The SuperHeroHype Forums  

Go Back   The SuperHeroHype Forums > Superman > Man of Steel

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-13-2011, 07:35 AM   #126
KrypJonian
The Last Son of Krypjon
 
KrypJonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny California
Posts: 2,317
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzilla2014 View Post
By that reasoning, they should also not be exposed to the opinions of people like us, who obviously like Superman for whatever reason. I'm just saying that if you really want to "let them make up their own minds" then either they should get either both(/all) sides or none.

What I think the film should do is reconstruct Superman for modern audiences. Show the world as being terrified of what he could do. I read once that Lois Lane was injured covering a war. Superman came to her aid, and the enemy surrendered because they thought Superman was there to fight them. That kind of event might provide an interesting take on how the world would react to a godlike alien like Superman. It would certainly put his "nice guy" attitude in perspective, wouldn't it?
But what you are doing is reconstructing human opinion to react as you want them to.... Terrified till he helps Lois... What does that do for the world?

__________________
"Candy is dandy, but liquor is quicker"
KrypJonian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 07:46 AM   #127
Marvin
Side-Kick
 
Marvin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 19,612
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Don't hire a director that makes forgettable films.Check.

Supporting cast full of (real stars). Check.

Zack Snyder trailer. oh boy.

__________________
"I care because filmmakers now make films under crippling security because of parasitic gossip. makes movies worse"
-James Mangold.
Marvin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 08:34 AM   #128
hopefuldreamer
Clark Kent > Superman
 
hopefuldreamer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: South West, UK
Posts: 11,843
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzilla2014 View Post
By that reasoning, they should also not be exposed to the opinions of people like us, who obviously like Superman for whatever reason. I'm just saying that if you really want to "let them make up their own minds" then either they should get either both(/all) sides or none.
Sure. Kind of agree. Kind of hope the GA don't go 'oh, what did the fans think' before they decide to see the film.

As a group, we are kind of negative.

It'd be much much better if they just went to see the movie based on thinking the trailers looked cool, Superman's a recognisable name, and they like the sound of the cast.

__________________
Superman: "I can only tell you what I believe, Diana. humankind has to be allowed to climb to its own destiny. We can't carry them there."
Flash: "But that's what she's saying. What's the point? Why should they need us at all?"
Superman: "To catch them if they fall."
hopefuldreamer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 08:39 AM   #129
Superwoman Prime
Damaged Beyond Repair
 
Superwoman Prime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,088
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopefulsuicide View Post
Sure. Kind of agree. Kind of hope the GA don't go 'oh, what did the fans think' before they decide to see the film.

As a group, we are kind of negative.

It'd be much much better if they just went to see the movie based on thinking the trailers looked cool, Superman's a recognisable name, and they like the sound of the cast.
Negative word of mouth by purist fans is a potential concern if they make some major alteration to the suit or something. But I think realistically if a generic movie-goer hears a fan ranting about how Superman's look is classic and should never under any circumstance be changed. . . that generic movie-goer will be like "Yeah, whatever, who cares, I'm going to go see the movie."

You have to respect that kind of dismissive attitude sometimes.

Superwoman Prime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 08:52 AM   #130
DIRECTOR
Side-Kick
 
DIRECTOR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Somewhere?
Posts: 8,204
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Black Ops players are not interested in Superman in general. When i play online, i sometimes say, "anybody excited for MOS next year" or "anybody here a Superman fan"...........

NOBODY PLAYING BLACK OPS IS A SUPERMAN, they are think Superman is gay or all comic book movies in general are uninteresting.........????

Weird

DIRECTOR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 08:55 AM   #131
hopefuldreamer
Clark Kent > Superman
 
hopefuldreamer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: South West, UK
Posts: 11,843
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

For sure.

