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Old 08-07-2009, 05:21 PM   #101
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

I have nothing else to say. I already said that we agreed on this issue and if you think looking out for potential terrorists is the same government evil as looking out for healthcare reform dissent then I don't know what else to say.

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:23 PM   #102
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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I have nothing else to say. I already said that we agreed on this issue and if you think looking out for potential terrorists is the same government evil as looking out for healthcare reform dissent then I don't know what else to say.
I haven't seen any evidence of what you're claiming on the health care issue, but I remember very clearly what was going on with the "war on terror." Obama's big brother spying initiative is mainly the global warming farce and the continued "war on terror," not this health care thing. If you have actual examples that even compare to the Patriot Act, please provide them.

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:27 PM   #103
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

What the **** are you going on about???

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:30 PM   #104
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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What the **** are you going on about???
Provide proof that this alleged spying, invasion of privacy, destruction of civil liberties, etc. is going on in the health care debate. What I've seen so far is plenty of people speaking out and actually cutting off their local politicians and not letting them even answer the questions being asked. Are you referring to the SEIU incident? How can you link that to the federal government?

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:47 PM   #105
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

Do you not watch the news?



Also, with cash for clunkers, the wording on the web site was this:
Quote:
This application provides access to the DOT CARS system. When you logged on to the CARS system, your computer is considered a federal computer system and it is property of the United States Government. Any or all uses of this sytem and all files on this system may be intercepted, monitored, recorded, copied, audited, inspected, and disclosed to authorized CARS, DOT, and law enforcement personnel, as well as authorized officials of other agencies, both domestic and foreign.
They have since changed the wording.

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:50 PM   #106
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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Do you not watch the news?



Also, with cash for clunkers, the wording on the web site was this:

They have since changed the wording.
Actually I don't watch the news. And the cars thing isn't health care related is it? By the way, the war on civil liberties knows no shame. They will use any and all excuses to take our rights away.

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:53 PM   #107
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

The video is of healthcare

The CARS quote is just another example of our liberties being encroached upon.

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:56 PM   #108
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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The video is of healthcare

The CARS quote is just another example of our liberties being encroached upon.
Dude, like I said, I do not watch the news and I never said the video wasn't regarding health care so what's up with the sarcastic little smiley?

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Old 08-07-2009, 05:59 PM   #109
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

What's up with this sarcastic comment:

"And the cars thing isn't health care related is it?"

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"Since when has this been store policy?"
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And that is how Uncle Ben dies.
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Old 08-07-2009, 06:02 PM   #110
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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What's up with this sarcastic comment:

"And the cars thing isn't health care related is it?"
The cars thing, as in the quote you posted about the Cash for Clunkers.

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Old 08-07-2009, 06:56 PM   #111
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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I really don't mean to single you out on this, but this kind of mind set is just baffling to me. 9/11 and the immediate time afte was probably, in a lot of our life times, the single greatest display of mass fear being instilled into a society at their weakest point and then kicking them when they're down. There was no strength being shown, just a total collapse. Cashing in on fear and anger.

It stuns me that most Americans still fail to realize, after all this time, was Bush being at Ground Zero, being there with the rescue workers (who a lot of are now all slowly and painfully dying), it was a sham. Like the greatest Billy Mays paid advertisement of all time, the entire thing, we were all at our phones ready to order.

You're exactly right, he was everything we needed. It was him saying and showing exactly what we wanted and needed to see and hear and in the process we let the Constitution burn. But hey, at least no one could be accused of being unpatriotic right? We didn't dare question the government on that day. They knew best.

Oh but wait, we did get SOOO mad at him later, that's what made that up. That's what evened things up. His "approval rating" went down. Yeah, I'm sure that really kept him up at night. Yay we did it, we hate George Bush! It only took losing the Bill of Rights and bombing civilians! Oh. Well here's endless hours of guys like Larry King, Bill O'Reilly and Wolf Blitzer to tide us over until the next fake election and the three ring circus rolls back into town. Oh and hey what's that Saddam Hussein fellow up to these days? Still doesn't want to take on impossible loans again? Well that's too bad because in this game it's two strikes, not three, and you're out.

