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Old 08-14-2018, 08:25 AM   #901
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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That's not how it came off at all.
Yeah, that's PRECISELY how it came off to me as well.
Seems like you may be the only one for whom it did not come across that way. And, considering the context of pretty much EVERY single Bruce and Lucius conversation in the entire trilogy, this would have to be the one and ONLY time he did not playfully keep up the act

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Old 08-14-2018, 09:58 AM   #902
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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Yeah, Bruce's reaction when he realises Lucius is in the room, the way he changes his demeanour from that point on, and the little look he gives Alfred before saying "Am I supposed to understand any of that?" all point towards him trying to cover.
Yeah, the alarmed look Bruce gives when Lucius enters is the giveaway there.

I'm not saying TDKT tried to portray Bruce as a scientific genius, but he's blatantly playing into the airhead playboy 'character' the moment Lucius enters the room, even though they have a bit of a "wink wink, nudge nudge" type of understanding. That's why it's a funny scene and their scenes together were always charming.

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Old 08-14-2018, 10:07 AM   #903
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

But then the joke makes no sense. Explain how that joke makes sense, if he knows exactly what Lucius is saying.

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Old 08-14-2018, 10:26 AM   #904
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

I'm not even saying Bruce literally knew everything he was talking about, nor did I say that, but the overall gag in that scene is Bruce slipping into his playboy persona.

I guess what I'm saying is, just cause Bruce isn't a scientist doesn't mean advanced scientific concepts are totally beyond his comprehension or he's incapable of learning. He's clearly intelligent in Begins, just not an automatic expert on everything there is to know about everything- hence his relationship with Lucius. But in that scene he is acting all "Your big words are making my head hurt" and that plays into the playboy persona who is clearly not the real Bruce. The joke is that he is acting intellectually incurious there, and I don't think there's anything in the trilogy to support that he actually is. In fact, Lucius wanting Bruce to figure out how to fix the autopilot on The Bat in Rises because it requires "a more interested mind" just goes to show that even Lucius respects Bruce's mind, even if he's not up to his level. He knows he's smart enough to figure things out.

Anyway, there is clearly room to amp up Bruce's intellect in ways that haven't been done on film yet, I'm not saying TDKT portrayed him as a genius when clearly Lucius' whole existence in that trilogy is to be the tech guy. Though I do think it led to some fun on-screen banter.


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Old 08-14-2018, 10:27 AM   #905
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

Exactly. He's keeping up the pretense right to the end, even feigning ignorance on what Lucius is saying about the antidote.

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Old 08-14-2018, 10:59 AM   #906
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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I'm not even saying Bruce literally knew everything he was talking about, nor did I say that, but the overall gag in that scene is Bruce slipping into his playboy persona....the joke is that he is acting intellectually incurious there, and I don't think there's anything in the trilogy to support that he actually is.
Acting intellectually incurious and not understand are two different things, and that's what started this entire conversation. TheVileOne said Bruce should understand what is being told to him. We all know Bruce and Lucius put on a facade, and do this little roundabout humor, where they dance around the notion that Bruce is Batman(which they do throughout the trilogy), but again, that's not what the point was.

But I guess you did say that Bruce may not literally know what is being said to him. I dunno, I thought you were agreeing to the claims that Bruce really does understand everything that Lucius was telling him, because I disagree with that particular part of the scene. I do agree he's putting on his dumb playboy facade, but I don't see how it makes sense to think he understood what Lucius was saying to him. Lucius' line wouldn't make sense if he did.

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Old 08-14-2018, 11:59 AM   #907
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

Makes sense to me.

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Old 08-14-2018, 12:17 PM   #908
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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Acting intellectually incurious and not understand are two different things, and that's what started this entire conversation. TheVileOne said Bruce should understand what is being told to him. We all know Bruce and Lucius put on a facade, and do this little roundabout humor, where they dance around the notion that Bruce is Batman(which they do throughout the trilogy), but again, that's not what the point was.

