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Old 05-19-2017, 05:42 AM   #376
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

For myself personally

1. Halloween (1978)
2. Halloween II (1981)
3. Halloween: The Curse of Michael Myers (both the theatrical and producers cut)
4. Halloween III: Season of the Witch
5. Halloween H20
6. Halloween 4: The Return of Michael Myers
7. Halloween (Rob Zombie)
8. Halloween Ressurection
9. Halloween 5: The Revenge of Michael Myers
10. Halloween II (Rob Zombie)

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Old 05-19-2017, 08:52 AM   #377
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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Of course you can. I think there's a disconnect between what Carpenter described as supernatural and what McBride is referring to (I think a better word for McBride to use would have been "superhuman" or "immortal"). But like I said, Michael can be the embodiment of evil and a force of nature --
even seemingly supernatural to an extent -- without being overtly superhuman, supernatural, and immortal.


First, there are several ways to define the term "supernatural", but let's look at a couple that are the most applicable to H1:

- attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature
- of, pertaining to, characteristic of, or attributed to God or a deity
- of a superlative degree; preternatural ("preternatural" meaning out of the ordinary course of nature; exceptional or abnormal)


The other definitions of "supernatural" are primarily related to the concepts of ghosts, spirits, magic, and other invisible, inhuman beings.


Thinking back to H1, aside from disappearing at the end of the film after being shot several times (which is still not something that is completely impossible in reality), how else does the film present Michael as being supernatural or immortal? It really doesn't, because most or all of the other injuries he sustains are things that a man could plausibly survive to get back up from in the heat of the moment.

However, the ways in which H1 makes Michael appear to be "supernatural" are more so related to his backstory and the existential questions (and lack of clarity) surrounding his existence and motivation for what he does -- Who is this man? Where did he come from? What made him this way? Why did he kill his sister? Why doesn't he speak? What is driving him to do these things? Why is he going after Laurie?

These quotes by Dr. Loomis serve as the best (and really only) explanations about Michael Myers in H1:

"I met him, fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left; no reason, no conscience, no understanding; and even the most rudimentary sense of life or death, of good or evil, right or wrong. I met this six-year-old child with this blank, pale, emotionless face, and the blackest eyes... the devil's eyes. I spent eight years trying to reach him, and then another seven trying to keep him locked up because I realized that what was living behind that boy's eyes was purely and simply... evil."

"I watched him for fifteen years, sitting in a room, staring at a wall; not seeing the wall, looking past the wall; looking at this night, inhumanly patient, waiting for some secret, silent alarm to trigger him off. Death has come to your little town, Sheriff. Now, you can either ignore it, or you can help me to stop it."



Therefore, it's not even possible to answer all of the questions about that I posed above because -- when only looking at H1 -- the answers are not truly known, and it is that "unknown" factor that made Michael Myers so frightening and created a seemingly supernatural aura around him. [Aside from maybe Loomis and his gut feelings about Michael, no one else in the film can even understand or comprehend what he is or what he's capable of -- hence, "beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature".]

There is no greater fear than the "fear of the unknown". It is an innate and evolutionary trait within us all. Man has always felt insecure about that which he is unaware of or unfamiliar with, and this fear of the unknown can take on many shapes and forms. When people say they're "afraid of the dark", they are really saying they're afraid that they can't see what's around them or in front of them. A person might be a great swimmer and is not afraid of swimming in pools, but the thought of jumping into a dark lake in the night would frighten the same person because the fact that they can't see the bottom of the lake triggers a fear of the unknown.

Relating this to Michael Myers in H1, it is not known why he snapped as a child and killed his sister. It is not know why he sat there silently for years and never spoke again. It is not know why he chose to escape years later on Halloween to kill again. It is not known why he is following Laurie Strode and her friends. It is not known why is he so relentless in pursuing Laurie, or why he doesn't stay down or give up after she is able to attack him. Aside from one split-second shot at the end of the film, what he actually looks like is not even known.

Loomis described six-year-old Michael as having a "blank, pale, emotionless face...with the blackest eyes". The fact that adult Michael wears a mask which creates the same effect only adds to the unknown factor and adds to the potentially supernatural aura surrounding him. He could be anyone or anything under that mask. He could be a stranger or he could be someone you already know. He could just be a sick and psychologically disturbed man, or he could be a demon -- the devil incarnate.

