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Old 04-19-2017, 07:18 PM   #26
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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let's not forget SW deals with WW2 fascism, Vietnam, and Eastern religion/philosophy.
At the most superficial level, perhaps.

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Old 04-19-2017, 07:53 PM   #27
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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At the most superficial level, perhaps.
If the OT is a superficial allegory then so is 90% of blockbusters, most of which are PG-13 or higher.

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Old 04-19-2017, 11:44 PM   #28
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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As an older fan what's your response to what Lucas said?
I think it was more defensive than insulting. I've seen several interviews since Ep.1 came out, and it seems to be his response to criticisms of characters like Jar Jar and the perceived overuse of CGI in the prequels. Most of the backlash came from veteran fans over the aforementioned areas that wouldn't been problematic for the pre-teens-and-younger crowd. While I understand that the new flavor of the prequels didn't satisfy everyone's taste, some people lost their minds over them. I don't blame Lucas for telling fans take a few deep breaths.

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Old 04-20-2017, 01:16 AM   #29
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Deep breaths?

Fans have been breathing easy since Disney starting releasing trailers.

It's like having kids with you first love, getting dumped because you you're no longer a spontaneous dreamer then finding out that your biological kids prefer their adventerous, successful step dad.

The best thing about the prequels is they show fans the limits of George Lucas' foresight before moving the franchise forward.

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Old 04-20-2017, 02:01 AM   #30
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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Deep breaths?

Fans have been breathing easy since Disney starting releasing trailers.

It's like having kids with you first love, getting dumped because you you're no longer a spontaneous dreamer then finding out that your biological kids prefer their adventerous, successful step dad.

The best thing about the prequels is they show fans the limits of George Lucas' foresight before moving the franchise forward.
We'll just have to disagree on Lucas' direction with the prequels. While I think it's fair to say that he was a little unsure of how to start his story in TPM, he hit the mark perfectly with AotC and RotS. I still don't understand what is so toxic about those to some fans. When I hear people say that George "ruined their childhoods" and see people smashing Jar Jar toys online, I roll my eyes. Lucas was right--older fans need to lighten up.

While I'm happy that Star Wars has returned, I haven't seen anything to date that is better than the prequels. TFA was solid, but it was overly familiar. RO took a long time to find its footing. I'm wondering if fans are so desperate for realistic effects and sets that they don't see that Disney has covered very little ground since getting the SW rights? We're still waiting for the Star Wars film that will truly advance the mythos.

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Old 04-20-2017, 02:19 AM   #31
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

You can watch Jar Jar scenes on repeat.

I'll take the new Disney films.

"Lighten up", lol.

Sounds like something Joel Schumacher would say after taking a giant neon dump on Batman.

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Old 04-20-2017, 03:49 AM   #32
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

It's just Lucas being Lucas. He randomly says contradictory nonsense. He didn't make star wars only for 12 year olds. And I suspect he is grumpy about the success and reception of the new films so he is trying to passive aggressively belittle the franchise.

I'm willing to bet, that if George could go back to 2012 he wouldn't sell Star Wars to Disney. I think it eats him up that new star wars films are so well received while his prequels are generally disliked at best and despised at worst.

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Old 04-20-2017, 09:34 AM   #33
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Jeez Marv, cut his chest open with a sword and and just pour the salt into the wound

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Old 04-20-2017, 04:45 PM   #34
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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Jeez Marv, cut his chest open with a sword and and just pour the salt into the wound
Only if you promise to flay him for me.

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Old 04-21-2017, 01:44 AM   #35
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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It's just Lucas being Lucas. He randomly says contradictory nonsense. He didn't make star wars only for 12 year olds. And I suspect he is grumpy about the success and reception of the new films so he is trying to passive aggressively belittle the franchise.

I'm willing to bet, that if George could go back to 2012 he wouldn't sell Star Wars to Disney. I think it eats him up that new star wars films are so well received while his prequels are generally disliked at best and despised at worst.
That's not a criticism supported by evidence. The prequels aren't as universally loved as the OT. That's easy to prove. On Rotten Tomatoes, the reviews of the various movies are mixed, but they skew toward the positive. Fan reviews are divisive, but they also lean more positive than negative. Many of the negative reviews, both from fans and critics on RT, have been in the last few years. There was a time not so long ago that all three prequels had a fresh consensus with a fan approval of 70% or more.

For reasons that are mostly silly, there is a vocal minority of Star Wars fans who take every opportunity to express outrage at the PT. That's where the erroneous perception that the PT is universally rejected has risen. They all had colossal box office draws, even TPM. There was also an undeniable renaissance of Star Wars enthusiasm that began in 1999 with the Phantom Menace, and part of the continued interest that has led to the Sequel Trilogy/anthology films is due to the PT. Lucas hit the mark, and he knows it. By now, he's understandably fed up with the small, malcontent segment of Star Wars fans who just can't let go of their unrealistic, unfulfilled expectations.

