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Old 06-05-2012, 09:28 PM   #1
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 9

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Old 06-05-2012, 09:28 PM   #2
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 8

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Old 06-05-2012, 09:28 PM   #3
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 9

The Irony in all of this is that I had originally thought that Betty Ross was Bruce's and the Hulk's ONLY LI in his mythology.lol I wasn't even aware that the guy got married once, let alone 3 times and that he had children as well.

Given that most of my exposure to the Hulk's character has been from films and television shows alike, where he's been primarily portrayed as a loner with a sad past with Betty, I can only imagine on how intrigued and surprised the GA might be if they were to see all of this history come to life for the Hulk in the MCU.lol

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Old 06-05-2012, 11:22 PM   #4
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

Someone school me; within the Marvel universe, Stark is smarter than Banner, or vice versa?

I know Reed Richards is up there too, but i had no idea until Avengers how smart Stark was compared to the other scientific minds of the Marvel-verse....

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Old 06-05-2012, 11:40 PM   #5
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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Someone school me; within the Marvel universe, Stark is smarter than Banner, or vice versa?

I know Reed Richards is up there too, but i had no idea until Avengers how smart Stark was compared to the other scientific minds of the Marvel-verse....
Not really, Golgo. Banner, Stark, T'challa, Pym and McCoy are pretty much on the same level, with each of them being the best in a particular field.
Reed and Doom, however, are a 'neck' above them.

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Old 06-05-2012, 11:46 PM   #6
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

More than a neck. Reed and Doom are really in an entire separate category, wherein intellect becomes a cosmic tool. Aside from them, though, yeah, I'd be comfortable saying Banner is in the same category as Stark. Stark is higher, IMO, but its not a depressing distance, and its one where Banner would completely outdo Stark in Banner's areas of expertise.

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Old 06-06-2012, 09:14 AM   #7
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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More than a neck. Reed and Doom are really in an entire separate category, wherein intellect becomes a cosmic tool. Aside from them, though, yeah, I'd be comfortable saying Banner is in the same category as Stark. Stark is higher, IMO, but its not a depressing distance, and its one where Banner would completely outdo Stark in Banner's areas of expertise.
Not so much.

In one of the earliest Stan Lee stories, he stated Banner was the smartest man on the planet, albeit Stan's Hulk stories weren't the most consistent.. In an issue of Hulk in the early to mid 1970's Doom pondered just how smart Banner really was. When Banner was in control of Hulk's form when Bill Mantlo was writing him, Banner created more new inventions than Edison in a shorter time. More recently in WWHs, Banner outsmarted Doom twice.

It has been suggested, but not made clear, that Banner transforms into the Savage Hulk to hold himself back all these years, all his other incarnations, including "Gray Hulk", "Gravage/Green Scar","Bruce" are potentially dangerous due to their level's of intelligence, power and knowing potentially what they can do. Banner allowing his Hulk-self to exist without his hindrance = Worldbreaker Hulk.

As someone said, Marvel's genius' are usually genius' in specific fields.

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Old 06-06-2012, 04:34 PM   #8
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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Not so much.

In one of the earliest Stan Lee stories, he stated Banner was the smartest man on the planet, albeit Stan's Hulk stories weren't the most consistent.. In an issue of Hulk in the early to mid 1970's Doom pondered just how smart Banner really was. When Banner was in control of Hulk's form when Bill Mantlo was writing him, Banner created more new inventions than Edison in a shorter time. More recently in WWHs, Banner outsmarted Doom twice.

It has been suggested, but not made clear, that Banner transforms into the Savage Hulk to hold himself back all these years, all his other incarnations, including "Gray Hulk", "Gravage/Green Scar","Bruce" are potentially dangerous due to their level's of intelligence, power and knowing potentially what they can do. Banner allowing his Hulk-self to exist without his hindrance = Worldbreaker Hulk.

As someone said, Marvel's genius' are usually genius' in specific fields.
Again, they've *said* this, but outside of the atrocious writing of World War Hulk, Banner has *no* feats that compare with the best mad science done by Reed and Doom.

Or, call me back when Banner teleconferences with his alternate universe selves, builds machines that protect his temporal integrity, mind controls the entire planet repeatedly, brings back the dead by busting into Heaven, hijacks the power of cosmic entities, or uses his brain the manage the recreation of the entire universe.

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Old 06-06-2012, 04:55 PM   #9
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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People often make that claim, but the Leader has never done *anything* to back it up. He may well be smarter than the likes of Stark and Pym, but the absolute best feats of his entire career barely compare with typical ones from the Reed/Doom pair.

Or, there is a guy smart enough to literally bust into the Gates of Heaven to bring back the dead. His name is not 'Leader'.
Leader has not been in as many issues as Reed and Doom, but he has built his own time machine and he has figured out how to bring the dead to life; something neither of the other two can do; along with manipulating and making life forms also super powered beings.

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Again, they've *said* this, but outside of the atrocious writing of World War Hulk, Banner has *no* feats that compare with the best mad science done by Reed and Doom.
Please stop with the 'atrocious writing' bit. Whether you liked the writing or not is irrelevant to the things Banner did before and in World War Hulks. You evidently have not read Stan Lee's earliest Hulk issues wherein Banner was making new inventions and many more mentioned all the time. I mentioned Bill Mantlo's run over 30 years ago where it was stated that Banner made more inventions than anyone else in the shortest time, due to him not having the Savage Hulk holding him back.

Banner is a nuclear physicists and excels in many other fields; Reed has even consulted with Bruce or referenced Banner's work in the nuclear fields.

Bruce has built many things...do the research.