The way Carpenter shot the film also fuels this -- POV shots from inside Michael's mask, hearing only Michael's breathing at times, his body outline and mask seemingly materializing from the shadows, the fact that it appears as if he disappears from plain sight, the way he is able to follow his victims and takes his time preying on them as opposed to simply busting in with brute force as most assailants would, etc. (There's a reason Michael is billed as "The Shape" in the credits.)


So to get back to my original point, it's entirely possible to present Michael as a seemingly omniscient and evil "force of nature" (which is how characters like The Joker in TDK and the shark in Jaws are often described) without introducing elements that are overtly supernatural and fantastical -- and I think that's exactly what McBride was talking about. Michael does not need to be shown as being superhuman, super-powerful, or completely un-killable/immortal in order to be scary. There are plenty of other ways to make Michael scary and Carpenter's original film is the prime example of one way it can be done, which is exactly why this "going back to the roots of the original" talk is so important and crucial in making it happen.

#MakeMichaelScaryAgain
I have to say that it gets me fired up for another Halloween installment when I read something for someone like yourself that exudes so much passion for the character. Great write-up and totally agree.

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Old 05-19-2017, 08:58 AM   #378
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

1. Halloween (1978)
2. Halloween H20
3. Halloween II
4. Halloween 3
5. Halloween 4
6. Halloween 6
7. Halloween 5
8. Halloween Resurrection
9. RZ Halloween
10. RZ Halloween 2

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Last edited by The Joker; 05-19-2017 at 09:07 AM.
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Old 05-19-2017, 09:06 AM   #379
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

1. John Carpenter's Halloween
2. Halloween II (1981)
3. Halloween III: Season of the Witch
4. Halloween H20
5. Halloween 6
6. Halloween 4
7. Halloween 5
8. Halloween Resurrection
9. RZ Halloween
10. RZ Halloween II

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Old 05-19-2017, 11:17 AM   #380
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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Originally Posted by Pittman4Two View Post
I have to say that it gets me fired up for another Halloween installment when I read something for someone like yourself that exudes so much passion for the character. Great write-up and totally agree.

Since you are the only person to even response or react to my long-winded post, I thank you and appreciate you.



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Old 05-19-2017, 11:28 AM   #381
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

The Shape is on point. I have the unfortunate mindset of simply being too jaded to the point where I just want something new with all of these horror properties. When they announced Danny McBride was involved, I was initially hesitant, but its the type of move I've been asking for so bring it on. If it looks good, I'll be there opening night.

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Old 05-19-2017, 12:05 PM   #382
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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Am I done yet? Dude you're not getting it. You don't know that he hasn't thought that or spoke to someone about that. Because you are not Rob Zombie or anyone affiliated with him. Actually read what I write I never said he lobbied for it or has had talks about making it. I'm saying there are rumours he wanted to make a TCM film but knew he wouldn't get to do that one and when Halloween came along he took Halloween. I'm not saying it's true or isn't. I'm saying you or I don't know if the rumours that he personally feels that way are true or not.

Actually bother to read what I am writing. I never said he tried to get hired to make a TCM film. I'm saying there are rumours that he wanted to.
Why can't you just let it go? The rumor has no validity. If someone tells me a rumor I heard of has no truth to it, I don't debate them. You're the only person who has ever mentioned this rumor. Can you even cite a credible source whereupon this rumor originated? No? That's what I thought.

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The Shape is on point. I have the unfortunate mindset of simply being too jaded to the point where I just want something new with all of these horror properties. When they announced Danny McBride was involved, I was initially hesitant, but its the type of move I've been asking for so bring it on. If it looks good, I'll be there opening night.
Agreed on all points. Even considering the massive amount of movies these franchises retain, I absolutely believe there are a lot more viable stories to be told. And if that can ein of the original where there's suspense and tension over blood and guts, I'm all for it.


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Old 05-19-2017, 01:29 PM   #383
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

So is a new Halloween film still on it's way or is it on the back burner again like he next Friday the 13th?

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Old 05-19-2017, 01:33 PM   #384
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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So is a new Halloween film still on it's way or is it on the back burner again like he next Friday the 13th?
Its coming next year from Danny McBride and David Gordon Green.

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Old 05-19-2017, 01:38 PM   #385
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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Its coming next year from Danny McBride and David Gordon Green.
No idea who they are or at least I don't think so. Carpenter is still returning to produce it right? Isn't this going to be a sequel to the original?

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Old 05-19-2017, 01:46 PM   #386
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

It's a "direct followup" to Halloween II (1981).