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Old 04-21-2017, 05:23 PM   #36
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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That's not a criticism supported by evidence. The prequels aren't as universally loved as the OT. That's easy to prove. On Rotten Tomatoes, the reviews of the various movies are mixed, but they skew toward the positive. Fan reviews are divisive, but they also lean more positive than negative. Many of the negative reviews, both from fans and critics on RT, have been in the last few years. There was a time not so long ago that all three prequels had a fresh consensus with a fan approval of 70% or more.

For reasons that are mostly silly, there is a vocal minority of Star Wars fans who take every opportunity to express outrage at the PT. That's where the erroneous perception that the PT is universally rejected has risen. They all had colossal box office draws, even TPM. There was also an undeniable renaissance of Star Wars enthusiasm that began in 1999 with the Phantom Menace, and part of the continued interest that has led to the Sequel Trilogy/anthology films is due to the PT. Lucas hit the mark, and he knows it. By now, he's understandably fed up with the small, malcontent segment of Star Wars fans who just can't let go of their unrealistic, unfulfilled expectations.
Uh, what?

Its simple, look at the box office. The prequels had decently big box offices beside AotC, which actually did really poor for a Star Wars movies and ended up getting crushed by Spider-Man, Harry Potter, and Two Towers. All the OT movies, adjusted for inflation, did more domestically then AotC did WW. And with Star Wars, you don't even need to adjusted it. It did more WW. And in comparison to the OT or the new films, it isn't even close. RotS lost out to another Potter film.

TPM made it to a billion eventually (thank you re-release), but that was almost all anticipation and hype. Imagine how much TPM would have made if it was actually well liked like TFA.

Other fun bit of trivia. TFA made more money domestically then RotS made WW. TFA and RO have already out gained the prequels. Even adjusted for inflation, Rogue One made more money then both AotC and RotS. A side story.

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Old 04-21-2017, 11:05 PM   #37
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

He certainly wasn't enthused about TFA, but from what I've heard, Lucas actually adored Rogue One so I don't think he blindly hates the new material or anything.

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Old 04-22-2017, 01:51 PM   #38
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I'm not surprised Lucas liked Rogue One. It does kind of feel like something he would direct.

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Old 04-22-2017, 10:47 PM   #39
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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I'm willing to bet, that if George could go back to 2012 he wouldn't sell Star Wars to Disney. I think it eats him up that new star wars films are so well received while his prequels are generally disliked at best and despised at worst.
Probably true.

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Old 04-22-2017, 10:51 PM   #40
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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For reasons that are mostly silly, there is a vocal minority of Star Wars fans who take every opportunity to express outrage at the PT. That's where the erroneous perception that the PT is universally rejected has risen. They all had colossal box office draws, even TPM. There was also an undeniable renaissance of Star Wars enthusiasm that began in 1999 with the Phantom Menace, and part of the continued interest that has led to the Sequel Trilogy/anthology films is due to the PT. Lucas hit the mark, and he knows it. By now, he's understandably fed up with the small, malcontent segment of Star Wars fans who just can't let go of their unrealistic, unfulfilled expectations.
What a preposterous theory. It's not a vocal minority, its much bigger than that, trust me.

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Old 04-22-2017, 11:07 PM   #41
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

Most Star Wars fans I know in real life hated Force Awakens. Even some who initially liked it now admit it was a disappointing retread. Rogue One got a more mixed reception (I thought it was alright).

I don't think Lucas has anything to worry about. The first three films were timeless classics (okay, the first two). The prequels were memorably bad.

Unless the next film breaks the trend, I expect a lackluster retread which no one will care about in 20 years.

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Old 04-23-2017, 03:43 AM   #42
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

That's funny, because everyone I've talked to really liked Force Awakens. There will be an entire generation of kids who will grow up watching TFA.

I've only seen TFA haters online.

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Old 04-23-2017, 06:52 PM   #43
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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That's funny, because everyone I've talked to really liked Force Awakens. There will be an entire generation of kids who will grow up watching TFA.

I've only seen TFA haters online.
That's been my experience as well.

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Old 04-23-2017, 11:51 PM   #44
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

When it comes to conversations like this, TC85's friends seem to always be contrarians.

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Old 04-23-2017, 11:57 PM   #45
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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That's funny, because everyone I've talked to really liked Force Awakens. There will be an entire generation of kids who will grow up watching TFA.

I've only seen TFA haters online.
I grew up on Phantom Menace. As a kid I thought it was great. Then my brain developed.

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Old 04-24-2017, 12:01 AM   #46
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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When it comes to conversations like this, TC85's friends seem to always be contrarians.
Birds of a feather, I suppose. Then again I doubt I'd be friends with someone who thought Force Awakens was anything but an uninspired retread with retrospect.

It's like how some people here refuse to see how Daisy Ridley's character is practically a Mary Sue. If we can't agree on that, we're going to have a hard time agreeing on anything else.


