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#76 |
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That "realm" is the real world.
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#77 | |
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This Wolverine kills for a living, in Tokyo. Everything he does in this story not only works because of its connections to the comic but because it depicts what Wolverine's life would really have been like had he once roamed the streets of urban Japan. There's not a single moment that feels forced or "comic-booky". He kills, he loves, he drinks, he has sex, he makes mistakes, he learns things, etc. Above all, he behaves like we would. Like a real person. |
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#78 | |
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I love Aronofsky's work. He has made amazing films and I am very high on him as a director. But, I am also high on Ang Lee. Look how Hulk turned out. Lee tried to do something different with Hulk, but in the process missed the point of Hulk. I see kind of the same thing here. Amazing filmmaker trying to make a character bend to his will as opposed to exploring him organically.
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Rating MCU films: Iron Man - 4/5, The Incredible Hulk - 4/5, Iron Man 2 - 3/5, Thor - 4/5, Captain America: The First Avenger - 5/5, The Avengers - 5/5, Iron Man 3 - 3.5/5, Thor: The Dark World - 3.5/5, Captain America: The Winter Soldier - 5/5, Guardians of the Galaxy - 4.5/5, Avengers: Age of Ultron - 4.5/5, Ant-Man - 4/5, Captain America: Civil War - 5/5, Dr. Strange - 4/5, Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 - 5/5, Spider-Man: Homecoming - 5/5, Thor: Ragnarok - 5/5, Black Panther - 5/5 Spider-Man 3 is a good movie. Yes. I said it RIP Vartha :csad: |
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#79 | |
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What in your opinion is he supposed to do to Yukio? Kill her? Tell her "stop it, Yukio, this is wrong."? You bring up Wolverine's moral center as if its being compromised in this story, better yet - by this one incident, but I don't see it being compromised at all. Aronofsky doesn't relish in morbid subject matter. He relishes in character exploration - which is what that scene is supposed to do. Show a man at his lowest point. Wolverine's "moral center" consists solely of not killing innocents. I can tell the whole thing sounds taboo to you - but taboos are exactly what this genre needs to break through. Aronofsky delves deep into the dark passages of his character's psyches. This is a story that takes Wolverine on a journey of existential discovery. Last edited by Alexei Belyakov; 10-19-2012 at 10:48 PM. |
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#80 |
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Sorry man, not following you here. What things need to be implied or expanded on film that havnt or cant be done in the comics for the character? And why would you consider not doing this to be a disservice to the genre? Do you have an example from another comic film?
Last edited by def28; 10-19-2012 at 10:26 PM. |
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#81 | |
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Clearly some people have a problem with the treatment of Wolverine which I just don't see in the context of the story. Everything he does seems in character considering his state of mind and surroundings. He's a killer who see's himself as an animal. Unhuman. On top of that he's in a relationship with a psychotic woman who loves that animal side of him. She brings out the worst in him. It's only natural that he'd get pulled down a black hole of murder, sex and debauchery. These actions are the natural manifistation of his character in this state of mind. I don't see any cavernous gaps between his actions and his moral center. Because it would break new ground and expand the possibilities of what you can do with these characters. |
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#82 | |
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These situations are happening to him because he's descended into darkness. When he's in the light, he's quite heroic. |
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#83 | |
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Last edited by def28; 10-20-2012 at 12:38 AM. |
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#84 |
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I love it how Aronofsky constructed the script with the ying yang duality of light and darkness.
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#85 | |
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#86 |
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Gotcha so Im assuming you have read the script by Aronfsky. I thought Alexei was the only one. I think I got this now haha. By "disgrace to the genre" you meant it would be a bad move to pass it up cause the script brings something new and groundbreaking we havnt seen or read with the character yet.