Everyone likes talking about "Oh the founding fathers wouldn't have done this, oh they wouldn't have done that to us". First of all, if you believe so highly of these founding fathers and what they wouldn't have done, what do you think their reaction would be to U.S citizens today that not only allowed, we essentially demanded the government to trample over what they fought so hard for and for what people say they believe so much in? That's the thing to talk about today, that's a hot topic, everyone likes to complain about them. My rights, your rights, her rights, gay rights, what's constitutional, what's not, it's all a joke.

When rights can taken away or denied to certain people for no reason, they were never rights in the first place. They were only privileges, something they allowed us to have for the time being and that can be waived at any time. We have no rights.

Well at least we got that great iconic picture of Bush at Ground Zero. And Bush in New Orlea...oh wait. Yeah there was nothing to cash in on that little incident.
You can single me out all you like Bob, but my opinion will not change.

When 9/11 happened, George W. Bush was everything this country needed him to be. He was strong, and he was human. For the president to stand on top of the rubble and declare to the world that 'we hear you, the people of this country hear you, and the people who did this will hear from ALL of us soon', it was bone-chilling. He handled the aftermath very well. We found out the Bin Laden was responsible and went to his home turf to find him.

All that being said, do not mistake my support for President Bush as a stamp of approval for everything following the war in Afghanistan. I said in my original post, and I will say it again - it is a shame that Bush destroyed all of those emotions and support.

If you have followed my comments in Politico even somewhat closely, you would know that I am not a fan of Bush. In the early days following 9/11 and the Afghanistan War, I fully supported the President. When he began to beat the drums of war in Iraq's direction, my support fell off.

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Old 08-07-2009, 07:18 PM   #112
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

Harvey Dent = Bush!?

But who is Batman!!!

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"You can leave a penny, you can't take a penny. You can leave a penny anytime. You have to spend $10 to take a penny. Store policy."
"Since when has this been store policy?"
"Uh, since my boss made up the policy. You gonna pay? You're holding up my line of one other person. You can't afford your milk, step aside. What, daddy didn't give you enough milk money? Little baby gonna cry about it? Just step aside."
And that is how Uncle Ben dies.
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Old 08-07-2009, 07:25 PM   #113
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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Harvey Dent = Bush!?

But who is Batman!!!
*puts on cape*
ME!

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Old 08-07-2009, 11:45 PM   #114
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You can single me out all you like Bob, but my opinion will not change.

When 9/11 happened, George W. Bush was everything this country needed him to be. He was strong, and he was human. For the president to stand on top of the rubble and declare to the world that 'we hear you, the people of this country hear you, and the people who did this will hear from ALL of us soon', it was bone-chilling. He handled the aftermath very well. We found out the Bin Laden was responsible and went to his home turf to find him.

All that being said, do not mistake my support for President Bush as a stamp of approval for everything following the war in Afghanistan. I said in my original post, and I will say it again - it is a shame that Bush destroyed all of those emotions and support.

If you have followed my comments in Politico even somewhat closely, you would know that I am not a fan of Bush. In the early days following 9/11 and the Afghanistan War, I fully supported the President. When he began to beat the drums of war in Iraq's direction, my support fell off.
I believe you when you say you aren't a fan of his. That's not what I was trying to infer. EVERYONE fully supported the President after 9/11, because he said and did exactly what everyone who was afraid and confused wanted to hear. And we all were angry, we were all scared. It's a natural reaction to something like that. And they pounced on it and milked it for everything it was worth. A pretext for two wars came out of that day, and things still don't add up on exactly what happened.

But nope, the government said it was those guys over there, so we gotta go git em'! We gotta get on our horse and go kill those bastards. And that was good enough for us. We wanted something to be done right then and there, no matter the cost. And that's exactly what happened. Never mind their "official" version of what happened wasn't released until YEARS later, and of course it just happened to come to the same conclusion that "Yep it was guys in caves who did this". And thank god, because if not we would have been over there killing and ruining lives of people for no reason. Whew! That's a relief. Not sure if we could live with knowing that.

We didn't question him or the government. And now because of that, hundreds of thousands of innocent people, little kids, babies, have been killed. I really don't think most people, including myself, can truly understand the scale of which we completely destroyed people's families and lives in these wars. The only thing that separates you and me from being one of those people is just sheer luck of birth location. Thousands of American troops have been killed or injured, and for what? A "War on Terror"? That is a never ending war. And war is the best business to be in, as long as you aren't in the trenches. American troops aren't over there fighting for us, they're fighting for corporations.