Going back to my original point about Superman anti-fans though, I don't think someone going around saying 'Superman's just a boring character, this is a boring movie' is going to help, which some people who just dislike Superman are probably going to do regardless of how good the film is.

hopefuldreamer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 09:18 AM   #132
Superwoman Prime
Damaged Beyond Repair
 
Superwoman Prime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,088
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Part of why I want nothing to do with Batman anymore. It's gotten to the point where everyone and their grandmother praise him as the greatest and most important comic book character ever, all the while brushing Superman off as some joke.

It's tiring.

Superwoman Prime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 09:49 AM   #133
Godzilla2014
Deadpan Snarker
 
Godzilla2014's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,844
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KrypJonian View Post
But what you are doing is reconstructing human opinion to react as you want them to.... Terrified till he helps Lois... What does that do for the world?
No, they fear his power, especially his enemies (as well as America's and those of its allies) and people who don't fully understand the rules he plays by. In that situation, the enemy forces they thought that Superman was sent there to fight them, a battle they would not be able to win, so they surrendered.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopefulsuicide View Post
Sure. Kind of agree. Kind of hope the GA don't go 'oh, what did the fans think' before they decide to see the film.

As a group, we are kind of negative.

It'd be much much better if they just went to see the movie based on thinking the trailers looked cool, Superman's a recognisable name, and they like the sound of the cast.
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superman Prime View Post
Part of why I want nothing to do with Batman anymore. It's gotten to the point where everyone and their grandmother praise him as the greatest and most important comic book character ever, all the while brushing Superman off as some joke.

It's tiring.
I disagree. Superman is not some joke to me, but Batman is my favorite comic book hero.

__________________
Fan of Christopher Nolan's Batman!
Quote:
Originally Posted by KRIM View Post
This post was brought to you by Godzilla.

http://i.imgur.com/6FNiJ.jpg

The more you know.
Godzilla2014 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 10:37 AM   #134
hopefuldreamer
Clark Kent > Superman
 
hopefuldreamer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: South West, UK
Posts: 11,843
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superman Prime View Post
Part of why I want nothing to do with Batman anymore. It's gotten to the point where everyone and their grandmother praise him as the greatest and most important comic book character ever, all the while brushing Superman off as some joke.

It's tiring.
It's hard isn't it?

I mean I'm not there yet with Batman, but I have the exact same feelings about Wolverine and Cyclops.

__________________
Superman: "I can only tell you what I believe, Diana. humankind has to be allowed to climb to its own destiny. We can't carry them there."
Flash: "But that's what she's saying. What's the point? Why should they need us at all?"
Superman: "To catch them if they fall."
hopefuldreamer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 11:19 AM   #135
Dr.
Scorpion-Kick
 
Dr.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,752
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KobiKai View Post
I think his main problem is that he's a dull superhero, with a dull secret identity in a fruity costume. Nolan IMO given free range can update him fully, as someone mentioned previous at the moment he's in the same league as Green Lantern.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopefulsuicide View Post
How to get the General Public interested in Superman?

Make sure they are not exposed to the opinions of people like this, who obviously just don't like him for whatever reason.
The title of this thread suggests that – in the eyes of the general public – Supes may have something of a PR problem. And most of the post-ers here implicitly agree – inasmuch as they offer “solutions” to “solve” the “problem.”

In that spirit, your advice to KobiKai that his/her negativity should be suppressed sidesteps the very issue at hand.

Surely, even ardent fans are aware of the common “Superman criticisms” (even if they disagree with them): Supes is too goody-two-shoes, too boy scout; the CK glasses are a laughably implausible disguise; the bright red-and-blue costume is, shall we say?, “merry.” And these were precisely summarized by KobiKai.

Just insisting that these issues are misconceptions and that the critical voices that utter them should be silenced in no way addresses the alleged misconceptions. The original “PR problem” still exists.

Dr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 11:40 AM   #136
hopefuldreamer
Clark Kent > Superman
 
hopefuldreamer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: South West, UK
Posts: 11,843
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. View Post
The title of this thread suggests that – in the eyes of the general public – Supes may have something of a PR problem. And most of the post-ers here implicitly agree – inasmuch as they offer “solutions” to “solve” the “problem.”

