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Old 09-11-2017, 11:47 PM   #626
KillerMcQueen
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

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It doesn't help that they're were very immediate follow ups, either. But yeah, I think they're both middle tier more than anything. For me personally I'd say the very worst of the franchise are:

Diamonds Are Forever
A View to a Kill
Die Another Day
The Man with the Golden Gun
Moonraker
Diamonds Are Forever is still the only one that I've never been able to make myself sit through in one go, just awful, from a complete failure to follow up on OHMSS in a non-insulting manner, to Connery doing a frankly s*** job as Bond, and the overall movie just being a mess of stupidity, not one moment of the film stands out to me as being decent, as bad as the rest of the films you listed are, they at least had some redeeming qualities, I can't find one in Diamonds.

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Old 09-12-2017, 12:01 AM   #627
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Yeah I think it's without a doubt the worst thing to come out of the series, it verges on a parody at times.

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Old 09-12-2017, 06:49 AM   #628
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

It does indeed, but I'll be honest, for me it does has it's moments.

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Old 09-12-2017, 08:47 AM   #629
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Not properly following up on Tracy's death was one of the biggest mistakes that this franchises has ever made imo.

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Old 09-12-2017, 10:18 AM   #630
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

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I always said that Bond should have a tv series - with budgets the way they are, it's easy. focus on decent story telling - look at early Dr Who, Sherlock, Spooks, luthor, Poldark - telling me they can't come up with something snazzy?

Thing is, personally, for me, spectre put me off Bond, Casino Royale was such a game changer, i was disappointed with the slight exception of sky fall.

I think Henry Cavil is prime for a Bond reboot.
I don't know about a TV series but I'm surprised EON hasn't done spin off movies.

Some folks seem to be caling for a Black Bond or a female Bond. Why not do a spin off film with another 00 Agent who could be either of those things. The supporting cast of Bond would be the same (Moneypenny, Q, Tanner, M) and you would have the benefit of being able to do a movie not as beholden to the Bond mythos but set within the Bond universe.

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Old 09-12-2017, 01:57 PM   #631
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

They were thinking about doing a Wai Lin spinoff back in the day (which I totally would have gone to see).

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Old 09-12-2017, 04:22 PM   #632
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

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They were thinking about doing a Wai Lin spinoff back in the day (which I totally would have gone to see).
Jinx was possibly going to get a spinoff as well, which I'm fine with not ever happening.

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Old 09-12-2017, 05:10 PM   #633
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Serious question. What would they call a female Bond? Jane Bond? Janet Bond?

Im willing to give a female Bond a try, but Im not sure about it. James is a man that drinks way too much and sleeps with most pretty women he comes across. Personally I have zero problem with a woman doing those things. Women are free to drink as much as they want to and sleep with whoever they want to. If a man can do it a woman should be able to do it as well. But general audiences might not take to a woman who drinks like a fish and who has more notches on her belt than the corner prostitute. Like it or not women that sleep with a lot of people are perceived in a much more negative light than men who sleep with a lot of people. Its a double standard but it exists. So Im not sure EON would want to try to overcome that double standard. They could give us a female Bond that doesnt drink much and has a steady relationship or doesnt sleep around much but at that point you'd be removing a part of the escapism of the films so is it even worth it?

What I would suggest is introducing an entirely new Double O agent that is a woman. Have her work with Bond. Maybe she is new to the program and Bond is supposed to be training her. They end up having to take down a villain and stop an evil plot. Then if the character is received well by general audiences do a spinoff film with her. Or bring the character back once in a while in future films.


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Old 09-12-2017, 05:13 PM   #634
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Jinx movie would've been a disaster. They dodged a huge bullet there.

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Old 09-12-2017, 06:56 PM   #635
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

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Serious question. What would they call a female Bond? Jane Bond? Janet Bond?

Im willing to give a female Bond a try, but Im not sure about it. James is a man that drinks way too much and sleeps with most pretty women he comes across. Personally I have zero problem with a woman doing those things. Women are free to drink as much as they want to and sleep with whoever they want to. If a man can do it a woman should be able to do it as well. But general audiences might not take to a woman who drinks like a fish and who has more notches on her belt than the corner prostitute. Like it or not women that sleep with a lot of people are perceived in a much more negative light than men who sleep with a lot of people. Its a double standard but it exists. So Im not sure EON would want to try to overcome that double standard. They could give us a female Bond that doesnt drink much and has a steady relationship or doesnt sleep around much but at that point you'd be removing a part of the escapism of the films so is it even worth it?