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Old 04-24-2017, 12:30 AM   #47
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Birds of a feather, I suppose. Then again I doubt I'd be friends with someone who thought Force Awakens was anything but an uninspired retread with retrospect.

It's like how some people here refuse to see how Daisy Ridley's character is practically a Mary Sue. If we can't agree on that, we're going to have a hard time agreeing on anything else.
It is because she isn't a Mary Sue. So either you really haven't seen The Force Awakens, you are misremembering it or you just don't know what a Mary Sue is.

TFA destroyed all opening weekend numbers domestically, and then proceeded to have very good legs. It did over a billion overseas. It reviewed beautifully. The anticipation for TLJ is by all measures through the roof and has been treading along side the biggest releases of the year so far, and it is stilll over 230 days away.

But yeah, I am sure the vast majority of people totally didn't like TFA and TLJ is going to do Power Rangers numbers.

http://pro.boxoffice.com/movie/28991...-the-last-jedi

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Old 04-24-2017, 12:41 AM   #48
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

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It is because she isn't a Mary Sue. So either you really haven't seen The Force Awakens, you are misremembering it or you just don't know what a Mary Sue is.

TFA destroyed all opening weekend numbers domestically, and then proceeded to have very good legs. It did over a billion overseas. It reviewed beautifully. The anticipation for TLJ is by all measures through the roof and has been treading along side the biggest releases of the year so far, and it is stilll over 230 days away.

But yeah, I am sure the vast majority of people totally didn't like TFA and TLJ is going to do Power Rangers numbers.

http://pro.boxoffice.com/movie/28991...-the-last-jedi
The vast majority of people will flock to see Fast and Furious 17. I never said that most people don't like TFA. Just a lot of people I know and that the number seems to be growing.

If you like the film that's fine. But you're never going to convince me that it's anything other than a soulless, derivative studio product. Or that Rey isn't a Mary Sue (that seems less subjective to me, but whatever). I watched the film twice. I am not misremembering her beating a Jedi knight in her first light saber battle, or her knowing the Millennium Falcon better than Han Solo. Or her performing Jedi mind tricks the same day she learned the Jedi were real. I wish I was.

I really hope TLJ is better. At least Mark Hamil gives a ****, whereas all Harrison Ford wanted was for his character to die. So, here's hoping.

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Old 04-24-2017, 02:09 AM   #49
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The vast majority of people will flock to see Fast and Furious 17. I never said that most people don't like TFA. Just a lot of people I know and that the number seems to be growing.

If you like the film that's fine. But you're never going to convince me that it's anything other than a soulless, derivative studio product. Or that Rey isn't a Mary Sue (that seems less subjective to me, but whatever). I watched the film twice. I am not misremembering her beating a Jedi knight in her first light saber battle, or her knowing the Millennium Falcon better than Han Solo. Or her performing Jedi mind tricks the same day she learned the Jedi were real. I wish I was.

I really hope TLJ is better. At least Mark Hamil gives a ****, whereas all Harrison Ford wanted was for his character to die. So, here's hoping.
You were using anecdotal evidence to project on the general reaction to TFA. One that clearly isn't in anyway the case.

Also yes, people flock to the Furious flicks. I don't particularly enjoy them outside of Fast 5, but they have a following and review decently as of late. But the Furious flicks also didn't review like TFA nor has any destroyed the domestic box office record like it was nothing.

I need not convince you of anything about the movie. it is one of my favorites of all time, and I see plenty of Abrams in it, and a very large amount of heart. You don't, that's fine. But I do not project my own reaction to general audiences either.

Also yeah, you totally are misremembering. Because she never fought a Jedi Knight in the movie. There is only one Jedi Knight in the movie, and he lives on an island and literally says not one word in the movie. She did fight an injured, mentally compromised Kylo Ren, who hasn't finished his training and was not trying to kill her.

As to her mechanical ability. Considering she spent around a decade on a desert planet as both a mechanic and scavenger, you are surprised about her understanding how a ship works? Especially as Han was notorious for being not all that great with keeping up the maintenance of the Falcon. Also Han would have no idea what was done to the ship since it has been out of his possession. You know who would? Someone who worked on it. Like oh... Rey.

By the way, there is a long history of old EU and canon of Force Sensitive people demonstrating an ability to use the Force before training. These guys named Luke and Anakin even did it. Where you confused when Luke Skywalker, a person who has never been off of Tatooine or in a Starfighter was able to blow up the Death Star using the Force the same day he learned about the Jedi?

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Old 04-24-2017, 02:47 AM   #50
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Default Re: George Lucas: "I made Star Wars for 12 year olds"

I've come to understand that some folks will dislike a movie because it just didn't speak to them for whatever reason. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. Honestly, I'd prefer that as a response to some of the usual reasons like "Mary Sue" or whatever. As I've pointed out several times, and others have as well, the entire SW saga is chock-a-block with these characters who seem to do no wrong or can do the impossible without a smidgen of training or experience. So if you don't like Rey, you can't possibly like Anakin, Luke, Obi-Wan, etc.

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