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#51 |
Didn't eat Billy
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Atlanta, GA
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Are these art prints yours? If so, where did you get them?
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#52 |
Side-Kick
Join Date: Jul 2006
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No they dont.I found them on an other messege boards and the guy who posted them said he got them in a trade.
He was trying to find some info on them.
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#53 |
Didn't eat Billy
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![]() ![]() ^This one is the toughest painting of the bunch for me to pin down. There's just too much going on from possible different sources. The jet-shaped head in the robot and alt mode is like a late-'70s super-robot or even an early '80s live-action Super Sentai robot. The huge shoulders are definitely late-'80s anime style, while the legs sort of look like something out of Mospeada (3rd Gen Robotech), as seen below... ![]() But there's not really any "smoking gun" I can find with that painting that's a single obvious design source. So when all is said and done, I'm afraid I can't state for sure the origin and purpose of those robot paintings. However, I will offer a couple final opinions about what those paintings are NOT... They are NOT unused Takara designs for the Transformers line. Reasons: 1. Assuming the Takara dates stamped on the back are legit, Takara would not have been custom-designing robots for Hasbro's TF line in March of 1985. There were still plenty of pre-existing Diaclone and MicroChange designs being used that year. 2. The alt modes in the paintings are all futuristic, non-realistic looking vehicles. In early 1985, the Transformers vehicle modes were still mostly based on normal earth machines (not counting the Dinobots and Insecticons of course). TF: The movie was still far enough away that there would have been no demand for Cybertronian or futuristic alt modes at that point. 3. The alt vehicle modes in the paintings also have a definite 1970s aesthetic to them that doesn't fit in with the 1980s-style Takara Transformers designs. The heads of the robots shaped like entire jet planes is the type of thing seen on gigantic 150 foot-tall super-robots, not 30 foot-tall Transformers. Plus, a couple of the alt-modes look too simplistic to be Transformer designs, particularly the "Daimos" truck (more on that one later). 4. Finally, the particular elements of a couple of those paintings that seem swiped from 1970s robots would have already been seen in the US in 1985, in the form of Bandai's Godaikin line, which had been on US toy shelves since 1983. They are NOT designs for Takara robot toys that were going to be released in Japan in 1985. Reasons: 1. My main argument centers on this particular painting: ![]() That basic robot form and particularly the vehicle form are totally recognizable as Daimos... ![]() ![]() Daimos truck design and anime scene There's simply no way that Takara could get away with a licensed design that looked so much like a well-known and unique vehicle from a pre-existing series. Not only in Japan is that true, but also in the US, where Daimos had been imported by Bandai/Popy as both a Shogun Warrior in 1979 and a Godaikin in 1983. Americans would have been fooled by the minor design changes of course, but not the Japanese. I don't think Bandai would have let Takara use such a similar design in either country. 2. The "mixing and matching" in those paintings that would fool Americans would not fool the Japanese. I could see a smaller, unknown company borrowing designs like that, or certainly a Chinese company, but not Takara. Aside from the likelyhood of being busted for it, there were plenty of original robot concepts around in 1985 Japan so that swiping designs wasn't even necessary. So, taking all that into account, I have to say that I'm inclined to stick with my original position on those paintings. I think they are clever, fan-made (or unauthorized bootleg) designs stamped with a bogus Takara copyright just to excite discussion among American Transformers fans. They weren't produced in 1985, based on the designs used, so I'd say someone whipped them up during the 1990s or later. That's my Japanese robot-geek's opinion, anyway. ![]() Last edited by The Lizard; 02-23-2009 at 11:08 AM. |
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#54 | ||||
Side-Kick
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Its one of my guesses that the painting may have been part of a presentation for selling the design and likeness to Takara. Again thanks.
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#55 | |||
Didn't eat Billy
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The guy who has that artwork should contact Takara/Tomy, show them the artwork and ask them directly. That's probably the only way we can find out for sure. |
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#56 | |
Side-Kick
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Why thank you.
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Look at Jetfire.First owned by a company that went under and bought up by Bandi. But before Bandi picked them up Hasbro bought the rights to produce and market its likeness in the U.S. and some markets abroad. Now some of the "Jetfires" released by Hasbro were re-paints/repacks of existing back stock bought from Takatoku but many were newly produced figures made useing the mold. Do you know who produced those figures for Hasbro????? Takara did. Not only that but Hasbro had Takara partisipate in the redesining of "Skyfire". So it wouldnt shock me if one of those companies [who may have still owned some of the rights] tried to sell its product to Hasbro and Hasbro had Takara designers make those painting as a selling tool. I think I suggested that once.
