be different, it just do. Also i fear that the MCU kinda poisoned the well in terms of how comicbook movies should feel and look, for better or for worse..... and any deviation from that and people wont see it. Also DCEU copying Marvel's style might be too much of the same thing. I hate when people talk about "superhero over saturation", or "superhero fatigue", but in this context it actually might happen. DCEU can't be a re-skinned MCU. It has to stand on it's own.

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Old 03-06-2018, 06:13 PM   #2
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

DC movies should strive for a tone of their own, but it's a hard balance to strike. The part that the MCU juggernaut has played in the popularity of superhero movies cannot be overstated. However, I think a downside of the MCU reign is that it has led to a specific GA expectation of just what a superhero movie should be, and that in some peoples minds if it doesn't tick all those particular boxes then to some extent at least it's failed. Of course DC fans want DC movies to reflect DC comics but aiming to please the die-hard DC fans isn't enough, the movies need to have general appeal. I hope they can find that combination (as they did with Wonder Woman) without resorting to just 'copycatting'.

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Old 03-06-2018, 06:41 PM   #3
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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However, I think a downside of the MCU reign is that it has led to a specific GA expectation of just what a superhero movie should be, and that in some peoples minds if it doesn't tick all those particular boxes then to some extent at least it's failed.
Do you have any evidence for this?

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Old 03-06-2018, 07:56 PM   #4
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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I hope they can find that combination (as they did with Wonder Woman) without resorting to just 'copycatting'.
For what it's worth, i thought WW did a better job of representing war than Captain America the first Avenger did...and i liked that movie. I think WW has the right tone the DCEU needs.

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Old 03-06-2018, 07:57 PM   #5
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Do you have any evidence for this?
It's just an opinion man, none of us have any scientific evidence. Just a friendly discussion lol

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Old 03-06-2018, 08:19 PM   #6
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Also i fear that the MCU kinda poisoned the well in terms of how comicbook movies should feel and look, for better or for worse..... and any deviation from that and people wont see it.
Logan got nominated for an Oscar this year and was a huge financial hit. I don't know why people insist on claiming Marvel has made it so audiences won't accept dark superhero movies. The reason Batman v. Superman was panned and didn't make as much money as it should've was not because it was dark. It's because a bunch of people thought it was not a very good movie.

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Old 03-06-2018, 08:51 PM   #7
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

Yea. It's like Logan and Deadpool doesn't exist. It seems like an excuse to explain why BvS and SS were critical duds.

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Old 03-06-2018, 09:32 PM   #8
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

And Suicide Squad was also easily the most Marvel-style DCEU movie prior to Justice League, so you can't even say critics hated that because it was too dark either.

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Old 03-07-2018, 04:03 AM   #9
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Yea. It's like Logan and Deadpool doesn't exist. It seems like an excuse to explain why BvS and SS were critical duds.
Bingo.

DC don’t need to copy Marvel to be successful. They just have to make movies that don’t suck.

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Old 03-07-2018, 04:50 AM   #10
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

I'd even say DC doesn't need a cinematic universe to make money on superheroes. Instead of pseudo-franchises like in MCU, they can create/use real franchises, each one with it's own individuality.

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Old 03-07-2018, 10:02 AM   #11
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

The issue is it's fine to give real franchises for Wonder Woman, Flash, Green Lantern etc. but with Batman and Superman the issues is the repetition of the same villains and tropes. That the only real "fresh" take is having them team up.

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Old 03-07-2018, 11:37 AM   #12
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

The focus needs to be on making good films as opposed to "catching up", "copying" or "competing " with Marvel/Disney films.

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Old 03-07-2018, 01:22 PM   #13
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

Superman barely touched big screen quality-wise.

With Batman there's PLENTY of stuff to explore still. You just need to put away The Joker, Catwoman, Riddler, Two-Face and The League of Shadows.

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Old 03-07-2018, 02:20 PM   #14
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

DC needs to make less movies like BvS, Suicide Squad and Justice League, and more movies like Wonder Woman.

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Old 03-07-2018, 06:02 PM   #15
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Superman barely touched big screen quality-wise.