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Old 08-08-2009, 12:03 AM   #115
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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And war is the best business to be in, as long as you aren't in the trenches. American troops aren't over there fighting for us, they're fighting for corporations.
Bingo. Follow the money. International banking cartel has gained a ton of wealth and power by funding both sides of many wars going back hundreds of years.

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Old 08-08-2009, 12:58 AM   #116
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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I believe you when you say you aren't a fan of his. That's not what I was trying to infer. EVERYONE fully supported the President after 9/11, because he said and did exactly what everyone who was afraid and confused wanted to hear. And we all were angry, we were all scared. It's a natural reaction to something like that. And they pounced on it and milked it for everything it was worth. A pretext for two wars came out of that day, and things still don't add up on exactly what happened.
What exactly would you have had Bush do? Barricade himself in the Oval Office and not say a single word to the American people to addresss the worst attack on the continental United States in history? Afghanistan was completely justified, in my view.

Quote:
But nope, the government said it was those guys over there, so we gotta go git em'! We gotta get on our horse and go kill those bastards. And that was good enough for us. We wanted something to be done right then and there, no matter the cost. And that's exactly what happened. Never mind their "official" version of what happened wasn't released until YEARS later, and of course it just happened to come to the same conclusion that "Yep it was guys in caves who did this". And thank god, because if not we would have been over there killing and ruining lives of people for no reason. Whew! That's a relief. Not sure if we could live with knowing that.

We didn't question him or the government. And now because of that, hundreds of thousands of innocent people, little kids, babies, have been killed. I really don't think most people, including myself, can truly understand the scale of which we completely destroyed people's families and lives in these wars. The only thing that separates you and me from being one of those people is just sheer luck of birth location. Thousands of American troops have been killed or injured, and for what? A "War on Terror"? That is a never ending war. And war is the best business to be in, as long as you aren't in the trenches. American troops aren't over there fighting for us, they're fighting for corporations.
There are always casualties in war Bob. Does that make it right? Absolutely not. The fact is that President Bush took his eye off the ball when he abandoned the search for Bin Laden to take on Iraq. There's really no disputing that.

...but I think this thread has been hijacked enough by President Bush...so how 'bout President Obama???

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Old 08-08-2009, 02:45 AM   #117
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Same deal, different face, different language. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. In a system as corrupt as this, the so called changing over of power every 4-8 years is meaningless. Makes little to no difference. They're going to do what they want, they just go about it in different ways, word things a little differently.

And what would I have Bush do? Well that's a loaded question, because in this system the president isn't the most powerful person. That's what they make him out to be, but he's not. But disregarding that let's play pretend and say he is and that he does have control and real power over what's going to happen.

And also let's say the laws of physics can be disregarded for that day as well and three things that have never happened before or since occurred genuinely by.....magic I guess. What would I have him do? Well I wouldn't have him sign into law something like (the hilariously named) Patriot Act. Again, playing pretend, if we actually had rights, I wouldn't have him throw them out the window for an opportunity to wield more power and control over people. I wouldn't have the government prey on us when we are at our weakest. Unfortunately, that's a fairy tale world, because that's the formula.

Out of crisis and disaster is when we are most at risk as it presents opportunity, the more willing we are able to accept things like the Patriot Act because at that time we see it as the government trying to do something that protects us, when it's the complete opposite. Just look right now with Obama and the economic crisis and health care cluster****. It's going to be the same thing again and again and again. People are starting to get a little smarter, but they don't know the half of it.


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Old 08-08-2009, 02:46 AM   #118
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double post

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Old 08-08-2009, 02:58 AM   #119
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

The two party system is incredibly flawed and it makes me feel hopeless

First step we need is campaign finance reform. Then we need to enact media fairness during the election. They already have it but that seemed to go in the toilet in the last election when everyone but Fox News supported Obama/Biden. Lastly, a good third party needs to be established and become a huge factor in this country. Independents aren't the largest group in this country but we are the swing vote for every election. If a good third party candidate could bring in right winged Democrats and left wing Republicans then I think a third party could be a real force in 2020 and maybe even in 2016.