Last edited by def28; 10-20-2012 at 12:57 AM. |
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#87 | |
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Mariko representing light and having all her scenes with him take place during the day...brilliant. Then you get the flipside of that coin with Yukio's scenes with him all taking place at night. |
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#88 | |
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Yes. Especially in the film genre. Last edited by SoNicRaDiATioN; 10-20-2012 at 01:40 AM. |
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#89 | ||
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Well, Selina did have some lesbian allusions in TDKR. I suspected from my first viewing that Juno Temple was her companion. Too bad they didn't explore that. |
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#90 | |
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The word "mutant" is never used and only one person in the script knows Wolverine ain't human. As far as I'm concerned, this is the origin story. Its the beginning of the "Legend of Wolverine". |
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#91 | |
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Naturlly they won't show sex between peter and Gwen but you can show lead In to them getting Intimate and afterwords. There defently were lesbian allusion In dark Knight rises between Anne Hathaway and Juno Temple.It was another missed opportunity. |
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#92 | |
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Truth of the matter is, Nolan would have had to make a 4-hour film to flesh out Selina & Juno's relationship amongst other things. I think the final product was fantastic. |
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#93 | |
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That sounds more like a scene from Ichi The Killer.
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Last edited by def28; 10-20-2012 at 11:08 AM. |
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#94 |
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Here is the place to discuss the supposed original draft written by Darren Aronofsky before he left the project. Speculate away!
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#95 | ||
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Well, this hero works for a crime lord in Tokyo. He kills for that crime lord. How many heroes can you say the same thing about? The Punisher is the closest one & even then - Castle wouldn't allow himself to be a hired gun. Wolverine is lost in Japan. The screenplay serves two purposes: to showcase how lost he is & how he eventually finds himself. Truthfully, I'm not surprised people can't handle some realism in CBMs. Specially after 10 years of restrained adaptations that turned Wolverine into a pseudo-Captain America when in reality he's the very definition of the anti-hero. Last edited by Alexei Belyakov; 10-20-2012 at 01:08 PM. |
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#96 |
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By the way, just because we have a new thread for this...insufferable attitudes and insults will still not be tolerated. Let's keep this as a discussion and not a platform for blasting those who we do not agree with.
Thank you.
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#97 | |
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Portraying Wolverine strictly as a hero in XMOW was a mistake. He was completely innocent during the whole team X and Weapon plus thing. It completely contradicted what was said in X2 and we probably should have seen him do some really jacked up stuff to people. From the pics online this film looks to take place after hes met Xavier ( I could be wrong) and not prior. That is a huge change on Logan as a character. Its hard for me to picture him making some more questionable decisions after. Hes a full on hero and practically a caretaker last we see him in the film franchise. Doesnt mean he cant go ape **** on bad guys, but if hes making some disturning bad moral choices, it could seem a bit off for his character imo. There should be limits once a character has already gone through change. I take it Aronofskys was pre X Men, so this might have been more acceptable for the character to grow and learn here from some more disturbing moral choices, but if its post meeting the X team I dont think it would go to well. I trust Aronofsky as a film maker and think it would be awesome to see his version of the character. Im sure it would be radical change on screen from what weve seen. Doesnt mean others will or should agree. Last edited by def28; 10-20-2012 at 02:19 PM. |
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#98 |
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Fingers crossed the script just leaks on online. I wouldn't mind checking out a pdf of it.
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#99 | |
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Wolverine doesn't have to be for children, but am I asking too much in asking for a mature film that is actually in line with the moral center his years in comics have firmly made clear? Not just add shock value to "be more mature"
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Rating MCU films: Iron Man - 4/5, The Incredible Hulk - 4/5, Iron Man 2 - 3/5, Thor - 4/5, Captain America: The First Avenger - 5/5, The Avengers - 5/5, Iron Man 3 - 3.5/5, Thor: The Dark World - 3.5/5, Captain America: The Winter Soldier - 5/5, Guardians of the Galaxy - 4.5/5, Avengers: Age of Ultron - 4.5/5, Ant-Man - 4/5, Captain America: Civil War - 5/5, Dr. Strange - 4/5, Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 - 5/5, Spider-Man: Homecoming - 5/5, Thor: Ragnarok - 5/5, Black Panther - 5/5 Spider-Man 3 is a good movie. Yes. I said it RIP Vartha :csad: |
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#100 |
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I have no problems with those scenes. The lesbian scene is "extreme", but not totally out of character for Logan. He has a dirty mind, and it's from the time he didn't give a ****.
Even the interrogation thing is something we've seen in the comics. Somewhere in the Origins run.
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