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Old 06-07-2012, 07:24 PM   #10
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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Please stop with the 'atrocious writing' bit. Whether you liked the writing or not is irrelevant to the things Banner did before and in World War Hulks.
Yeah the "atrocious writing" bit doesn't have much credibility when you are citing stuff like "teleconferences with his alternate universe selves, builds machines that protect his temporal integrity, mind controls the entire planet repeatedly, brings back the dead by busting into Heaven, hijacks the power of cosmic entities, or uses his brain the manage the recreation of the entire universe." Thats all some pretty stupid **** for someone to be doing after tinkering about in their laboratory for a couple of nights.

Banner hasn't had much of a rep as a braniac for a while but a large part of that has been because hes spent most of the last ten years of Marvel history walking around the desert in a pair of torn up pants. The past couple of years have seen him get some more consistent acknowledgement on that front and thats not a bad thing.

Reed Richards is to smarts kind of like what Hulk is to strength and i dont think its deniable that while guys like Stark and Banner can be close, if push comes to shove he will be Numero Uno. Thats fine. The Leader on the other hand is someone who i dont really see a problem with equalling or even surpassing Reed. I mean superintelligence is his actual power. Yes he doesn't quite have the feats of a guy like RR who goes into space and does wacky stuff every second issue but The Leader is always going to be held back by the fact that most of the time its his job to be foiled by a giant green idiot. Much like its Reed's job to never be able to figure out how to cure The Thing. I was actually pretty fond of how Millar hinted that Reed's stretchy powers actually gave him the ability to think in ways that were not humanly possible and i wish they would introduce something similar for 616 Richards.

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Old 06-06-2012, 01:07 AM   #11
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

So Peter Parker would be a tier below, correct?

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Old 06-06-2012, 01:13 AM   #12
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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So Peter Parker would be a tier below, correct?
Correct. If Peter was more accomplished, we could make a better comparison, though.

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Old 06-06-2012, 08:13 AM   #13
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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So Peter Parker would be a tier below, correct?
And yet, on these Marvel Top Trumps ratings, they somehow put Peter's intelligence above Stark's.

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Old 06-06-2012, 08:20 AM   #14
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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And yet, on these Marvel Top Trumps ratings, they somehow put Peter's intelligence above Stark's.
But on Marvel's official ratings Peter's usually a 4, while Tony, Banner, Pym, etc are rated as 6 out of 7 points.

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Old 06-06-2012, 01:32 AM   #15
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

pym is also a genius too

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Old 06-06-2012, 06:14 AM   #16
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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pym is also a genius too
Yeah, I mentioned him on my list.

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Old 06-06-2012, 05:52 AM   #17
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

I've always been a little surprised they barely use the Leader as a major threat in the comics considering he's basically as smart as the Hulk is strong, therefore I'd assume he's smarter than both Reed & Doom making him very dangerous indeed.

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Old 06-06-2012, 04:31 PM   #18
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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I've always been a little surprised they barely use the Leader as a major threat in the comics considering he's basically as smart as the Hulk is strong, therefore I'd assume he's smarter than both Reed & Doom making him very dangerous indeed.
People often make that claim, but the Leader has never done *anything* to back it up. He may well be smarter than the likes of Stark and Pym, but the absolute best feats of his entire career barely compare with typical ones from the Reed/Doom pair.

Or, there is a guy smart enough to literally bust into the Gates of Heaven to bring back the dead. His name is not 'Leader'.

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Old 06-06-2012, 09:15 PM   #19
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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People often make that claim, but the Leader has never done *anything* to back it up. He may well be smarter than the likes of Stark and Pym, but the absolute best feats of his entire career barely compare with typical ones from the Reed/Doom pair.

Or, there is a guy smart enough to literally bust into the Gates of Heaven to bring back the dead. His name is not 'Leader'.

Who broke into Heaven and brought back the dead? And who wrote that tripe? Sometimes I read about the crap that passes for writing in comics now and I'm glad that I no longer read most of it.

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Old 06-06-2012, 06:08 AM   #20
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

Yeah considering that the guy is meant to be Hulk's archenemy he's rarely used in any serious fashion, if any character needs a major reintroduction it's the Leader.

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Old 06-06-2012, 08:33 AM   #21
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

Old Top Trumps or New Top Trumps?





>sigh< getting all nostalgic here - the new ones IMO dont even compare to the old ones. The old ones used the pics and stats from the Official Handbook and who doesnt love the official handbook (apart from the fact they never bothered to update Captain Britains powers for years, grrrrrr).

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Old 06-06-2012, 08:51 AM   #22
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

The picture isn't showing, but i'm talking about these ones:




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Old 06-06-2012, 01:34 PM   #23
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

Isn't the ultimate end of the road for Banner/Hulk becoming The Maestro and taking over the world?

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Old 06-06-2012, 02:14 PM   #24
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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Isn't the ultimate end of the road for Banner/Hulk becoming The Maestro and taking over the world?
It's a possible road. We've seen other roads, as in Hulk:The End.

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Old 06-06-2012, 03:49 PM   #25
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Default Re: The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 10

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Isn't the ultimate end of the road for Banner/Hulk becoming The Maestro and taking over the world?
Maestro was a future variation of the Merged Hulk(Gray + Savage + Banner personalities) that went crazy due to shrapnel in the brain and absorbing too much radiation consistantly over many years. He's a possible future.

One other possible version of an 'ultimate' Hulk was in the What If Planet Hulk story. Hulk and Banner seemingly merged perfectly, looked young and less bulky and seemed immortal, as they were still alive to see a race of beings evolve from an animal state to a technically advanced state.

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