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Old 04-24-2017, 03:45 PM   #51
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I think Rey has more force potential than the others we've seen, Anakin included, and I don't mean that as an insult. I figured it was intentional. The second time she fired a blaster, she hit someone from several yards away. She did the Jedi mind trick without any training. She had a an extremely detailed vision upon coming across Luke's lightsaber. My theory is:

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She's the chosen one. Not another chosen one, because they were wrong about Anakin.


For me, her level of ability doesn't go too far, but it comes close to going too far. It's walking a fine line, so when for someone else it's too much I can't exactly be surprised. I don't want to debate whether she's a Mary Sue per se; I think the Mary Sue concept can be useful for explaining one's position, but when it gets treated as an ironclad rule it's just in the way. If I liked a character who happened to be a Mary Sue, well, I would like that character.

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Old 05-01-2017, 11:46 PM   #52
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

When I heard Lucas say that, I was bummed out for about a minute but then I realized that it doesn't really matter what the original intent was since now the franchise has evolved so much in 40 years.

There's no way Lucas could have expected the first film to grow into a franchise that would last 40 years and keep growing while fans of all ages gravitate towards it and it's not just about nostalgia.

Empire is my favorite SW film and has been since I was a kid in the 90's but even back then, I didn't see it as a kids movie or a part of a kids franchise. I enjoyed episode 3 when it first came out(still do) in my 20's and I love Rogue One as a 31yo. Not just because of the brand and nostalgia but quality!

Comic books were probably invented for kids and teens but now look at how they and the genre has evolved in the 21st century.

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Old 05-02-2017, 11:55 AM   #53
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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When I heard Lucas say that, I was bummed out for about a minute but then I realized that it doesn't really matter what the original intent was since now the franchise has evolved so much in 40 years.

There's no way Lucas could have expected the first film to grow into a franchise that would last 40 years and keep growing while fans of all ages gravitate towards it and it's not just about nostalgia.

Empire is my favorite SW film and has been since I was a kid in the 90's but even back then, I didn't see it as a kids movie or a part of a kids franchise. I enjoyed episode 3 when it first came out(still do) in my 20's and I love Rogue One as a 31yo. Not just because of the brand and nostalgia but quality!

Comic books were probably invented for kids and teens but now look at how they and the genre has evolved in the 21st century.
You and me both I'm 32 now but I still regard RotS to be the better of the two prequels, despite its own flaws.

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Old 07-01-2017, 01:45 PM   #54
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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As an older fan what's your response to what Lucas said?
I think he's right, despite his horrible writing skills looking back SW is for a younger audience; it was never meant for older people still holding onto their childhoods.

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Old 07-01-2017, 01:57 PM   #55
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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I think he's right, despite his horrible writing skills looking back SW is for a younger audience; it was never meant for older people still holding onto their childhoods.
You should tell that to the millions of adults who watched Star Wars 6 times in the theaters back in 1977.

Lucas made the empire look like Nazis and the Force resemble Eastern philosophy and religion.

He realized the influence went far beyond selling toys and threw in ewoks and Jar Jar.

That's what you call backpeddling.

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Old 07-02-2017, 11:11 AM   #56
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Just because adults ended up liking the stories doesn't mean they were created for adults. Lucas is a liar and one of the worst big budget directors/writers I have ever seen; but he very well might have a point here. Harry Potter was written for kids yet adults like the books as well, doesn't mean it wasn't written for kids.
George has done much worse than appealing to children with silly characters in Jedi and TPM; for example bad character development, horrible stupid moronic idiotic WTF character motivations etc in ROTS and AOTC.

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Old 07-02-2017, 12:26 PM   #57
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Star Wars has obviously evolved beyond it's primary purpose. And it won't be the first or last creation to go through a metamorphosis to serve a greater purpose.

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Old 07-02-2017, 12:35 PM   #58
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I can firmly say that the stories that I enjoy are probably mostly for 12 year olds. Or maybe a better way of saying it is...."I like the stuff that a 12 year old could like..."

I like Harry Potter and Hunger Games, I like Trollhunters and Avatar the Last Airbender. You know who else likes this stuff? My kids.

