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Old 05-18-2015, 01:14 PM   #101
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

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I've been thinking about Quicksilver's death in the movie and I think it would've worked better if it came from him trying to fight Ultron one on one, forcing Ultron to kill him with his bare hands. As opposed to the "shove someone out of the way to take a bullet" cliche which is kind of a weak and not that dramatic way for a superhero to die, to be honest.
For it to be Quicksilver, the enemy turned ally and Hawkeye's rival throughout the movie, is pretty dramatic.

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Old 05-18-2015, 01:16 PM   #102
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And they did shoot the scene..all they had to was have Quicksilver show up in the last shot as a New Avenger and left everything the same...N the whole meaning would have been changed as in he was just injured and not dead.Taking out the scene where he shows up too changes everything and even still it was never confirmed.
I disagree. I think it requires less explanation to just show where Scarlet Witch will be from now on, but leave her long term emotional fallout for the next movie so you can end this one, than it does to have SW talk about how she's already dead with her brother dying and then not have a shot of her finding out that he's alive.

The latter is another huge emotional payoff if it happened so that has to be shown in proper writing. As they already showed her scene with Ultron, and the one with her powers freaking out at the moment QS died, they have already showed her short term reaction so the rest is better explained later when there's more time.

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Old 05-18-2015, 01:56 PM   #103
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

In the long term narrative Pietro's death will definitely be better for Wanda's character. This is always what Joss intended, he's said it in multiple interviews, and he only filmed the miraculous recovery from the bullet wounds and Pietro with the New Avengers in case the Disney machine demanded he not be killed. It was only a back up plan in case the suits got involved. The narrative intent was always for him to die.

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Old 05-18-2015, 02:22 PM   #104
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Old 05-18-2015, 02:29 PM   #105
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

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I disagree. I think it requires less explanation to just show where Scarlet Witch will be from now on, but leave her long term emotional fallout for the next movie so you can end this one, than it does to have SW talk about how she's already dead with her brother dying and then not have a shot of her finding out that he's alive.

The latter is another huge emotional payoff if it happened so that has to be shown in proper writing. As they already showed her scene with Ultron, and the one with her powers freaking out at the moment QS died, they have already showed her short term reaction so the rest is better explained later when there's more time.
I agree and no where do I disagree what I'm saying is I believe it was filmed that way purposely to where it could go either way.Depending on what QS final outcome would have been Ergo:The whole reason and alternative scene was shot.It was only that one scene that shows him alive that changes everything and it changes the entire meaning and outcome if you put it in.Without having to change anything else.

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i just think you're reading way too into it
Honestly no offense but I think you might be.Reading into it is exactly what I'm NOT doing.That's the issue it never gave me a reason to.
To the point where I felt the film could have gone either way.

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Old 05-18-2015, 02:59 PM   #106
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

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I agree and no where do I disagree what I'm saying is I believe it was filmed that way purposely to where it could go either way.Depending on what QS final outcome would have been Ergo:The whole reason and alternative scene was shot.It was only that one scene that shows him alive that changes everything and it changes the entire meaning and outcome if you put it in.Without having to change anything else.
Ah, I mistook your intent a bit there then, although I don't think that's the only thing you need to change for it to really work. But they might have had other scenes shot as well.

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Old 05-20-2015, 07:36 AM   #107
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

Okay, I think I may have found an inconsistency moment in AOU (I loathe to use the term 'plot hole' since that gets so widely mis-used) - it popped into my head as I was getting ready for work this morning. (and if this has already been brought up and discussed - I apologize, I haven't been through all posts in this thread nor through previous parts of the thread)

After Barton's farm, Tony goes to the Nexus to try and figure out who's preventing Ultron from getting the nuclear codes and Banner is dropped off at Avengers Tower by Fury (Tony eventually joins Banner at the Tower once he's done at the Nexus).

Cap, Widow and Hawkeye go on in the Quinjet to South Korea out of concern for Dr. Cho. Fight ensues - Hawkeye gets the cradle (with Vision's body inside), takes it to New York and remains in Avengers Tower to use some old-school methods to try and find Widow (who's been taken by Ultron).

Cap - after a bit more fighting - joins up with the twins and (here's where I'm having the inconsistency issue) then next we see them is at Avengers Tower interrupting Tony and Banner. How did Cap & the twins get to Avengers Tower from South Korea? There's no indication they had the Quinjet (Hawkeye took it to the Tower earlier, as noted, he was still at the Tower)

Any thoughts? Am I forgetting a detail somewhere (which I fully admit I could be) or any ideas how to logically 'explain this away' within the confines of the MCU? (unlike some (that are not members of SHH...long story) I'm open to logical suggestions and assumptions that fill in gaps)...I just haven't quite been able to wrap my head around this one

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Old 05-20-2015, 07:45 AM   #108
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Possibly Dr. Cho had a quinjet at her disposal there (since she was doing work for the Avengers)....and they flew it back.