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"Since when has this been store policy?"
"Uh, since my boss made up the policy. You gonna pay? You're holding up my line of one other person. You can't afford your milk, step aside. What, daddy didn't give you enough milk money? Little baby gonna cry about it? Just step aside."
And that is how Uncle Ben dies.
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Old 08-08-2009, 03:10 AM   #120
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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The two party system is incredibly flawed and it makes me feel hopeless

First step we need is campaign finance reform. Then we need to enact media fairness during the election. They already have it but that seemed to go in the toilet in the last election when everyone but Fox News supported Obama/Biden. Lastly, a good third party needs to be established and become a huge factor in this country. Independents aren't the largest group in this country but we are the swing vote for every election. If a good third party candidate could bring in right winged Democrats and left wing Republicans then I think a third party could be a real force in 2020 and maybe even in 2016.
I agree on campaign finance reform being the key. Obama was bought and paid for by the bankers just like the guy who signed the Federal Reserve Act into law, Woodrow Wilson and the man who brought the bill to Congress in the first place, Senator Nelson Aldrich (who actually joined the Rockefeller family through marriage). Wilson later admitted with regret after his presidency that he'd handed the country over to a few very powerful people.

I also agree on the media, though in my opinion we need something pretty radical to turn this problem around. Like when Standard Oil was busted up by the Supreme Court, we need the media conglomerate corporations busted up in a similar fashion. Only then will we begin to get a little honest reporting from "mainstream" sources. As it stands, we have a few corporations controlling a vast majority of the information that is presented to us. Centralization is the key in media manipulation, just like buying off politicians in both parties leads to more centralization of political power. If the game is rigged where the politicians and media are both owned by the same small group of people, then the American Public is getting the shaft. We are not living in a Democratic Republic. More like an oligarchy.


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Old 08-08-2009, 03:22 AM   #121
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

The best thing we can hope for right now is that the Democratic party will cause a fringe group that is tired of their hardcore liberal bias and pool in with the Independents. The republicans already did that and lost a lot of members.

We won't get any type of reform until a third party candidate is elected to the White House because a third party won't control congress or the senate any time soon.

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"Since when has this been store policy?"
"Uh, since my boss made up the policy. You gonna pay? You're holding up my line of one other person. You can't afford your milk, step aside. What, daddy didn't give you enough milk money? Little baby gonna cry about it? Just step aside."
And that is how Uncle Ben dies.
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Old 08-08-2009, 08:22 AM   #122
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What exactly would you have had Bush do? Barricade himself in the Oval Office and not say a single word to the American people to addresss the worst attack on the continental United States in history? Afghanistan was completely justified, in my view.
Not that I disagree, but the way the plan was initated was poor. It was never a response to an attack on American soil, it was a plan to get into Iraq. You've got a "war on terror" that gives the US carte blanche to just tread over any old country and disrespect their sovereignty. That's never justified. Spreading democracy isn't justifiable really.

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...but I think this thread has been hijacked enough by President Bush...so how 'bout President Obama???
How do you feel about his current actions in Afghanistan and Iraq?

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Agreed Walrus.
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Old 08-08-2009, 08:22 AM   #123
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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The best thing we can hope for right now is that the Democratic party will cause a fringe group that is tired of their hardcore liberal bias and pool in with the Independents. The republicans already did that and lost a lot of members.

We won't get any type of reform until a third party candidate is elected to the White House because a third party won't control congress or the senate any time soon.
Ron Paul in 2012.

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Agreed Walrus.
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Old 08-08-2009, 10:21 AM   #124
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

He'll (Ron Paul) run again, if he's on an alternative ticket (which I doubt)he will help get Obama back in office whether we want him there or not....

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Old 08-08-2009, 10:40 AM   #125
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Default Re: The President Obama Thread: Version 3.0

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I guess we'll have to wait and see. I think its to early for him to be making such a bold statement. Just an opinion.
I dunno, I mean if you look at where we were when he came to office...clearly things are better.

But, Michael Steele would have you believe it was a miracle. Nothing more.

And with all these attacks on Obama's character...calling him a Nazi, saying he's Adolf Hitler, saying he's running labor camps, saying he's going to ration ****, saying he's "killing" OUR America, that he's not an American citizen and shouldn't be President, saying he's friends with terrorists, saying he's going to perform euthanasia on American citizens...

suddenly, the "crazy nut" who ends up assassinating a politician doesn't sound as "nuts" to me anymore, but sounds like the logical conclusion if that person BELIEVES everything he's taking in.

Just a thought.

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