And when you think of the most popular stories of all time, they are usually stories that can be enjoyed by a broad audience. Star Wars fits that category. It's a big world that can appeal to everyone.

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Old 07-02-2017, 02:05 PM   #59
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I suppose you'll have to put me in the category of people who believe Star Wars was created for children. But I would argue that a good children's story can also appeal to adults (The Hobbit, Pixar and Disney's animated movies, etc.), which Star Wars does. Star Wars deals with pretty simplistic 'good vs evil' ideas, and never gets too dark.

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Old 07-02-2017, 03:11 PM   #60
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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I suppose you'll have to put me in the category of people who believe Star Wars was created for children. But I would argue that a good children's story can also appeal to adults (The Hobbit, Pixar and Disney's animated movies, etc.), which Star Wars does. Star Wars deals with pretty simplistic 'good vs evil' ideas, and never gets too dark.
Blowing up planets, torture, killing children, slavery, patricide, etc.

Is any mega popular franchise really so much more mature than Star Wars?

Avatar, Jurassic World, Fast and Furious, Indiana Jones, Back to the Future, James Bond, Lord of the Rings, Marvel, DC, POTC, etc.

99% of mega blockbusters are for teens and families without much more sophistication or depth than Empire Strikes Back.

Is Star Wars for families? Sure, who cares? Just about all mega franchises are also.

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Old 07-02-2017, 07:01 PM   #61
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Those things aren't really focused on in explicit detail, not enough to upset most children. You can find dark themes in anything if you look hard enough. The level of maturity really boils down to what they choose to show and not show, or how they choose to present these themes.

I will admit that some of the stuff in the prequels (especially ROTS) may get a little too dark, but I do believe that Lucas originally intended the franchise for kids (although he may have gotten off-course.)

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Old 07-02-2017, 07:35 PM   #62
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Yeah but the vast majority of blockbusters are family friendly so why single out Star Wars?

Name 5 blockbuster franchises far more mature and sophisticated than Star Wars.

Other than The Matrix...I'll wait.

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Old 07-02-2017, 10:04 PM   #63
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I'd say Lord of the Rings, Guardians of the Galaxy, Star Trek (the original movies), the Nolan Batman series, and Jason Bourne series are all far more mature and sophisticated than Star Wars.

All of these (in my opinion) have themes and undertones that are far more mature than anything in Star Wars. Aside from that, all of them (excluding Star Trek) are pretty inappropriate for kids. Lord of the Rings and Batman are pretty scary, Jason Bourne is violent, and Guardians of the Galaxy has a lot of bad language (not to mention most kids wouldn't get the 80s references).

Transformers and Indiana Jones are series that come to mind that aren't necessarily more mature or sophisticated, but both are far more vulgar and violent than Star Wars. I can't say Star Wars is completely kid friendly, but I'd show a kid Star Wars long before I'd show them anything else I mentioned (again, aside from maybe Star Trek, because at least that doesn't have as much objectionable content.)

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Old 07-02-2017, 10:35 PM   #64
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I freaking adored TFA when it saw it in theatres. It was one of the best cinematic experiences I ever had.

Then on multiple viewings, I realized it's not stand-alone enough. Its sequels' answers to its open-ended questions will make-or-break that film. That's not something I can say about A New Hope. I don't even include TFA in my Star Wars ranking for that reason.

Rogue One was dope. It even made ANH a better film (not that it wasn't amazing already).

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Old 07-02-2017, 11:07 PM   #65
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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I'd say Lord of the Rings, Guardians of the Galaxy, Star Trek (the original movies), the Nolan Batman series, and Jason Bourne series are all far more mature and sophisticated than Star Wars.

All of these (in my opinion) have themes and undertones that are far more mature than anything in Star Wars. Aside from that, all of them (excluding Star Trek) are pretty inappropriate for kids. Lord of the Rings and Batman are pretty scary, Jason Bourne is violent, and Guardians of the Galaxy has a lot of bad language (not to mention most kids wouldn't get the 80s references).

Transformers and Indiana Jones are series that come to mind that aren't necessarily more mature or sophisticated, but both are far more vulgar and violent than Star Wars. I can't say Star Wars is completely kid friendly, but I'd show a kid Star Wars long before I'd show them anything else I mentioned (again, aside from maybe Star Trek, because at least that doesn't have as much objectionable content.)
The Force suggest that all elements and life are all interconnected and forces of good and evil are both necessary to maintain balance in the universe. It's based on Taoism and the yin and yang.