But I guess you did say that Bruce may not literally know what is being said to him. I dunno, I thought you were agreeing to the claims that Bruce really does understand everything that Lucius was telling him, because I disagree with that particular part of the scene. I do agree he's putting on his dumb playboy facade, but I don't see how it makes sense to think he understood what Lucius was saying to him. Lucius' line wouldn't make sense if he did.
Yeah, I guess it got a bit muddy there. I'm not necessarily refuting TheVileOne's point but I think there's a way to view that interaction with a bit more generosity to Bruce's intellect (especially considering he's on his first month on the job in Begins) than if just you just take it all at face value and forget that Bruce is playing a role there too. That's all. Maybe it's a redundant point, but I thought it was worth making.


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Old 08-14-2018, 01:38 PM   #909
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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If you’re referring to my comment on physicality, it’s because it literally isn’t possible to be able to do all those things in one body. Benching 500lbs requires intense focus on just that exercise, and the training to get there would end up conflicting with the body you need to be able to be a peak gymnast.


And I always interpreted the scene in BB as Bruce playing dumb once Lucius popped up too. Always have. Maybe he doesn’t know every single bit of jargon Fox is throwing at him, but he seemed to clearly be trying to hide his intelligence once Fox pops up.
I see what you mean. Maybe he doesn't need to be lifting that much weight, I just meant it's okay to suspend disbelief with this stuff at times and not call too much attention to it. People will go along for it if you do it right.

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Old 08-14-2018, 03:08 PM   #910
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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Originally Posted by Travesty View Post
Acting intellectually incurious and not understand are two different things, and that's what started this entire conversation. TheVileOne said Bruce should understand what is being told to him. We all know Bruce and Lucius put on a facade, and do this little roundabout humor, where they dance around the notion that Bruce is Batman(which they do throughout the trilogy), but again, that's not what the point was.

But I guess you did say that Bruce may not literally know what is being said to him. I dunno, I thought you were agreeing to the claims that Bruce really does understand everything that Lucius was telling him, because I disagree with that particular part of the scene. I do agree he's putting on his dumb playboy facade, but I don't see how it makes sense to think he understood what Lucius was saying to him. Lucius' line wouldn't make sense if he did.

It's only a joke IF Bruce has some idea what he is saying. That IS the joke in Bruce saying he DOESN'T understand.
Lucius' line in response is Lucius playing along with the game, playing into a joking faux superiority. If Bruce is "dumb," then Lucius is "smart" in their byplay.

Hence, Lucius semi-cocky response, in the context of the game they both keep up, ONLY makes sense if Bruce knows (at least somewhat) the what words meant, and Lucius knows Bruce knows, and Bruce knows Lucius knows he knows, and Lucius knows Bruce knows he knows he knows.

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Old 08-14-2018, 03:27 PM   #911
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

I wonder if we'll get a new Batmobile, would be interested to see a film try to adapt the bat-face


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Old 08-14-2018, 03:51 PM   #912
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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It's only a joke IF Bruce has some idea what he is saying. That IS the joke in Bruce saying he DOESN'T understand.
Lucius' line in response is Lucius playing along with the game, playing into a joking faux superiority. If Bruce is "dumb," then Lucius is "smart" in their byplay.
No, it's not. The joke is Lucius' response, as that's the punchline. The setup, is Bruce saying he doesn't understand what he's talking about, but you're trying to tell me the setup is actually the punchline, when that's not how it's displayed. If Bruce truly knows what he's talking about, Lucius' line doesn't even make sense. Then, at the end of the conversation, Bruce uses a tag to Lucius' first line, bringing it back to partying. So Lucius tells the first joke, and at the end, Bruce brings it back to another joke. Two jokes, while they talk about Lucius creating an antidote for the weaponized hallucinogen.

Hell, Bruce only slips into the dumb playboy facade once during that entire scene, and it was at the very end when he jokes about "looking for kicks, passing around the weaponized hallucinogen". You can tell, cause he uses a different voice and demeanor. Other than that, he was being sincere with his questions towards Lucius about not understanding, and if he could make more antidotes. He clearly wasn't playing dumb the entire scene.