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#57 | |||
Didn't eat Billy
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I think this is one of those cases where Occam's Razor applies (ie: the simplest solution is the most likely). If the guy who owns that artwork hasn't attempted to get an answer from Takara to clear up the issue, there's probably a reason, and that reason might be that it's fan-art or bootleg art. |
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#58 | ||||||
Side-Kick
Join Date: Jul 2006
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I've seen a rare few over the years. A friend owned one and I saw at leat 2 at different TF conventions I've attended. I'm not sure how many were made or for what market they were made for, U.S. or international, but I have seen them. I had a pic of one on my pc once....I'll see if I can dig it up. Quote:
Because if it was under licensing I could see how the concepts were being shopped around for a new buyer. Quote:
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Truth be told I dont.
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#59 | ||
Didn't eat Billy
Join Date: Dec 2000
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Cool. A Valkyrie with a Takara manufacturer's stamp would be quite a collectible to own. Please post pics if you find them.
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http://www.c-player.com/ac39907/message Last edited by The Lizard; 02-24-2009 at 10:26 AM. |
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#60 |
Didn't eat Billy
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OK, time to wrap this up!
XIII. Global Robotic Revolution The nostalgia for classic giant robots that firmly took hold in Japan in the late 1990s continued unabated into the 21st century with anime series and OVAs updating '70s classics like Mazinkaiser (2001), New Getter Robo (2004) and the CGI-enhanced Reideen (2007). 1980s toy favorites like Zoids (1999-2005) and Armored Trooper VOTOMS (2007) also made a comeback. The light-hearted King of Braves, GaoGaiGar Final OVA series (2000-2003) brought back the final entry in the "Brave" series of transforming robot TV anime from the '90s. ![]() New Getter Robo (2004) and Reideen (2007) While there were still anime and toy lines following the mystical Evangelion formula, classic super-robot elements were added, as seen in the series RahXephon (2002) and Demonbane (2006). The popularity of the super-robot genre would increase even more with the release of Gurren Lagann (2007), an often-comedic anime series featuring extreme robot designs and satirical over-the-top action. ![]() Gurran Lagan diecast toy by Bandai, 2007 The Macross series also continued to be updated, with the prequel OVA Macross Zero (2002-2004) and the sequel TV series Macross Frontier (2008). Unfortunately, the distrubution of the Macross series and toys in the US has had problems due to US company Harmony Gold (producers of Robotech) holding international rights to the Macross robots and storylines. Highly detailed Macross toys made by Japanese collector toy company Yamato could not be imported to the US, so American company Toynami bought the rights and have sold the "masterpiece series" of Robotech mecha from Macross and Mospeada, much to the delight of collectors. Both Toynami and Yamato have gone on to produce many detailed upgrades of classic '80s transforming robots as well. ![]() Toynami Robotech Alpha and Beta (2008) and Yamato Megazone 23 Garland (2007) The collectors' market is the target of several other robot toy lines that have popped up in Japan within recent years. Japanese model company Kaiyodo introduced the "Revoltech" series of toys in 2006, featuring non-transforming but highly poseable action figures of such beloved robots as Tetsujin 28, Dougram, and even Optimus Prime and Megatron. On a related note, Takara merged with Tomy, another well-known Japanese toy company (and creators of other classic robot toy lines like Zoids), in 2005 to become "TakaraTomy". Since Tomy is the recognizable brand name outside of Japan, TakaraTomy just goes by "Tomy" in the US. ![]() A selection of Kaiyodo's "Revoltech" super-poseable figures After the success of the 2007 Transformers film, the new Transformers Animated cartoon series premiered on Cartoon Network in December of that year. An updated storyline unrelated to any previous cartoon or film, and heavily stylized artwork were introduced for the new animated series. The characters were designed by Hasbro and Cartoon Network, and the 2008 toy adaptations created by TakaraTomy have increased the articulation of the robot modes yet again. ![]() Transformers Animated cartoon and toys (2008) Now directly-imported Japanese TV shows and OVAs are quickly and easily accesable in many countries. The internet brings instant news updates of new transforming robot toys, online import stores to order from and streaming video of the latest anime. It's now easier than ever to enjoy cutting edge robot designs. The simultaneous popularity of "old school" versions, stylized animation versions, and updated live-action versions of Japanese transforming robots guarantees a large variety of fun TV shows, movies, games and toy products for years to come. ![]() The end! Woo-hoo! ![]() |
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#61 | |||
Side-Kick
Join Date: Jul 2006
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If I remember correctly they said Takara/hasbro or the other way around. Bear in mind I dont discount the possibility that they were faked...I have only seen about 3 or 4 in my life time. Quote:
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And your continued work on this thread is great.