In that spirit, your advice to KobiKai that his/her negativity should be suppressed sidesteps the very issue at hand.

Surely, even ardent fans are aware of the common “Superman criticisms” (even if they disagree with them): Supes is too goody-two-shoes, too boy scout; the CK glasses are a laughably implausible disguise; the bright red-and-blue costume is, shall we say?, “merry.” And these were precisely summarized by KobiKai.

Just insisting that these issues are misconceptions and that the critical voices that utter them should be silenced in no way addresses the alleged misconceptions. The original “PR problem” still exists.
Well that's basically what I'm saying.

That Kobi-Kai has highlighted one of the biggest problems in MOS success in my opinion.

That people are going around saying he's boring and a boy scout and ridiculous, and it's making people feel like they should be embarrased if they go to see it.

I just hope people will give it a chance before ridiculing it.

__________________
Superman: "I can only tell you what I believe, Diana. humankind has to be allowed to climb to its own destiny. We can't carry them there."
Flash: "But that's what she's saying. What's the point? Why should they need us at all?"
Superman: "To catch them if they fall."
hopefuldreamer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 12:06 PM   #137
manofsteel4life
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,511
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopefulsuicide View Post
Well that's basically what I'm saying.

That Kobi-Kai has highlighted one of the biggest problems in MOS success in my opinion.

That people are going around saying he's boring and a boy scout and ridiculous, and it's making people feel like they should be embarrased if they go to see it.

I just hope people will give it a chance before ridiculing it.
true, but alot of kids who have older parents or even young ones that new about the CR, Donner days will want their kids to expericence a new superman film.....i agree supes has that affect on people that i know....its like a question mark on their sexuality or something....but GL is proof that no matter what, people just wanna see a good movie...ofcourse that couldnt carry GL, but in the beginning the GA was interested.....superman will be fine...

__________________
Quote:
As the poet John Dryden once had it: "Beware the fury of a patient man." Or Batman.
manofsteel4life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 10:18 PM   #138
Superwoman Prime
Damaged Beyond Repair
 
Superwoman Prime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,088
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzilla2014 View Post
I disagree. Superman is not some joke to me, but Batman is my favorite comic book hero.
Then you obviously don't belong to the majority group I'm talking about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopefulsuicide View Post
It's hard isn't it?

I mean I'm not there yet with Batman, but I have the exact same feelings about Wolverine and Cyclops.
Yeah, it's about the DC equivalent of Marvel's "Wolverine in the spotlight" thing.

Superwoman Prime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 10:34 PM   #139
SuperAl
Superman's back!
 
SuperAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,600
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. View Post
Surely, even ardent fans are aware of the common “Superman criticisms” (even if they disagree with them): Supes is too goody-two-shoes, too boy scout; the CK glasses are a laughably implausible disguise; the bright red-and-blue costume is, shall we say?, “merry.” And these were precisely summarized by KobiKai.

Just insisting that these issues are misconceptions and that the critical voices that utter them should be silenced in no way addresses the alleged misconceptions. The original “PR problem” still exists.
People who think all of the above make these assumptions based off a 30 yr old movie and Singer just copied that. release one trailer and all those assumptions are removed. Its not hard to do. I dont really remember Wolverine being very popular to the mass media until after the xmen movie came out and jackman made him popular among nonfans. And batman didnt blow up until Batman Begins came out. Make a good movie and good PR comes on its own.

SuperAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 12:47 AM   #140
Kurosawa
Banned User
 
Kurosawa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: 22,300 miles above the Earth
Posts: 9,485
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopefulsuicide View Post
It's hard isn't it?

I mean I'm not there yet with Batman, but I have the exact same feelings about Wolverine and Cyclops.
Cyclops? But no character got more of a raw deal in the movies than Cyke did. I thought most kewl kidz fans who dislike Superman likewise dislike Cyclops.

