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View Poll Results: Should Cavill's Superman costume include the Red Trunks?
The Trunks stay! 101 48.10%
The Trunks gotta go! 48 22.86%
I don't care if the Trunks stay or go! 61 29.05%
Voters: 210. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-13-2012, 02:58 PM   #126
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

I prefer Routh’s portrayal – because I prefer a more serious, stoic, Gary Cooper-ish Superman. I have no interest in Routh’s career or in gauging his acting talents (or lack thereof) beyond SR. I just liked him as Supes.

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Old 01-13-2012, 03:44 PM   #127
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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I completely agree. I think it could be awesome to have a scene of Superman's arrival to save the day being followed by a sonic boom to demonstrate how fast he's flying.
He's not too bad in that. The thing is that for Routh, it feels like an exception to actually be okay....whereas his norm is rather wooden and shallow. Whereas someone like, say, Hugh Jackman...it was evident from the beginning that the guy could really act, and he's shown it in just about every role....you don't have to search for a good one like with Routh. That's why you get the feeling that a better actor could have contributed even more to a Superman role even in such a rigid homage of a portrayal. But again, Routh is not to blame for SR's shortcomings.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 01-13-2012, 04:24 PM   #128
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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That's all Superman right there...
Agreed 100%:

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Old 01-13-2012, 05:19 PM   #129
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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I hope we actually Superman uses super speed in this sense:



This is a better method of showing the ability instead of "slowing it down". I don't mind it but we need to see stuff akin to that (around 1:22).


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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 01-14-2012, 01:35 AM   #130
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

Yeah that type of speed is what I want to see. It's essentially teleportation but it looks so damn awesome and displays how incredibly fast he is.

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Old 01-14-2012, 02:49 AM   #131
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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I hope we actually Superman uses super speed in this sense:



This is a better method of showing the ability instead of "slowing it down". I don't mind it but we need to see stuff akin to that (around 1:22).
This scene, or something stupid close to it, should be in the movie, dialogue and all...

It gives all the non Superman fans the chance to see him cut loose and be a badass, and it gives the Superman fans the same gratification, which we all need cause we're all so sick of Superman, the most powerful of all superheroes, being reduced to a shell of what he's capable of....

Sorry for the run-on sentences...

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Old 01-14-2012, 03:00 AM   #132
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

Well said. I'm completely with you.

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Old 01-14-2012, 05:48 AM   #133
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

And in the middle of all that, he should find the time to slip on some trunks :P

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Old 01-14-2012, 05:57 AM   #134
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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He's not too bad in that. The thing is that for Routh, it feels like an exception to actually be okay....whereas his norm is rather wooden and shallow. Whereas someone like, say, Hugh Jackman...it was evident from the beginning that the guy could really act, and he's shown it in just about every role....you don't have to search for a good one like with Routh. That's why you get the feeling that a better actor could have contributed even more to a Superman role even in such a rigid homage of a portrayal. But again, Routh is not to blame for SR's shortcomings.
While I agree he did okay with Wolverine, I have to ask how you are so certain that he's a great actor... What was it about his roles in Oklahoma, or Erskineville Kings, Paperback Hero? Or something else?

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Old 01-14-2012, 07:24 AM   #135
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

I hope that cavill breaks out the vicous superman like in the dcuo trailer

also giganta's costume makes it look like her ass is exposed

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Old 01-14-2012, 03:02 PM   #136
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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While I agree he did okay with Wolverine, I have to ask how you are so certain that he's a great actor... What was it about his roles in Oklahoma, or Erskineville Kings, Paperback Hero? Or something else?
Thank you.

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Old 01-14-2012, 04:04 PM   #137
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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While I agree he did okay with Wolverine, I have to ask how you are so certain that he's a great actor... What was it about his roles in Oklahoma, or Erskineville Kings, Paperback Hero? Or something else?
The Prestige, Swordfish (horrible movie, but he did fine), Australia...anything he appears in, you can tell he's an experienced and well-skilled natural actor. You don't get that with Routh, and you certainly don't see him being able to range into anywhere near as many roles like that as Jackman. Could you see Routh handling any of those roles? If he could, he would have already. Thats why I said it's kind of unfair to compare Routh to someone like Jackman...Welling or Cain might be a better comparison. Is he better than, say, Chris O'Donnell?