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Old 05-19-2017, 01:57 PM   #387
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

So a reboot of 4!? I wonder how they'll explain Michael Myers return this time. Also curious about Laurie Strode is back or if she's faking her death again

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Old 05-19-2017, 02:04 PM   #388
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

^ That's the elephant in the room. If it's following HII then it's still in keeping with Michael being after his sister. So where is Laurie? Is Michael still looking for her?

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Old 05-19-2017, 02:10 PM   #389
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

It depends on when it's set as well.

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Old 05-19-2017, 02:20 PM   #390
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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Why can't you just let it go? The rumor has no validity. If someone tells me a rumor I heard of has no truth to it, I don't debate them. You're the only person who has ever mentioned this rumor. Can you even cite a credible source whereupon this rumor originated? No? That's what I thought.
Says the other person who can't let it go. I've heard it a few times on several podcasts. End of the day I never said it wasn't only a rumour but I'm also not arrogant enough to act like it's got chance of been true at all simply cause I can't find anything on google. You act like you're Zombies best mate or something. Also you hear a rumour you don't believe so that makes it definitely not true

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Old 05-19-2017, 02:24 PM   #391
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So a reboot of 4!? I wonder how they'll explain Michael Myers return this time. Also curious about Laurie Strode is back or if she's faking her death again
I'll have to recheck but I remember seeing a few days ago that this entry would negate the usage of Laurie Strode. Which would be great as the franchise desperately needs to do away with all of the baggage its acquired.

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Old 05-19-2017, 02:56 PM   #392
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^ That's the elephant in the room. If it's following HII then it's still in keeping with Michael being after his sister. So where is Laurie? Is Michael still looking for her?
The new film is going to be in vein of The Raid with Michael killing folks floor to floor in order to get to Laurie at the top of a tower. Lol.

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Old 05-19-2017, 03:13 PM   #393
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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The new film is going to be in vein of The Raid with Michael killing folks floor to floor in order to get to Laurie at the top of a tower. Lol.

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Old 05-19-2017, 04:38 PM   #394
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For myself personally

1. Halloween (1978)
2. Halloween II (1981)
3. Halloween: The Curse of Michael Myers (both the theatrical and producers cut)
4. Halloween III: Season of the Witch
5. Halloween H20
6. Halloween 4: The Return of Michael Myers
7. Halloween (Rob Zombie)
8. Halloween Ressurection
9. Halloween 5: The Revenge of Michael Myers
10. Halloween II (Rob Zombie)
My list would be:

1. Halloween (1978).
2. Halloween H20: 20 Years Later.
3. Halloween II (1981).
4. Halloween 4: The Return of Michael Myers.
5. Halloween (2007).
6. Halloween 5: The Revenge of Michael Myers.
7. Halloween II (2009).
8. Halloween 6: The Curse of Michael Myers.
9. Halloween: Resurrection.

I don't count Halloween III.

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Old 05-19-2017, 04:46 PM   #395
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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It's a "direct followup" to Halloween II (1981).
My only concern for this (and I have liked what I've read up to this point) is how the Myers character survives being burnt to a crisp and not be supernatural or invincible?

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Old 05-19-2017, 04:49 PM   #396
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

1. Halloween (1978).
2. Halloween II (1981).
3. Halloween H20: 20 Years Later.
4. Halloween 4: The Return of Michael Myers.
5. Halloween 5: The Revenge of Michael Myers.
6. Halloween 6: The Curse of Michael Myers.

Tied for Crappiest Place: Halloween (2007). Halloween II (2009). Halloween: Resurrection.

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Old 05-19-2017, 05:17 PM   #397
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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No idea who they are or at least I don't think so. Carpenter is still returning to produce it right? Isn't this going to be a sequel to the original?
They're primarily known for comedy, but Carpenter has approved of it and from the few comments they've made about it, they appear to have the right idea.

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Old 05-19-2017, 05:19 PM   #398
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

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My only concern for this (and I have liked what I've read up to this point) is how the Myers character survives being burnt to a crisp and not be supernatural or invincible?
Yeah, I don't see how they're going to get around having him survive that fire without being 100% supernatural. They can't even try to say it was Loomis we saw completely ablaze because we got several close-ups of Myers' mask burning.

Quite the conundrum indeed.

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Old 05-19-2017, 05:26 PM   #399
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

Maybe it will be a vague sequel where they take the parts they want and not others.

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Old 05-19-2017, 05:32 PM   #400
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Default Re: Halloween Movies Thread... - Part 2

It does give them an out to explain Loomis not being there. He died in the explosion.

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