Kurosawa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 01:15 AM   #141
Ness
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 773
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Make a great movie and people will come. That is what Batman Begins did.

__________________
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 02:29 AM   #142
Superwoman Prime
Damaged Beyond Repair
 
Superwoman Prime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,088
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurosawa View Post
Cyclops? But no character got more of a raw deal in the movies than Cyke did. I thought most kewl kidz fans who dislike Superman likewise dislike Cyclops.
hopefulsuicide is saying that Cyclops is Superman in this analogy, and Wolverine is Batman.

Superwoman Prime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 02:31 AM   #143
Kurosawa
Banned User
 
Kurosawa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: 22,300 miles above the Earth
Posts: 9,485
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superman Prime View Post
hopefulsuicide is saying that Cyclops is Superman in this analogy, and Wolverine is Batman.
I get it now. Yea, he's right.

Kurosawa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 09:50 AM   #144
Sgt.Pepper
Nowhere Man
 
Sgt.Pepper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,297
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Hopefulsuicide is a lady.

Anyway, I can't see how the GA will not be interested in this. The cast itself is exciting, Nolan is producing the film (which is bound to get people interested), with a good director at the helm of the project and the fact alone that it's a new Superman movie.

Just have a great marketing (like TDK) and hopefully people will watch this movie.

Sgt.Pepper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 01:33 PM   #145
KyleDW2
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 336
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurosawa View Post
Cyclops? But no character got more of a raw deal in the movies than Cyke did. I thought most kewl kidz fans who dislike Superman likewise dislike Cyclops.
Cyclops is now pretty popular. Wanna know why? He has become the leader of the entire mutant race and he has gone grey in morality tons of times, sometimes being downright black on the scale of white and black. He gave Wolverine a kill squad to protect the mutant race, for example. So maybe the key to making Superman popular is breaking him and rebuilding him the way Cyclops was.

__________________
Review: Green Lantern
KyleDW2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 08:00 PM   #146
Obi Wan Kenobi
Banned User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 237
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superfreak View Post
To be perfectly honest, Nolan didn't change that much about batman. He just took the next logical step after B89 franchise had devolved into madness. IMO, his major contribution was to remove all camp from his franchise, while sticking to the main theme. He just delivered what had been written in the comics for a number of years.

on the comments about Supes being outdated. Supes doesn't need to be modernized. SR's failure was not because of the character's/property's age, nor his look. All the pieces were there for SR, the problem with the movie was that Singer and crew had no idea what they were doing with the narrative. It was the craptastic story that affected its performance (any super hero movie where the solution is to throw the problem into space is weak), not the age of the character/property. SR was extremely inconsistent, and basically stupid. Had the SR narrative been written by someone who knew what they were doing, someone who understood what was missing from the STM franchise, someone who understood what the fans were asking for, the turn out would have been much different.

it's the story that has been the problem with superman movies since SIV. IMO, I can say this because TAS has delivered some of my favorite Superman of all time. A good writer can deliver a great superman movie, without having to 'modernize' and 'update' the character to bring it into the new millenium. It's not about age, it's about writers who just have no idea what they are doing, what is needed, and what is wanted by the fanbase.

The key to success is word of mouth. That starts with the fanboys, because it is they who have been waiting, it is they who will scrutinize and judge the film. If that word is good, then it will trickle down to the GA.
Excellent post, you are dead on my friend. All this talk about changing the Williams score and what not is ridiculous. Anyone who thinks Superman is out dated, they live in a cave. Superman and the mystique of Superman is every freaking where. Hell I live in a small town of 75k people. I see Superman's sheild over trucks, cars, shirts, watches and I see tons of people with Superman tattoos. If you look at pro athletes NFL guys and NBA guys they sport the Superman crest. Hell tons of rappers and hip hop figures sport Superman.

You're right the story and Superman's VILLIANS is what will put the mover over the top. The thing I absolutely love about Nolan's Batman he got rid of the silly god forsaken camp!!!!!! I'm praying this movie doesn't have any campiness to it. Superman the movie would have been a perfect flawless film if Donner wasn't forced to direct Hackman's Luthor to be campy.