What I would suggest is introducing an entirely new Double O agent that is a woman. Have her work with Bond. Maybe she is new to the program and Bond is supposed to be training her. They end up having to take down a villain and stop an evil plot. Then if the character is received well by general audiences do a spinoff film with her. Or bring the character back once in a while in future films.
Honestly I wouldn't want them to try, unlike a lot of roles where gender swaps have been suggested or have happened, James Bond is one case where the character's gender actually is a big part of the character himself. They'd be far better off trying to come up with a new female lead agent/franchise that is done in a similar style to Bond, because it just wouldn't be the same character, and keeping the Bond name would feel forced to me.

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Old 09-12-2017, 07:07 PM   #636
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Atomic Bond.

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Old 09-13-2017, 04:12 AM   #637
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Ha, brilliant

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Old 09-13-2017, 07:05 AM   #638
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

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I don't know about a TV series but I'm surprised EON hasn't done spin off movies.

Some folks seem to be caling for a Black Bond or a female Bond. Why not do a spin off film with another 00 Agent who could be either of those things. The supporting cast of Bond would be the same (Moneypenny, Q, Tanner, M) and you would have the benefit of being able to do a movie not as beholden to the Bond mythos but set within the Bond universe.
I like the idea in principle [as in general I don't think we see the other 00's enough] but in my mind it kind of runs the risk of making Bond redundant - sort of like how there was a guy who was better, smarter, faster, stronger than Jason Bourne around all along [in Renner's character] so you kind of question why Bourne was then so special so as to deserve all that effort and attention.

Personally, I've always liked the smaller scale idea of a simple scene or two where Bond meets with other 00's to talk shop, with said 00's being played by popular 007 casting choices [in this case Elba, Isaacs, Owen etc]. If they could get those guys to agree to cameo, that would be absolutely awesome and damn fun to watch.

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Old 09-13-2017, 07:40 AM   #639
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

It makes zero sense to gender swap Bond. If you want to make a female spy franchise then just, you know, create a new one and let it become its own thing and allow it to evolve naturally.

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Old 09-13-2017, 08:29 AM   #640
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

I thought the bigger problem with Renner's character is the whole super soldier science fiction pill plot.

Jason Bourne was just a extremely well trained and resourceful spy/assassin and then they introduced some magic pill BS tothea franchise which was marketed on being more grounded than the Bonds and Mission Impossible super spy franchises.

What makes Bond unique in the movies is that he is depicted as being the maverick of the 00 Program. Not following orders and going rogue but always managing to get result is his thing.

In Goldfinger and The Living Daylights M threatens to replace Bond with 008 who seems like a more by the book agent.

I think a different 00 agent could bring something different to the franchise. There would be things you could do with this new character that you couldn't do with Bond. It is less about which agent is superior and more about two different perspectives from two different 00 Agents.

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Old 09-13-2017, 08:39 AM   #641
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

I just don't see how this works either. You may as well just develop something new because you can't market it as a 007 film. I feel like people are over complicating things, Bond is not the type of franchise that lends itself to an extended universe. If it was a series about MI6 it would be a different story, but it's always been a series about one character.

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Old 09-13-2017, 08:55 AM   #642
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

I'm hoping for the "All is Lost" extended universe



I think that film lends itself well to that.

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Old 09-13-2017, 09:07 AM   #643
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

I'd be content for the franchise to remain as it is, but if they do go the direction of making spinoffs (as they've toyed with in the past) I could see characters from other agencies working. A Felix Leiter film showing what he gets up to with the CIA could be interesting and radically different from the Bond formula if they approached it right.

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Old 09-13-2017, 09:22 AM   #644
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

We all know the spin off we all want to see is Jeffrey Wright's baller "does it look like we need the money" Felix Leiter making it rain on strippers for two hours

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Old 09-13-2017, 10:52 AM   #645
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

I'm bleeding chips.

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Old 09-13-2017, 11:43 AM   #646
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Honestly I'd probably go see a Felix Leiter film if it starred Jeffrey Wright, I really like him. And Felix is different enough from Bond that it'd feel like its own thing.

And that'd be the key to making a spinoff work I think. It should be it's own thing with it's own feel (while perhaps have a few of the trappings of a Bond film).

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Old 09-13-2017, 12:55 PM   #647
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

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Originally Posted by Marvolo View Post
Serious question. What would they call a female Bond? Jane Bond? Janet Bond?

Im willing to give a female Bond a try, but Im not sure about it. James is a man that drinks way too much and sleeps with most pretty women he comes across. Personally I have zero problem with a woman doing those things. Women are free to drink as much as they want to and sleep with whoever they want to. If a man can do it a woman should be able to do it as well. But general audiences might not take to a woman who drinks like a fish and who has more notches on her belt than the corner prostitute.