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Old 08-14-2018, 04:05 PM   #913
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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I wonder if we'll get a new Batmobile, would be interested to see a film try to adapt the bat-face

Not sure if serious.

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Old 08-14-2018, 04:06 PM   #914
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

Lorde...

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Old 08-14-2018, 04:08 PM   #915
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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Not sure if serious.
There's been some good interpretations of it in the comics. It could be done.

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Old 08-14-2018, 11:59 PM   #916
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

I like the idea that Bruce uses a bike, old school military bike - he has a few in the cave and has Tim Drake and Alfred work on them.. it's Tim who is out with gangs in the evening at street races etc and drifting - trying to infiltrate - he fixes up Bruce's cars and uses them on the street and one car, drag racer or something Tim goes Gothic - it's not until robin shows up in the car to assist Batman that the pair use the car as a one off and we have a cool chase sequence. The car gets demolished but it doesn't stop them working on more, prototypes etc.

I always felt a bike was the way to go and the car used sparingly.

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Old Yesterday, 07:35 AM   #917
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

I just said it would be interesting, the brave and the bold used it and it looked good.



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I like the idea that Bruce uses a bike, old school military bike - he has a few in the cave and has Tim Drake and Alfred work on them.. it's Tim who is out with gangs in the evening at street races etc and drifting - trying to infiltrate - he fixes up Bruce's cars and uses them on the street and one car, drag racer or something Tim goes Gothic - it's not until robin shows up in the car to assist Batman that the pair use the car as a one off and we have a cool chase sequence. The car gets demolished but it doesn't stop them working on more, prototypes etc.

I always felt a bike was the way to go and the car used sparingly.
Sounds like Batman Year 100, I wouldn't be opposed to him using a bike again, but I find the Batmobile more fun.

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Old Yesterday, 09:24 AM   #918
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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No, it's not. The joke is Lucius' response, as that's the punchline. The setup, is Bruce saying he doesn't understand what he's talking about, but you're trying to tell me the setup is actually the punchline, when that's not how it's displayed. If Bruce truly knows what he's talking about, Lucius' line doesn't even make sense. Then, at the end of the conversation, Bruce uses a tag to Lucius' first line, bringing it back to partying. So Lucius tells the first joke, and at the end, Bruce brings it back to another joke. Two jokes, while they talk about Lucius creating an antidote for the weaponized hallucinogen.

Hell, Bruce only slips into the dumb playboy facade once during that entire scene, and it was at the very end when he jokes about "looking for kicks, passing around the weaponized hallucinogen". You can tell, cause he uses a different voice and demeanor. Other than that, he was being sincere with his questions towards Lucius about not understanding, and if he could make more antidotes. He clearly wasn't playing dumb the entire scene.

SMH, I was saying the joke/humour within Bruce's line comes from the contrast between what he says, and what we know of his character. I am NOT claiming Bruce's line was a punchline to some set up. I am citing the humour within the context of the line itself.
Take away Lucius' follow up, and there is still humour in Bruce's line, again, given the contradiction between his words and the character.

Lucius' line is a tag that builds off of Bruce's. IT ADDS an additional punch to the humour that has been established.

They are not set up and punch line for a single joke. They both have humour in themselves, and the latter builds off the first.

"If Bruce truly knows what he's talking about, Lucius' line doesn't even make sense."
Again, only if Lucius is being earnest, which we KNOW he's not. The entire back and forth is tongue in cheek and part of their "game."
It makes sense BECAUSE he's pretending that Bruce doesn't actually have the capability to understand.

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Old Yesterday, 09:25 PM   #919
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Default Re: Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

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I just said it would be interesting, the brave and the bold used it and it looked good.





Sounds like Batman Year 100, I wouldn't be opposed to him using a bike again, but I find the Batmobile more fun.
Oh man, Batman Year 100 is definitely one of my favorite takes. Really cool, irreverent but totally true to the characteristics about him I love best. I love the fake teeth! We'll never get that on the screen, but I love it.

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