Then you have militarized fascist using it to manipulate the dark side and brutally oppress a diverse galactic republic.

This is relevant to the world we live in with an undercurrent of spiritual purpose.

LotR is a very detailed world but the theme is absolute power corrupts absolutely and it's dragged out as long as possible.

I'll be nice and call this one a tie.

Guardians of the Galaxy has more depth and sophistication? Lmao, no just no.

I'll give you Star Trek because it explores plenty of social problems and timeless questions.

TDK? Basically an "all men are corruptible" theme repeated over and over again. Not that deep below the surface. I'll consider this a tie only because it's well executed and I'm choosing to view all the Bat-villians as different versions of the devil which adds a layer of depth.

Is Bourne more mature and sophisticated than SW? Okay sure the Bourne fanboys like to think so.

Transformers and Indy? No, vulgarity does not equal maturity or sophistication in my book.

So basically out of dozens of blockbusters maybe three franchises is more sophisticated and mature than a movie like Rogue One (Bourne, The Matrix, Star Trek).

And that's not by a wide margin either.

Doesn't seem to me that Rogue One or Empire Strikes Back is any more childish than 90 percent of blockbusters.

Lucas is just butthurt that the fans were right about the prequels.

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Old 07-03-2017, 01:35 AM   #66
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

If George Lucas says he made Star Wars for 12 year old boys, I believe it. It explains a lot. I saw the movie as an adult, and the whole time I was watching it I felt like I was being talked down to. It felt like the movie was geared toward a child. It's one thing to make a movie for kids, but it wasn't marketed as such, and I think it should have been. It was still enjoyable, I'll say. But those cute robots were, well, cute. Cute is usually a sign of aiming for a young audience, I think.

There might be references in it to spirituality and politics and stuff, but references to adult interests show up in a lot of kids' entertainment, including Bugs Bunny. That doesn't make it adult. It means that the filmmakers are aware that it's adults who are taking kids to the movies, and they're giving the adults something to keep them interested.

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Old 07-03-2017, 04:43 AM   #67
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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If George Lucas says he made Star Wars for 12 year old boys, I believe it. It explains a lot. I saw the movie as an adult, and the whole time I was watching it I felt like I was being talked down to. It felt like the movie was geared toward a child. It's one thing to make a movie for kids, but it wasn't marketed as such, and I think it should have been. It was still enjoyable, I'll say. But those cute robots were, well, cute. Cute is usually a sign of aiming for a young audience, I think.

There might be references in it to spirituality and politics and stuff, but references to adult interests show up in a lot of kids' entertainment, including Bugs Bunny. That doesn't make it adult. It means that the filmmakers are aware that it's adults who are taking kids to the movies, and they're giving the adults something to keep them interested.
Have you guys seen the huge limes for SW in photos from the 70's?

They had 99% adults.

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Old 07-03-2017, 06:30 AM   #68
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I agree LOTR is much more mature than SW, and if you think the themes in SW are too adult for children then you have never read Harry Potter or any of the old fairy tales. Off the top of my head Hansel & Gretel deals with cannibalism.
And as another poster stated those Looney Tune cartoons are for children but deal and show many non kid friendly things going on.

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Originally Posted by MessiahDecoy123 View Post
Have you guys seen the huge limes for SW in photos from the 70's?

They had 99% adults.
Good gracious what are you even arguing for?! It has already been acknowledged that adults can like things made for children and that is what happened with SW.
Why is the fact that SW is kid aimed so offensive to you?


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Old 07-03-2017, 10:44 AM   #69
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Maturity and sophistication aren't the only factors in something being aimed at adults vs children. You may be right about GOTG being less sophisticated than Star Wars (although I'd argue the themes are more defined), but it's still very much an adult series. There's tons of bad language and vulgar humor, not to mention the whole thing is basically a throwback to old 80s movies, packed with jokes that most kids wouldn't get. I'm not saying Star Wars is the perfect kid's series (it does have some non-kid friendly stuff), but overall it's much cleaner and more appropriate for kids.

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