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Old 05-20-2015, 07:46 AM   #109
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

I don't think there is any on screen explanation for Steve, Wanda and Pietro traveling from South Korea back to New York. I actually was looking for an explanation on my last viewing and didn't find it.

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Old 05-20-2015, 08:06 AM   #110
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

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Possibly Dr. Cho had a quinjet at her disposal there (since she was doing work for the Avengers)....and they flew it back.
Yeah, that seems like a logical possibility/I can buy that

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Old 05-20-2015, 08:43 AM   #111
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It never occurred to me to question it because there are so many possibilities it seems inconsequential.

The Avenegers had more than one transport craft at their disposal.
Cho's facility has their own jet.
They took a military transport (set up by Rhodes).
They chartered a private plane.
Etc, etc...

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Old 05-20-2015, 09:54 AM   #112
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

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I don't think there is any on screen explanation for Steve, Wanda and Pietro traveling from South Korea back to New York. I actually was looking for an explanation on my last viewing and didn't find it.
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Yeah, that seems like a logical possibility/I can buy that
.... same way Cap got to S. Korea i'd imagine...

I doubt they only took the one Quinn Jet...

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Old 05-20-2015, 10:04 AM   #113
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.... same way Cap got to S. Korea i'd imagine...

I doubt they only took the one Quinn Jet...
They only had the one Quinjet when they arrived at Barton's farm though (ignoring for a moment whatever Fury was using for transportation - but I imagine that stayed with him) and since Fury was going to the trouble of dropping Banner off at the Tower - and picking up Maria Hill in the process (if the entire team was going there to pick up a 2nd Quinjet - that we don't even know if they have a 2nd one - why wouldn't they take Banner themselves?), it seems like they went straight from Barton's to S. Korea in just the one Quinjet.

Anywho, I'm content with C.Lee's idea and that Dr. Cho having a jet at her facility and at her disposal (whether Quinjet or otherwise) is a reasonable and very plausible answer. My brain just wasn't quite working fully this morning when the inconsistency popped into my head (the joys of waking up at 4 am to get ready for work) and so was having a hard time coming up with possibilities myself.

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Old 05-20-2015, 10:15 AM   #114
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They only had the one Quinjet when they arrived at Barton's farm though (ignoring for a moment whatever Fury was using for transportation - but I imagine that stayed with him) and since Fury was going to the trouble of dropping Banner off at the Tower - and picking up Maria Hill in the process (if the entire team was going there to pick up a 2nd Quinjet - that we don't even know if they have a 2nd one - why wouldn't they take Banner themselves?), it seems like they went straight from Barton's to S. Korea in just the one Quinjet.

Anywho, I'm content with C.Lee's idea and that Dr. Cho having a jet at her facility and at her disposal (whether Quinjet or otherwise) is a reasonable and very plausible answer. My brain just wasn't quite working fully this morning when the inconsistency popped into my head (the joys of waking up at 4 am to get ready for work) and so was having a hard time coming up with possibilities myself.
except for the fact they were all at the farm... and all left the farm heading to different places... if Banner and Tony went to New York, and Tash, Cap, and Hawkeye went to S.Korea.. then they obviously got another vehicle to take them. So it infers that it's likely Mariah Hill who dispatches transport for them. That would be my guess... Unless Tony held Bruce and flew back to new york... all superman/lois lane like

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Old 05-20-2015, 10:20 AM   #115
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

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except for the fact they were all at the farm... and all left the farm heading to different places... if Banner and Tony went to New York, and Tash, Cap, and Hawkeye went to S.Korea.. then they obviously got another vehicle to take them. So it infers that it's likely Mariah Hill who dispatches transport for them. That would be my guess... Unless Tony held Bruce and flew back to new york... all superman/lois lane like
Banner went with Fury (in whatever Fury arrived in) - Fury mentions that he would drop him off at the Tower and pick up Hill (and I imagine after dropping Banner off and picking up Hill, Fury than took whatever mode of transportation he had to the secret base that had #64 in the hanger to get it prepped and ready to go). I would think Tony took his Iron Man suit to and from the Nexus.