Or Chris Evans? Or James Mardsen?

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)

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Old 01-14-2012, 04:36 PM   #138
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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The Prestige, Swordfish (horrible movie, but he did fine), Australia...anything he appears in, you can tell he's an experienced and well-skilled natural actor. You don't get that with Routh, and you certainly don't see him being able to range into anywhere near as many roles like that as Jackman. Could you see Routh handling any of those roles? If he could, he would have already. Thats why I said it's kind of unfair to compare Routh to someone like Jackman...Welling or Cain might be a better comparison. Is he better than, say, Chris O'Donnell?

Or Chris Evans? Or James Mardsen?
You forget that an actor like Jackman is about 10 years ahead of Routh. Same goes for O'Donnell (Ok, that's 7 years. Had to look it up because I had no idea who he is.) The point is that every actor needs time to fully grow into the job they've chosen. I have to admit that over the years Routh has grown as an actor, and though he's done some bad projects, that doesn't make him a bad actor. And sometimes it's not just an actor's skills, it's also what people label as 'good acting'. I think he did a good job in Superman Returns. I think he's a good actor, judging on what I've seen of him. I also think Jackman is a good actor (Cain, Evans, Welling, not so much), I've seen him in several films too... But an opinion is an opinion, still. And you have the right to disagree, as much as I disagree with you.

Also, an actor chooses which roles to take (or which roles he wants, they still have to audition most of the time), and Routh, unfortunately, made a couple of bad, bad choices...

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Old 01-14-2012, 05:22 PM   #139
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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You forget that an actor like Jackman is about 10 years ahead of Routh. Same goes for O'Donnell (Ok, that's 7 years. Had to look it up because I had no idea who he is.) The point is that every actor needs time to fully grow into the job they've chosen. I have to admit that over the years Routh has grown as an actor, and though he's done some bad projects, that doesn't make him a bad actor. And sometimes it's not just an actor's skills, it's also what people label as 'good acting'. I think he did a good job in Superman Returns. I think he's a good actor, judging on what I've seen of him. I also think Jackman is a good actor (Cain, Evans, Welling, not so much), I've seen him in several films too... But an opinion is an opinion, still. And you have the right to disagree, as much as I disagree with you.

Also, an actor chooses which roles to take (or which roles he wants, they still have to audition most of the time), and Routh, unfortunately, made a couple of bad, bad choices...
I didn't, actually, as I mentioned he had more experience. But at the same time, it's been nearly six years since SR...and whatever time Routh spent before with parts on teen soaps or what have you. Is he in any way approaching what Jackman was as an actor the first time we saw him? Irregardless of role...do we actually see comparable budding talent in Routh?

Jackman also made some bad choices with movies like Kate & Leopold...and then he's also played a very gay man on stage. Yes, there are choices...but there's still raw talent and skill, and some just have more than others. No one is saying he didn't do a good job in SR...at least I'm not....but at the same time, it was a reserved role that many felt was held back, and it doesn't seem that there would have been much more for Routh to offer beyond that.

He's a good kid, and he did an admirable job in his Superman appearance. But an actual good actor he's not. Thankfully, the only thing he's know/remembered as is probably his best....despite being a lackluster film. He's not horrible, but there are so many better ones out there that are of similar age/type, even in TV....so unless he's working for really cheap these days, its going to be hard to stand out. But again, in no way am I saying that you or anyone else should not like his version of Superman...or at least, his version of Reeve's Superman.

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Quote:
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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)

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Old 01-14-2012, 05:49 PM   #140
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Isn't this the costume topic? I don't see what Routh and his poor acting skills (he is a poor actor and that is a FACT not an opinion, a fact proven by his performances and something the vast majority of film critics and fans agree on) have to do with the costume.

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Old 01-14-2012, 06:00 PM   #141
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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The Prestige, Swordfish (horrible movie, but he did fine), Australia...anything he appears in, you can tell he's an experienced and well-skilled natural actor. You don't get that with Routh, and you certainly don't see him being able to range into anywhere near as many roles like that as Jackman. Could you see Routh handling any of those roles? If he could, he would have already. Thats why I said it's kind of unfair to compare Routh to someone like Jackman...Welling or Cain might be a better comparison. Is he better than, say, Chris O'Donnell?