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#62 |
Didn't eat Billy
Join Date: Dec 2000
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2009 marks the 30th anniversary of the groundbreaking anime series Mobile Suit Gundam, so those wacky Japanese will be building a 60 foot tall fiberglass Gundam statue at Tokyo's Odaiba island in July.
![]() CGI simulation of completed Gundam statue |
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#63 | |
Side-Kick
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Kool ![]()
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#64 |
Side-Kick
Join Date: Feb 2006
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DYNAMO
BATTLE TURN!!!!! ![]() this is the BEST thread EVER!!! ![]()
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#65 |
Avan a Good Time
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Yes it is pretty good, I'd almost recommend it for some sort of SSH award for when the time comes for the hype awards.
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#66 |
Didn't eat Billy
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Since today is the first day of spring, and the general timeframe for the first shipments of Transformers toys to US toy stores was spring 1984, I'll just take this opportunity to say...
Happy 25th Anniversary to "The Transformers"!!! ![]() |
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#67 |
Avan a Good Time
Join Date: Aug 2006
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Happy Birthday Transformers
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#68 |
Side-Kick
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Hey Lizard,
can you give any backstory as to how Robotech characters got licensed to be sold as GoBots? I remember building Cy-kill from a model of Lancer.
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#69 | |
Didn't eat Billy
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The few GoBots model kits released by Monogram in 1985 were mostly kit versions of a few of Bandai's existing Machine Robo robots. These were smaller-sized model kits of GoBots such as "Spay-C". ![]() However, Monogram wanted to release some larger-sized models as part of their GoBots series as well, presumably to present something similar to the "Super GoBots" toys. However, there were no large-size Machine Robo models available, so Monogram bought the rights to a couple of transforming model kits made in Japan by Imai and based on the mecha from the anime series Mospeada (later known as 3rd generation Robotech in the US). Since these kits transformed into a jet and a motorcycle, it must have seemed an easy idea to claim them as the GoBots "Leader 1" and "Cy-Kill". Of course, these models looked nothing like the actual GoBots characters, and they were MUCH more complicated to build than the other simplistic GoBots kits. Finding these kits was a treat for Robotech fans however, as there were no other model kits from Mospeada licensed to sell in the US at that time. ![]() Monogram "Leader-1" GoBots model Originally the Mospeada Legioss AFC-01I variable fighter Robotech name: Rook Bartley's Alpha Veritech (red) ![]() Monogram "Cy-Kill" GoBots model Originally the Mospeada VR41H Ride Armor Blowsuperior (Yellow Belmont type) Robotech name: Veritech Cyclone VR41H (Lancer, AKA: Yellow Dancer) |
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#70 |
Didn't eat Billy
Join Date: Dec 2000
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Bumped for awesome completed Gundam statue in Japan, and for upcoming TF movie
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#71 |
Side-Kick
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Rochester NY
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Nice
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#72 |
Didn't eat Billy
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gotta love that SHH lag
Last edited by The Lizard; 12-03-2009 at 12:54 AM. |
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#73 |
Didn't eat Billy
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Well, 2009 is almost at an end, so the 25th anniversary of the Transformers comes to a close. Here's a few noteworthy items we saw this year...
![]() Leader Class Optimus Prime and Human Alliance Bumblebee, two of the most complex, highly-detailed toys from the "Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen" series. ![]() Japanese Masterpiece edition Grimlock. Coming to US stores in 2010. ![]() Macross SDF-1 large scale transforming toy by Yamato ![]() 2009 Japanese TV anime series Rideback Last edited by The Lizard; 12-03-2009 at 12:45 AM. |
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#74 | |
Indiana Bart
Join Date: Apr 2001
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#75 |
Didn't eat Billy
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^ I must admit that the leader-class ROTF Prime toy really changed my attitude towards the movie TF toy designs. I still don't like how a lot of them were handled (notably Devastator, Starscream, Arcee and Jetfire), but the movie Autobot deluxe toys are truly a big step forward in TF detail and transformation mechanics.
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