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Old 05-20-2015, 10:34 AM   #116
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

Exactly. So to recap, from the farm...
  • Steve, Clint and Natasha take the Quinjet to South Korea
  • Tony flies to the Nexus in Mark 43, then back to New York
  • Banner catches a ride back to New York w/ Fury
  • Clint flies the Quinjet back to New York immediately
  • Steve, Wanda and Pietro use private transportation, likely from Dr. Cho, to get back to New York

I am surprised they let Clint make off with the cradle all by himself. Who is to say Ultron wasn't going to try to attack him and reclaim the cradle during the long flight from South Korea to New York?

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Old 05-22-2015, 05:47 PM   #117
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

Well Ultron was unable to retrieve the cradle as Hawkeye flew away with it and while Black Widow was just about to jump into the back of the Quinjet or she was holding onto the end of the cradle Ultron swooped her up from behind and took her instead as he did not have the power to lift such a heavy cradle and fly away with it.

As for Ultron trying to re-retrieve the cradle from the Quinjet, my explanation would be the Quinjet has stealth so maybe can become invisible (or is pretty fast) or either he just left it at that and decided to go back to base camp and build his Vibranuim Prime body instead.

As for Pietro, Wanda and Cap getting to (New York) the Tower from South Korea, well Wanda said Tony is willing to do anything (when referring to Tony's next plan of action regarding Vision) so they jetted super fast to New York - jetted meaning here basically legged it. Legged it with Pietro as he is Quicksilver and maybe that's his super speed journey which we never got to see on screen whilst Wanda and Cap hold onto him tight. Well to draw the picture, Pietro carried his sis Wanda in his arms and at the same time he piggybacked Cap and then he said "hold on guys, this ones gonna give you motions" and then he went 'swoooooosshh' and they were in New York.

A possibility?


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Old 05-22-2015, 06:14 PM   #118
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After seeing this for the third time today, I just love it now. It's better than the first. The first may be all around more fun and satisfying on a popcorn level, but this really does feel like the ESB of comic book films. Just more complex and deeper but satisfying in its own way.

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Old 05-23-2015, 12:43 AM   #119
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

New question: Who exactly was the leader of the Avengers? I couldn't make out whether it was Cap or Iron Man.

I've seen it once and I've yet to see it again.

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Old 05-23-2015, 01:33 AM   #120
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New question: Who exactly was the leader of the Avengers? I couldn't make out whether it was Cap or Iron Man.

I've seen it once and I've yet to see it again.
It's pretty clearly Cap. Tony even admits that Cap's the real boss.

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Old 05-23-2015, 01:53 AM   #121
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Default Re: Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!!

Did Scarlet Witch's revenge on Ultron fall flat for anyone? It was well acted and looked well enough, but it's not like Ultron can feel pain, can he?

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Old 05-23-2015, 10:26 AM   #122
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Probably not physical pain.
Tho the NEW Rage of Ultron Graphic novel has

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
Hank Pym and Ultron MERGE into ONE being. Not sure if this new "Pymtron" can physically feel anything or not

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Old 05-23-2015, 05:32 PM   #123
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Did Scarlet Witch's revenge on Ultron fall flat for anyone? It was well acted and looked well enough, but it's not like Ultron can feel pain, can he?
I think that depends on whether you felt anything when Scarlett Witch ripped out his heart. Of course he doesn't, but i think it's served as more poetic. but I think it's more figurative that he can't feel it and literal for her to show us how she felt... if that makes any sense. But Ultron did feel in a sense. Like when Vision said, "Ultron is in pain." I don't know if that was meant to be literal, but he couldn't say that unless Ultron felt something. What else can pain be described in relation to Ultrn?

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Old 05-24-2015, 05:23 PM   #124
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I think that depends on whether you felt anything when Scarlett Witch ripped out his heart. Of course he doesn't, but i think it's served as more poetic. but I think it's more figurative that he can't feel it and literal for her to show us how she felt... if that makes any sense. But Ultron did feel in a sense. Like when Vision said, "Ultron is in pain." I don't know if that was meant to be literal, but he couldn't say that unless Ultron felt something. What else can pain be described in relation to Ultrn?
Ultron did feel pain, he had developed enough to have human like feelings and although he didn't feel physical pain, he felt emotional pain, he had the feeling of betrayal and having no one on his side, which in my opinion is even more painful than physical pain.

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Old 05-24-2015, 05:34 PM   #125
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I hope that the way Hulk left Black Window hanging kills that relationship. Just have a couple quick lines about him choosing exile over her and let that be the end of it.
That scene was absoloutley beautiful, I may have shed a few tears haha. I also really loved how much they made him like savage hulk, he was sitting with his legs crossed like a 5 year old which was exactly what I wanted to see from savage hulk!

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