Or Chris Evans? Or James Mardsen?
To be fair, Jackman sucked for a long time. Those other movies like the Fountain and Prestige, took a long time for him to get and actually be that actor you're talking about. That was Routh's first big role besides a couple shorts and soap acting. All you're doing is sayin that Routh is a young and inexperienced actor, which is why his performance is only so-so. I agree with that.

But back to the topic. I'm really excited to see what this suit looks like in action and officially.

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Old 01-14-2012, 06:12 PM   #142
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To be fair, Jackman sucked for a long time. Those other movies like the Fountain and Prestige, took a long time for him to get and actually be that actor you're talking about. That was Routh's first big role besides a couple shorts and soap acting. All you're doing is sayin that Routh is a young and inexperienced actor, which is why his performance is only so-so. I agree with that.
I disagree...I think he brought that talent coming in, talent that was evident from the first time we saw him in XMen. Kinda' like you can tell how good a musician is on the first recording you hear them on. Routh by comparison still comes across as a work-in-progress...someone who needs some convincing of someone to be hired rather than being wanted, so to speak. There's also a presence that can't be learned or taught....you could have someone like Routh with 10 yrs of experience and still not be as good of an actor as someone else when they had their 10 yrs. It's not a knock on Routh as a person, but really....but he's just not a particularly good actor. Again, he did well with Supes considering what he was provided...and it might be the best he'll ever do...which for many is enough.

But...also as I mentioned...I think there are possible roles that would be well suited to him. In particular, a comedy in which he plays a very rigid straight-laced character opposite someone looser and more aloof. A setting that would put...well...HIM...in a humorous and even absurd situation.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)

Last edited by KalMart; 01-14-2012 at 06:17 PM.
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Old 01-14-2012, 06:25 PM   #143
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

But back to costumes.

The new costume...even without the trunks....will be a better actor than Routh.


j/k......

The more we see of it and those of other Kryptonian characters, the less likely it looks that we'll get an 'explanation', so to speak. Kinda' like the STM approach with the family crests on Krypton...but with a more 'modern' alien design. Which I think works fine, but I can see how some comic fans would want more.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 01-14-2012, 06:49 PM   #144
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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Isn't this the costume topic? I don't see what Routh and his poor acting skills (he is a poor actor and that is a FACT not an opinion, a fact proven by his performances and something the vast majority of film critics and fans agree on) have to do with the costume.
Yes, this is the costume section. The only thing I want to say about your statement, and before we'll just have to let the discussion about his acting skills, is that you should stop saying something is a fact when it's clearly not a fact, but an opinion, they do not state fact. That's why they're called critics. A fact is something you can prove without a doubt. I just hate it when people are so ignorant about it. Film critics give their opinion. There's been many films that have been hits, even after critics totally flushed it down the drain. Nothing wrong with having an opinion, but this kind of behaviour is, for me, condescending and proves, again to me, people's poor knowledge of the meaning of the word fact and fiction.

Ok, I'll go let it go now, along with my frustrations (or so to speak). Let's talk about the costume. Anyone said anything that hasn't been said yet?

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Old 01-14-2012, 08:04 PM   #145
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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I disagree...I think he brought that talent coming in, talent that was evident from the first time we saw him in XMen. Kinda' like you can tell how good a musician is on the first recording you hear them on. Routh by comparison still comes across as a work-in-progress...someone who needs some convincing of someone to be hired rather than being wanted, so to speak. There's also a presence that can't be learned or taught....you could have someone like Routh with 10 yrs of experience and still not be as good of an actor as someone else when they had their 10 yrs. It's not a knock on Routh as a person, but really....but he's just not a particularly good actor. Again, he did well with Supes considering what he was provided...and it might be the best he'll ever do...which for many is enough.

But...also as I mentioned...I think there are possible roles that would be well suited to him. In particular, a comedy in which he plays a very rigid straight-laced character opposite someone looser and more aloof. A setting that would put...well...HIM...in a humorous and even absurd situation.
But Wolverine is FAR from his first film...

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Old 01-14-2012, 08:18 PM   #146
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

Sorry, but I don't get the comparison of Chris Evans' acting abilities with that of Routh and Welling. If anything I would say you could put them in order it would be Routh last, Welling next, and Evans way above both. Have you seen him in Sunshine? Now, having said that, none of those guys are on par with say a Gary Oldman or Tom Hardy, but I think alot of that has to do with the projects they have been given as well. Aside from that, i gotta say I'm pretty pumped on the look of the costume as is and Cavill looks like "the" best Superman I have ever seen on screen wearing it.