PLEASE GOD, LET THEM UTILIZE ZOD'S ABILITIES AND LOSE THE CAMPY BULL____T!

Obi Wan Kenobi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 08:39 PM   #147
GreenKToo
In the fire
 
GreenKToo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: In the fire.
Posts: 12,978
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

It's hard to say what they can do to ''fix'' superman. I really don't think he is broken tho, we are.
First thing imho is to make a kick azz film, and the rest will take care of its self.

__________________
“Turn to page 394.”
GreenKToo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2011, 01:07 PM   #148
Dr.
Scorpion-Kick
 
Dr.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,752
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi Wan Kenobi View Post
Excellent post, you are dead on my friend. All this talk about changing the Williams score and what not is ridiculous. Anyone who thinks Superman is out dated, they live in a cave. Superman and the mystique of Superman is every freaking where. Hell I live in a small town of 75k people. I see Superman's sheild over trucks, cars, shirts, watches and I see tons of people with Superman tattoos. If you look at pro athletes NFL guys and NBA guys they sport the Superman crest. Hell tons of rappers and hip hop figures sport Superman.
Yes. But pointing out Supes’ “mystique” and undeniable fame and ubiquity as an icon is somewhat irrelevant to the issue of creating interesting Superman stories (movies) that the general public will flock to see.

By the same token, Mickey Mouse is Disney’s famous icon. But how many blockbusters has Mickey starred in recently? Lately, the moneymakers have been characters called Ariel, Simba, Belle, Nemo and Woody and Buzz. Just insisting that Mickey is more famous doesn’t automatically mean he can carry a movie.

Likewise, the as a popular tattoo doesn’t bestow any particular advantage to a Superman movie. Supes (as a character in a story) has to earn his success on the big screen as if starting from square one – he’s not entitled to it because of his marketing prowess.

Also - "out dated" is a can of worms unless you define what you mean. James Bond has a clear character continuity within that franchise. But, just as clearly, he and his stories have evolved over time. Is that a bad thing?

Dr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2011, 01:28 PM   #149
The Batman
The Dark Knight
 
The Batman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Gotham City
Posts: 23,202
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

Batman is my favorite character and Cyclops is my favorite X-Man.

The problem with both Cyclops and Superman is that people buy into the idea that they're boring, even when there are interpretations of both that are not.

I would honestly say that the current version of Batman deserves to be more popular than the current version of Superman.

However, Wolverine usurping Cyclops in many things is just...wrong.

__________________
"There is a difference between you and me. We both looked into the abyss, but when it looked back at us... you blinked."
The Batman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2011, 01:41 PM   #150
socool
True
 
socool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 8,459
Default Re: how to get the non-fan / general public interested in MOS?

I count as General Public, don't I? The only Superman film I've ever seen was Returns. I do know the others are better, haha.

I think, the best way to make Superman "popular" (compared to Batman) is to make him vulnerable. My biggest problem with Superman is that only extra-terrestrial enemies, like Doomsday, or Kryptonite can hurt him. (Correct me if I'm wrong) I never felt any danger watching the films because I knew bullets would launch off his chest. It also closes the doors to many areas that Spidey and Batman can easily explore. Hell, that ANY hero can explore...except Superman. I know being invincible is a large part of Superman's character and many of you fans will probably riot upon the change, but if you want Superman to receive his share of the spotlight, you need to sacrifice his invincibility. A great movie would do a lot of help, too, but I can't see Snyder sticking around for a sequel, (Since he's never done a sequel) but there is a first for everything.

Case in point: I'll care for Superman when he can be hurt. Otherwise, just make a good movie and there should be no problem.

__________________
"A Man Remembers His Debts"
socool is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:53 PM.

monitoring_string = "dee460792f24517621e3ca080805de7e"



Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SuperHeroHype.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2017 All Rights Reserved.