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Old 09-13-2017, 11:23 PM   #648
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvolo View Post
Serious question. What would they call a female Bond? Jane Bond? Janet Bond?

Im willing to give a female Bond a try, but Im not sure about it. James is a man that drinks way too much and sleeps with most pretty women he comes across. Personally I have zero problem with a woman doing those things. Women are free to drink as much as they want to and sleep with whoever they want to. If a man can do it a woman should be able to do it as well. But general audiences might not take to a woman who drinks like a fish and who has more notches on her belt than the corner prostitute. Like it or not women that sleep with a lot of people are perceived in a much more negative light than men who sleep with a lot of people. Its a double standard but it exists. So Im not sure EON would want to try to overcome that double standard. They could give us a female Bond that doesnt drink much and has a steady relationship or doesnt sleep around much but at that point you'd be removing a part of the escapism of the films so is it even worth it?

What I would suggest is introducing an entirely new Double O agent that is a woman. Have her work with Bond. Maybe she is new to the program and Bond is supposed to be training her. They end up having to take down a villain and stop an evil plot. Then if the character is received well by general audiences do a spinoff film with her. Or bring the character back once in a while in future films.
They already did a female Bond, pretty well too.. atomic blonde!

I don't get why people and studios can't just be original or demand originality. a Jane Bond would just be a female actor, where is the fun in that. It would need to be a new style, new persona, there for no actual links to Bond per se.

A black bond is fine, or whatever colour they like, so long as it is James Bond that we know. Idris Elba would be great. He's a great actor. We don't some urban twist, or some liberal tweak to please the SJW's.

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Old 09-13-2017, 11:40 PM   #649
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

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I like the idea in principle [as in general I don't think we see the other 00's enough] but in my mind it kind of runs the risk of making Bond redundant - sort of like how there was a guy who was better, smarter, faster, stronger than Jason Bourne around all along [in Renner's character] so you kind of question why Bourne was then so special so as to deserve all that effort and attention.

Personally, I've always liked the smaller scale idea of a simple scene or two where Bond meets with other 00's to talk shop, with said 00's being played by popular 007 casting choices [in this case Elba, Isaacs, Owen etc]. If they could get those guys to agree to cameo, that would be absolutely awesome and damn fun to watch.
I totally agree, i have been championing this for ages, the oo agents can make a perfect basis for a TV show or origins movie.

The oo agents are individual and unique - each one has a decent back story - how did they get there.

What they need to do is with a new Bond, the first film needs to show his origins, as an example, him in the navy being tapped up by her majesty (ooh err) and then we see his early missions with the team around him, the dynamic, how he does, the botch jobs that give him his facial scar. Then we see him getting onto the oo list.

That's movie one.

Movie 2 we see him working in pairs/groups, we see him flirting with money penny in the field etc.

Then movie 2.5 is a oo agents movie that connects to the second Bond film.

Then they can both go their separate ways

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Old 09-13-2017, 11:41 PM   #650
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Default Re: Bond 25 - Part 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvolo View Post
Serious question. What would they call a female Bond? Jane Bond? Janet Bond?

Im willing to give a female Bond a try, but Im not sure about it. James is a man that drinks way too much and sleeps with most pretty women he comes across. Personally I have zero problem with a woman doing those things. Women are free to drink as much as they want to and sleep with whoever they want to. If a man can do it a woman should be able to do it as well. But general audiences might not take to a woman who drinks like a fish and who has more notches on her belt than the corner prostitute. Like it or not women that sleep with a lot of people are perceived in a much more negative light than men who sleep with a lot of people. Its a double standard but it exists. So Im not sure EON would want to try to overcome that double standard. They could give us a female Bond that doesnt drink much and has a steady relationship or doesnt sleep around much but at that point you'd be removing a part of the escapism of the films so is it even worth it?

What I would suggest is introducing an entirely new Double O agent that is a woman. Have her work with Bond. Maybe she is new to the program and Bond is supposed to be training her. They end up having to take down a villain and stop an evil plot. Then if the character is received well by general audiences do a spinoff film with her. Or bring the character back once in a while in future films.
They already did a female Bond, pretty well too.. atomic blonde!

I don't get why people and studios can't just be original or demand originality. a Jane Bond would just be a female actor, where is the fun in that. It would need to be a new style, new persona, there for no actual links to Bond per se.

A black bond is fine, or whatever colour they like, so long as it is James Bond that we know. Idris Elba would be great. He's a great actor. We don't some urban twist, or some liberal tweak to please the SJW's.

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