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Old 01-14-2012, 08:20 PM   #147
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

I think alot of Routh's problem is his voice. When I watched Dylan Dog with his voiceover throughout; I just couldn't get into his way of speaking, it's almost as if he has a lazy speech pattern or lisp. just my opinion, but it hurts his performance in my eyes

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Old 01-14-2012, 08:29 PM   #148
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Yes, this is the costume section. The only thing I want to say about your statement, and before we'll just have to let the discussion about his acting skills, is that you should stop saying something is a fact when it's clearly not a fact, but an opinion, they do not state fact. That's why they're called critics. A fact is something you can prove without a doubt. I just hate it when people are so ignorant about it. Film critics give their opinion. There's been many films that have been hits, even after critics totally flushed it down the drain. Nothing wrong with having an opinion, but this kind of behaviour is, for me, condescending and proves, again to me, people's poor knowledge of the meaning of the word fact and fiction.
So what you are saying, that in movies/tv (and art, music etc) and prety much in everything in life, there is no such thing as a fact, but only opinions?

So, someone can say, Superman IV is a better movie than The Dark Knight and because that is their opinion they are correct? I am sick of this. Whenever people cannot present strong enough arguments to ˙˙prove˙˙ something that they think is true, they resort to the weakest ˙˙emergency exit˙˙ of them all, the opinion back up ˙˙argument˙˙.

Well, thats not how things work in the cosmos. There are good things, bad things, so-so things, whatever. But standards do exist. People get deffensive because they probably feel, if they like an actor and people say he is a poor actor, they feel worse about themselfs for liking it or something. But that's silly. So you like a poor actor, there is something about him that you like, ok but if he is a poor actor you liking him wont change the FACT he is a poor actor. And Routh is a poor actor until he himself proves otherwise. Every single role so far shows that he is a poor actor. Just because you like him it doesn't make him a great or even a good actor. How hard is that to understand?
I mean, a few days ago I was arguing with a guy who said that that Keanu Reeves is a better actor than Russell Crowe. But hey I can't tell him it's a fact that he is not because there is no such thing as good or bad, right and wrong, just opinions. BOLLOCKS mate, bollocks.

In some cases, a lot of cases, yes, it does fall down to an opinion. Especially if you have two equally great things. Who is a better actor, Al Pacino or Jack Nicholson? Now that can mostly qualify as an opinion, though in some method of acting one is surely better than the other, but overall? Tough one. Who was a better composer/musician, Bach or Mozart? If we set a criteria (impact, influence, melodic complexity, composition, harmonic intervals etc) we might get a tie. But who is a better composer/musician, Jimi Hendrix or Justin Bieber? Hendrix, and that's a FACT.

You speak of ignorance, sure some people might be ignorant and label something as bad/wrong whatever just because they don't like it. But in that case they usually can't back it up with arguments. But a lot of people aren't like that. For example, most Nolan movies do nothing for me. But he is one hell of a filmmaker and I would never deny this just because I don't like him. I don't like what he's done to Batman but The Dark Knight is the best of all the Batman movies and I admit this even though I prefer 89 Bat's 10 times more. But me prefering it doesn't make it better and I don't try to claim that it is.

So maybe you should chill and realize that you liking Routh doesn't make him good. Routh is a poor to average actor at best, and that is a fact. Sorry.


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Old 01-14-2012, 08:42 PM   #149
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 21

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So maybe you should chill and realize that you liking Routh doesn't make him good.
So maybe you should chill and realize that you NOT liking Routh doesn't make him bad.

Funny how that works isn't it.

2 + 2 = 4......that's fact.

Routh is a good/bad actor....that's opinion.

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Old 01-14-2012, 08:46 PM   #150
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So maybe you should chill and realize that you NOT liking Routh doesn't make him bad.

Funny how that works isn't it.

2 + 2 = 4......that's fact.

Routh is a good/bad actor....that's opinion.
You obviously did not read my entire post, or you did and you do not understand it. That's fine. I never said I don't like Routh. I am indifferent towards him. But a good actor he is not and that is a fact, not my opinion. Sorry.

edit: and that's the last from me on this subject. Beating a dead horse and all...


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