With Batman there's PLENTY of stuff to explore still. You just need to put away The Joker, Catwoman, Riddler, Two-Face and The League of Shadows.
I agree. You could have a series of 20 movies and if only a handful are good, that's still a whole lot of untapped potential. Even James Bond could use a few re-adaptations since several of the pre-Brosnan ones were adaptations in name only. With Superman, you have so many movies that either used only Lex and Zod or made-up villains like Ross Webster and Nuclear Man. There's still decades worth of material to mine from the comics.

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DC needs to make less movies like BvS, Suicide Squad and Justice League, and more movies like Wonder Woman.
And also avoid hiring directors with very hit-and-miss filmographies. Don't gamble on one/two hit wonders like Zack Snyder and get someone with a proven track record.

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Old 03-08-2018, 05:43 PM   #16
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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And Suicide Squad was also easily the most Marvel-style DCEU movie prior to Justice League, so you can't even say critics hated that because it was too dark either.
For better or worse audiences actually ''LIKED'' SS too.


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Old 03-08-2018, 05:48 PM   #17
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Logan got nominated for an Oscar this year and was a huge financial hit.
Logan is FOX's movie not Marvel Studios

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I don't know why people insist on claiming Marvel has made it so audiences won't accept dark superhero movies. The reason Batman v. Superman was panned and didn't make as much money as it should've was not because it was dark. It's because a bunch of people thought it was not a very good movie.
Anecdotally i have heard both complaints though. So those people do exist. My point was that DC needs to find it's own identity. That wasn't a endorsement, or a condemnation of a darker tone either way.

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Old 03-08-2018, 06:13 PM   #18
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Logan is FOX's movie not Marvel Studios
Doesn't change the point.

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Old 03-08-2018, 07:24 PM   #19
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Logan is FOX's movie not Marvel Studios
I know it's not a Marvel movie. That's the point. If the argument is that Marvel has made it so audiences no longer accept superhero movies unless they are fluffy Marvel-style PG-13 comedies, then it needs to address the fact that Deadpool and Logan, which were both hard-R, were released to mass acclaim and box office success.

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Old 03-09-2018, 03:36 PM   #20
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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I know it's not a Marvel movie. That's the point. If the argument is that Marvel has made it so audiences no longer accept superhero movies unless they are fluffy Marvel-style PG-13 comedies, then it needs to address the fact that Deadpool and Logan, which were both hard-R, were released to mass acclaim and box office success.
My point more so is that Marvel has an influence on other studios. That's what i really mean. Studios are short sighted, they'll see Marvel doing well with action comedies and they'll think that's what's needed for ALL the properties. Also if Marvel had the rights to the X-Franchise i highly doubt we would have gotten films like Deadpool or Logan in the first place. I mean i hope they prove me wrong. But more so i hope DC just stay in their lane.

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Old 03-09-2018, 03:37 PM   #21
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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My point more so is that Marvel has an influence on other studios. That's what i really mean. Studios are short sighted, they'll see Marvel doing well with action comedies and they'll think that's what's needed for ALL the properties. Also if Marvel had the rights to the X-Franchise i highly doubt we would have gotten films like Deadpool
Deadpool is an MCU movie only with nudity and f-bombs.

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Old 03-09-2018, 03:42 PM   #22
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Deadpool is an MCU movie only with nudity and f-bombs.
I was actually about to bring that up, Deadpool is a R-rated action comedy. But a action comedy nonetheless. But it's deadpool so, it kinda makes sense.

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Old 03-09-2018, 03:43 PM   #23
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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I was actually about to bring that up, Deadpool is a R-rated action comedy. But a action comedy nonetheless. But it's deadpool so, it kinda makes sense.
Yup, it works well with the character so it was the exact right approach.

Go Birmingham, by the way. That's my home town

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Old 03-10-2018, 06:45 AM   #24
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

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Do you have any evidence for this?
ctrl + F "fun" in every BvS review. And as far as Logan is concerned it still made less than JL and Logan is accepted as a dramatic troubled hero while Superman is not.


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Old 03-10-2018, 06:02 PM   #25
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Default Re: dceu DOES needs to be fixed, But copying Marvel won't help

Really ? If the MCU can make hugely successful and enjoyable films about characters like Ant man and Dr Strange well, I think it seems a bit like being in denial and somewhat ridiculous to deny that the MCU formula works, and works really well.

If a Superman film came out which had a similar tone to Ragnarok, and made Supes likeable and at the same time put him through some rough times, but still was overall fun ( and got great reviews and made a ton of cash) is anyone really going to complain "because it's too much like the MCU!"

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